Cut mast in half???

[The Yacht Rigger]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Splices are usually made by inserting a sleeve, that fits exactly inside the extrusion, and is secured to each section of the mast with stainless fasteners.
Seldén, for instance, ships its extrusions [from Sweden] in 40-foot containers [for cost and protection reasons], so any Seldén mast, supplied in North America, over 40 feet in length, will have a factory splice [nearer the base].
It’s an engineered joint, best designed [including exactly where to place it*] with professional advice.*

I didn’t see any splice sleeves, in Seldén’s catalogue, however ...
Seldén Yacht product catalogue ➥ https://support.seldenmast.com/files.../595-808-E.pdf

See also:
Reassembly of spliced Conventional mast ➥ https://www.catalinadirect.com/image...95A0898DCCD786

* Seldén contacts ➥ https://www.seldenmast.com/contact-us/

Seldén Mast AB, Sweden
Tel: +46 (0) 31 69 69 00
Email: info@seldenmast.com

Seldén Mast Inc, USA
Tel: +1 843-760-6278
Email: info@seldenus.com

* According to Pierre Gutelle, mast sleeves should be placed 25% of spreader spacing, above or under any spreader.

While this is very much doable, it needs to be done right, and will be expensive. Several thousand dollars for a good splice. You'll need a good fabricator with a brake and you need to get the rivet/fastener pattern correct.
It's a lot of work to actually do the splice too, and we usually use some sort of bonding agent to make it extra secure, epoxy or sealant, to prevent any movement once the splice is done. So taking it apart isn't an easy task. Then there's all the electrical connections, ensuring the halyards aren't tangled, lining up conduit, etc.

[Shrew]

Originally Posted by massnspace

My wife and I are considering buying an older sailboat to do the great loop in. We are sailors, so not interested in the trawler thing…..

I would suggest not doing the Great Loop. There are little options to sail. It is going to be primarily motoring. Motoring in a trawler will be much more comfortable.

If you don't trust shipping the mast, then drop it, store it, and pick it up when arrive back at the beginning of your trip.

The 28 powercat in your signature would be better suited.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

So you're sailors?
In doing the Great Loop how much of the time can you actually be under sail?
2%? 5%?
The draft, the lack of space, the slow speeds under power, the limited tankage for water/fuel, and being relegated to sitting in a space deficient little cockpit, a stupid mast/boom with all the claptrap and supports and rigging and sails hanging all over the boat,, give yourself a break.
In reality using a smaller sailboat for that trip seems an exercise in machismo.
Don't like Trawlers?
Get a Sam Devlin boat.
https://devlinboat.com/black-crown-30/

The main reason people use a sailboat for the Great Loop is fuel cost. There is a prominent author who has a web site and books that promote this approach (https://www.captainjohn.org/).

As Ann correctly points out upthread, it is not ordinarily practical to sail on the rivers, though it can be done under favorable conditions. I offer you this video of going through downtown St. Paul under full sail. But much (most?) of the great loop is not rivers. It is the Great Lakes (which are wonderful for sailing) and the intracoastal waterways (which are OK for sailing but perhaps not great).

https://youtu.be/_vCW44vCyWM?si=_F2JAP6x2vfI0fwS

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by massnspace

When you say you “did the trip”, you did the whole loop? Down the Mississippi?

Also, were you charged for a 52’ or 38’ boat when docking? And was it hard to find a 52’ (or longer) place to stay? We plan on stopping a lot to see things and don’t always want to try to get a 50-60’ slip just for a day or two….

I also think it probable that other people will damage the mast by running into it while trying to dock in front of back of you when on a linear dock...if it’s sticking out 8’ on each end….

Might want to take a look at the docking situation in the specific areas where you'll have the mast down. You may find that you are along a wall along the bank in many cases and that it's not particularly crowded. I understand that the Erie Canal, for example, has quite a number of free docks that are not heavily used (I've never been there).

[massnspace]

Originally Posted by Shrew

I would suggest not doing the Great Loop. There are little options to sail. It is going to be primarily motoring. Motoring in a trawler will be much more comfortable.

If you don't trust shipping the mast, then drop it, store it, and pick it up when arrive back at the beginning of your trip.

The 28 powercat in your signature would be better suited.

Thank you for determining our 3+ year itinerary, even though I didn’t ask….

We will be doing the loop. In a sailboat. Just trying to find the right boat and methods.

You are wholly incorrect about the sailable parts of the trip. The entire US east coast, the Bahamas (which we plan to add on), the entire Great Lake region, and the entire gulf side of Florida and the Florida Keys are excellent sailing grounds. I cannot imagine sitting in a trawler hour after hour with the motor on burning fuel when the wind is blowing right outside the windows….

As for my custom power cat. It is a great boat for us here in Seattle. We use it all the time. But it would be very very expensive to ship (beam is over the 14’ limit) and it was never designed to carry the much larger loads we will need for a multi year trip. But thanks anyway for suggesting it!

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by The Yacht Rigger

While this is very much doable, it needs to be done right, and will be expensive. Several thousand dollars for a good splice. You'll need a good fabricator with a brake and you need to get the rivet/fastener pattern correct.
It's a lot of work to actually do the splice too, and we usually use some sort of bonding agent to make it extra secure, epoxy or sealant, to prevent any movement once the splice is done. So taking it apart isn't an easy task. Then there's all the electrical connections, ensuring the halyards aren't tangled, lining up conduit, etc.

You are correct. I had the mast sleeved on my Passport 47. It was a few thousand dollars 24 years ago and was part of a very expensive complete rig rebuild,or it would have been more. The rigging company on the Chesapeake searched for a mast remnant of my extrusion, found one luckily and shipped it from the West COast. They modified it to fit closely inside my mast. They used structural epoxy between the sleeve and the mast and probably 100 fastners, not just rivets, joining it.
They were a rigger which was used to customizing masts, including tapering them, for the racing crowd.

The OP should consider finding a Freedom unstayed rig boat for his trip.

[s/v Jedi]

I have sailed a 30 foot sloop that could easily lower it’s mast without help. I think this will work for a 36’ boat as well.

[massnspace]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I have sailed a 30 foot sloop that could easily lower it’s mast without help. I think this will work for a 36’ boat as well.

Please detail how you easily lowered the mast without any help….I’m interested….

[Scrimshaw4]

What about buying a trawler, do the Loop, sell it when you're back and then get a sailboat? Just a thought

[Uncle G]

A gaff-rigged boat with a deck-stepped mast in a tabernacle would probably have a mast no longer than the length of the boat. And it would be easy to lower without outside help - if the chainplates were set up to facilitate that.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by massnspace

Please detail how you easily lowered the mast without any help….I’m interested….

I am not familiar with the English terms for the parts used so I’m hoping a native English speaker with the knowledge will come along

We had two booms that were hinged on each side deck at the capshroud location. The forward ends could be attached to each other with a stainless plate in between that also attached the forestay at the top, and a block and tackle under. The block and tackle was also connected to the forestay chainplate and these two booms provided the leverage for lowering and raising the mast.

On the aft deck a gallows to receive the mast. When we hauled it forward, we simply put on on the pullpit with a fender in between, then tied it all securely.

In Dutch we called these booms “goat legs”. The mast must be stepped in a tabernacle so that it is hinged.

[massnspace]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I am not familiar with the English terms for the parts used so I’m hoping a native English speaker with the knowledge will come along

We had two booms that were hinged on each side deck at the capshroud location. The forward ends could be attached to each other with a stainless plate in between that also attached the forestay at the top, and a block and tackle under. The block and tackle was also connected to the forestay chainplate and these two booms provided the leverage for lowering and raising the mast.

On the aft deck a gallows to receive the mast. When we hauled it forward, we simply put on on the pullpit with a fender in between, then tied it all securely.

In Dutch we called these booms “goat legs”. The mast must be stepped in a tabernacle so that it is hinged.

Well of course a tabernacle-stepped mast could (maybe) do this safely. But no boats I have looked at have a tabernacle. And some are even keel-stepped…..crane!

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by massnspace

Well of course a tabernacle-stepped mast could (maybe) do this safely. But no boats I have looked at have a tabernacle. And some are even keel-stepped…..crane!

Then you simply have to refine your selection to deck stepped designs.

You can not have keel stepped and lower/raise yourself as you go.

[massnspace]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

So you're sailors?
In doing the Great Loop how much of the time can you actually be under sail?
2%? 5%?
The draft, the lack of space, the slow speeds under power, the limited tankage for water/fuel, and being relegated to sitting in a space deficient little cockpit, a stupid mast/boom with all the claptrap and supports and rigging and sails hanging all over the boat,, give yourself a break.
In reality using a smaller sailboat for that trip seems an exercise in machismo.
Don't like Trawlers?
Get a Sam Devlin boat.
https://devlinboat.com/black-crown-30/

Not sure why you think a sailboat would only sail 2% of the time…..? I did a trip a few years back from Maine to Key West and we sailed a majority of the way….NOT in the ICW but coastal when the weather window was good. And I would sail the Great Lakes all the way…..and eastern FL. And the Keys. And Bahamas. I cannot imagine doing all this in a trawler blowing out exhaust and noise…..

and when (when, not if) a component of the propulsion system fails I can just sail in….no real need to get a long tow like in a trawler….

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I am not familiar with the English terms for the parts used so I’m hoping a native English speaker with the knowledge will come along

We had two booms that were hinged on each side deck at the capshroud location. The forward ends could be attached to each other with a stainless plate in between that also attached the forestay at the top[...]

Typically the assembly as a whole is, in English, called a gin pole. There are variations on this where the lateral stabilization is provided by cables or ropes and the vertical lift by a single pole (boom as you call it).



Traditional English river boats on the Norfolk Broads use a tabernacle with a lead counterweight that extends below decks to allow the rig to be struck easily to pass under bridges. It is used in conjunction with tall rigs to catch the wind on rivers where obstructions on shore twist and weaken the wind closer to the water. Wish these boats were more widely copied in the USA. One of these days I'll spend a week or two in the Broads to sail one and see what they're really like.