Yacht Registration in Langkawi?

[fxykty]

If you’re AUS registered you need an AUS maritime ship station license and call sign (if you have MF/HF equipment). This needs to be renewed and paid for annually. You also must have an MMSI if you have DSC equipment VHF or MF/HF or AIS transceiver. I don’t know what the one-off or ongoing costs are for either Australian ship’s station license or MMSI.

With our UK registry we get all that for free from OFCOM. Makes the ongoing costs only once per ten years for the ship’s registration only.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by fxykty

You need an MMSI - it is illegal to operate a ship’s radio station without a MMSI. People do go without a MMSI (our previous owner did so) but you can get in serious trouble in any country with a Coast Guard if you make a radio call and don’t provide a call sign that they can match against a MMSI.

That's news to me. Can you cite legislation to that effect?

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by StuM

That's news to me. Can you cite legislation to that effect?

Check the maritime safety authority in the country of your ship registration - it may vary. But I looked at UK, NZ, AU and CA and they all say the same. Unless you’re not going to another country, in that case you may be exempt.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by StuM

That's news to me. Can you cite legislation to that effect?

News to me as well
Have had a marine radio licence in Australia for 30 years and not a cent paid in fees.
Epirb has mmsi as we'll and no charges there either.

[Alan Mighty]

Originally Posted by fxykty

If you’re AUS registered you need an AUS maritime ship station license and call sign (if you have MF/HF equipment). This needs to be renewed and paid for annually.

True. My s/v Led Myne has a ship's station licence for her MF/HF radio. That gives her a VM***** callsign. Anf I pay $A44 a year for that.

Originally Posted by fxykty

You also must have an MMSI if you have DSC equipment VHF or MF/HF or AIS transceiver.

Hmm .... a lot of recreational boats have DSC VHF transceivers and have never programmed a MMSI into the transceiver. At least in Moreton Bay, few recreational boaters use the DSC features.

An AIS transceiver or marine EPIRB should be programmed with a MMSI.

Different jurisdictions have different rules and regulations.

In Aus, most boaters using VHF have some sort of certification (which people refer to as a 'license' colloquially). In Aus, I think only 27 MHz marine radio doesn't require some sort of certification (I'm not sure, it's decades since I had 27 Meg gear).

For the VHF operator's certification, Aus'ns only need pay a small examination fee. And they use either their boat's name or a number given by a volunteer search and rescue organisation (such as the Aus volunteer coast guard) as their call sign.

And the MMSI can be gained free of charge.

Malaysia is different. From memory, because it's years since we used Malaysia as our cruising base, a Malaysian registered boat has to pay RM60 for an MMSI to the Malaysian Media and Communications Authority (the SKMM). See: https://www.mcmc.gov.my/faqs/spectru...t-is-the-purpo and https://www.skmm.gov.my/resources/gu...n-maritime-mob. Malaysia has different internal security problems to Aus, so its procedures concerning radio broadcasting are different. For that matter, Singapore also has heavier than Australian regulation of what radio equipment residents can have.

Late addition: and let's for argument say that someone, say Simi 60, took a boat out of Aus and registered her on the Langkawi International Yacht Registry. To get a Malaysian MMSI, one with MID prefix 533 instead of Australia's MID of 503, Simi 60 would have to hand to the SKMM (or MMCA if you prefer the Bahasa Inggeris abbreviation) his Aus MMSI paperwork, apply to the SKMM for a Malaysian MMSI, and then have his AIS (because he'd need one to enter Singapore, Indonesian, and Phuket waters), EPIRB, and (if using DSC functions of his VHF transceiver) reprogrammed. For some of that gear, such as many DSC VHF transceivers, that would require sending the transceiver to a manufacturer's service centre. Good luck finding one of those in Malaysia!

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by Alan Mighty

Late addition: and let's for argument say that someone, say Simi 60, took a boat out of Aus and registered her on the Langkawi International Yacht Registry. To get a Malaysian MMSI, one with MID prefix 533 instead of Australia's MID of 503, Simi 60 would have to hand to the SKMM (or MMCA if you prefer the Bahasa Inggeris abbreviation) his Aus MMSI paperwork, apply to the SKMM for a Malaysian MMSI, and then have his AIS (because he'd need one to enter Singapore, Indonesian, and Phuket waters), EPIRB, and (if using DSC functions of his VHF transceiver) reprogrammed. For some of that gear, such as many DSC VHF transceivers, that would require sending the transceiver to a manufacturer's service centre. Good luck finding one of those in Malaysia!

And I take it if I just had AUS reg none of that applies, that's it, done and dusted?

[StuM]

Originally Posted by fxykty

Check the maritime safety authority in the country of your ship registration - it may vary. But I looked at UK, NZ, AU and CA and they all say the same. Unless you’re not going to another country, in that case you may be exempt.

Can you please provide your Australian Link.

According to AMSA:

"You are required to apply for an MMSI if you have the following equipment:

• fixed very high frequency (VHF) radio with digital selective calling (DSC)
• a handheld VHF DSC
• high frequency (HF) DSC
• automatic identification system (AIS)"

[Alan Mighty]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

And I take it if I just had AUS reg none of that applies, that's it, done and dusted?

Seriously? You must be joking, Simi 60.

I'm know you don't believe everything you read on the internet. So why would you expect an answer on which you could rely by asking anonymous entities on an internet forum?

Originally Posted by Simi 60

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

Do your own research!

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by StuM

Can you please provide your Australian Link.

According to AMSA:

"You are required to apply for an MMSI if you have the following equipment:

• fixed very high frequency (VHF) radio with digital selective calling (DSC)
• a handheld VHF DSC
• high frequency (HF) DSC
• automatic identification system (AIS)"

I was writing generically about the varying requirements to have a ship station license, a personal or ship call sign, and a MMSI. Those are three separate things. Then there’s the issue of vessel registration, which generally determines your radio requirements.

For internal use only (no international voyages) the rules are much more relaxed to the point of exemptions. But for international voyaging there are generally quite strict requirements for all three radio requirements, as most countries are party to international agreements and the airways are jealously guarded.

Some jurisdictions, such as Langkawi, charge quite a bit, while others, such as UK, charge nothing. AU and CA are somewhere in between. Those are the four jurisdictions I checked when researching ship and radio registration last year.

In addition to radio, there are lots of safety requirements that apply to registered vessels, applied by the country of registration, such as fire, life saving, etc.

How closely any of this is inspected when away from that country I don’t know, probably not very. So I’m not worried about getting caught for not having the correct number of buckets with lanyards and not having the liferaft my vessel is required to have. But the state of a vessel’s and operator’s radio licensing is something that more developed countrys’ maritime authorities care about - I made a VHF call in NZ recently to relay a Pan Pan call and didn’t include my call sign. A few minutes later once the Pan Pan was handled Maritime NZ called me directly and asked for my call sign. I don’t know what they would have done if I didn’t have one. And you can usually use an overseas operators licence, but some places may want you to have their operator’s license.

Regarding MMSIs, they are usually free and MUST be obtained from your vessel’s country of registration. If you have an EPIRB you definitely want to have a properly registered MMSI, if you want to be rescued in a timely way. Then you register the EPIRB with either your ship’s country of registration or your local authority or the locality of your EPIRB.

Getting the MMSI reprogrammed in VHF, SSB, or AIS is not expensive - we paid $45 NZ to the local iCOM plus courier for all three devices. Had to remove them from the boat, but that was a good start in getting to know the boat’s systems. Only need MMSI for radios if they have DSC. Otherwise it’s not used nor needed.

I’m not pretending to be an authority here and am not telling anyone what to do. I’m simply relaying my direct personal experience. It’s up to each person to decide how much they do to become compliant with the laws and/or regulations that apply to them and their vessel.

[Alan Mighty]

Originally Posted by fxykty

you can get in serious trouble in any country with a Coast Guard if you make a radio call and don’t provide a call sign that they can match against a MMSI.

That's an interesting assertion. I've taken a while to think about it.

Let's take the example of Australia. ACMA, the telecomms regulator of the Australian govt does give its MMSI database to the International Telecoms Union.

You (or anyone) can search the AMCA's MMSI database. Similarly, you can search the ITU MMSI database. When you do so, you easily can discover errors. My s/v Led Myne is on the AMCA MMSI database. But because of perhaps the year (a long time back) I registered her MMSI or the way that ACMA has (not well) managed its database, Led Myne's MMSI does not show up on the ITU database.

No doubt the telecoms regulators in any other jurisdiction, such as the SKMM in Malaysia, could search either or both of the ACMA database or the ITU database if I or any Aus registered vessel/ship broadcast in Malaysian waters.

As noted earlier, in Aus, only vessels with a Ship's Station Licence have a 'real' callsign, as for example Led Myne has with her VM***** callsign. That's only for vessels that pay $44 a year and that's only required for vessels with HF/MF transceivers (the requirement for VHF ship stations was dropped decades ago).

Have a Captain Cook at what you see when you search the ACMA MMSI database. I've attached a fragment, showing vessels registered in my home state of QLD.

Column 1 is the MMSI;
Col 2 tells whether the vessel is SOLAS (i.e. >300 tonnes displacement) or not;
Col 3 is the registered name of the vessel;
Col 4 is the 'callsign" - for some "To Be Announced", for others a dinkum Ship's Station callsign (VJ*, VM*, VN* etc), for other without a dinkum callsign, the name of the vessel or whatever;
Col 5 is the state of the Aus federation in which the vessel was when it gained the MMSI;
Col 6 is the Official Number on the Aus Shipping Registry (if it has one, only for vessels on the register of course); and
Col 7 is the vessel's QLD registration alphanumeric.

I'm disposed to think that a jurisdiction could go to the trouble of searching and, if no legit callsign etc were found, to fine, compound, or prosecute. I have heard of ACMA tracing down radio interference and radio nuisance complaints to their source. And I'm sure that, say, Malaysian authorities or US NSA authorities would follow radio transmissions used in terrorism to their source. I'm just not sure that the MMSI database would play much of a part.

See AU QLD MMSI fragment.jpg. I tried to chose part of the database that does NOT include any CF user known to me. Apologies if I failed.

[Alan Mighty]

Originally Posted by Alan Mighty

Let's take the example of Australia. ACMA, the telecomms regulator of the Australian govt does give its MMSI database to the International Telecoms Union.

You (or anyone) can search the AMCA's MMSI database. Similarly, you can search the ITU MMSI database. When you do so, you easily can discover errors. My s/v Led Myne is on the AMCA MMSI database. But because of perhaps the year (a long time back) I registered her MMSI or the way that ACMA has (not well) managed its database, Led Myne's MMSI does not show up on the ITU database.

Ouch! I was in error. Sorry.

The public MMSI database in Australia is maintained by AMSA, the Aus Maritime Safety Authority, not ACMA (the communications authority).

So I'm wrong to suggest that ACMA has not well managed the MMSI database. And I do not know who, AMCA or AMSA, forwards the Australian MMSI data to the ITU.

You can interrogate the AMSA MMSI database for yourself at:

https://www.operations.amsa.gov.au/mmsisearch/

And the ITU MMSI database is at:

https://www.itu.int/mmsapp/ShipStation/list

[IslandHopper]

Just one small point to add....

If you are an Australian vessel with an MMSI number and the vessel is an Australian Registered Ship, you will show up in the ITU database...

If you are an Australian vessel with an MMSI number and the vessel is not an Australian Registered Ship, you will not show up in the ITU database...

Hint 1: Just run the vessels through the AMSA/ITU databases on the attachment that Alan Mighty supplied in post #40, easy to see which are Aus registered and which are only state (QLD) registered....

Hint 2: Vessel "Psycho Puss" is Aus registered....

[rogerringger]

hi
I would like to go sailing for a few days in Langkawi or somewhere in Thailand. Just as a crew member to gain some more experiance. Does anybody know somebody who has his yacht around there and would be happy to make a short trip with a paying crew mwmber?