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Old 09-12-2020, 12:19   #1
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Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Hello,
Steering on my Seaward 26 RK seems too loose, I need to turn the wheel probably 30 degrees before rudder starts to move in opposite direction. I went down and took the pictures of how cables are connected to the rudder. Can anyone tell if this is a correct setup or not? Does anyone have the pictures?
How I can tension the cables? What is correct tension for this type of the steering system.
I had to disconnect one cable anyway because I am replacing the rubber boot. Thanks.
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33056.jpg
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33053.jpg
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33054.jpg
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33055.jpg
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Old 09-12-2020, 13:03   #2
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

I would install a splined wheel or lever on the shaft say 3 to six inches in radius. Then attach the cables to the wheel/lever. My guess is that originally there was such a wheel/lever on that shaft. The current system does not look robust to my eye.
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Old 09-12-2020, 14:02   #3
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparx View Post
I would install a splined wheel or lever on the shaft say 3 to six inches in radius. Then attach the cables to the wheel/lever. My guess is that originally there was such a wheel/lever on that shaft. The current system does not look robust to my eye.
My problem is not that current setup is not robust but rather that I cannot tension it easily given the confined working space. Not sure of you noticed there is sliding tube over the rudder's shaft to which cables are attached now.

I do not understand exactly splined wheel idea. Can you make quick sketch?

Thanks
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Old 09-12-2020, 14:05   #4
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Quote:
Originally Posted by facciatosta View Post
Hello,
Steering on my Seaward 26 RK seems too loose, I need to turn the wheel probably 30 degrees before rudder starts to move in opposite direction. I went down and took the pictures of how cables are connected to the rudder. Can anyone tell if this is a correct setup or not? Does anyone have the pictures?
How I can tension the cables? What is correct tension for this type of the steering system.
I had to disconnect one cable anyway because I am replacing the rubber boot. Thanks.
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33056.jpg
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33053.jpg
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33054.jpg
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...cture33055.jpg

I have to agree with Sparx.

I have no idea how you could tension that up and I wonder how it works at all!

Maybe people here could help?

https://forums.sailboatowners.com/th...re.1249923079/


https://www.sailnet.com/threads/lift...trouble.96643/
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Old 09-12-2020, 14:31   #5
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

For the comments on the splined wheel, I think other posters are assuming this is a rudder shaft that turns. I believe it is a rudder tiller that exits the back of the boat through a rubber seal and is connected to a rudder cassette?



Sliding the connector in/out along the tiller increases/decreases the leverage on the tiller. A normal quadrant or splined wheel is not used. Just needs a better attachment to the tiller.

Normally there would be an eye bolt between the chain and the cable inside the steering pedestal. Pull the cables tight at the tiller and fasten them as best they can be fastened (certainly better than what your pictures show). Then tension the cables where they connect to the chain. The difficulty here is getting to that connection in the pedestal, usually somewhere near impossible.

Option B is to install an eye bolt or turnbuckle on the tiller, then connect the cable to that and use it to tension things (you only need to tension from one side although sometimes two is easier). The problem with this scenario is there has to be room to fit the tensioning device when the tiller is hard over, and from one of the pictures it doesn't look like there is enough room.
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Old 09-12-2020, 14:42   #6
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Maybe use one of these?


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Old 09-12-2020, 15:09   #7
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

I like coopec43's device

Here's a picture of how it is normally done with a quadrant on a rudder post, just so you can see the eye bolt tensioning. In the tiller case you probably want a turnbuckle so it can flex at both ends.

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Old 09-12-2020, 16:10   #8
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsanduril View Post
For the comments on the splined wheel, I think other posters are assuming this is a rudder shaft that turns. I believe it is a rudder tiller that exits the back of the boat through a rubber seal and is connected to a rudder cassette?

Option B is to install an eye bolt or turnbuckle on the tiller, then connect the cable to that and use it to tension things (you only need to tension from one side although sometimes two is easier). The problem with this scenario is there has to be room to fit the tensioning device when the tiller is hard over, and from one of the pictures it doesn't look like there is enough room.
You are absolutely correct. It is a rudder tiller. Yes, I could add eye bolt on one side but there is not enough room when tiller is hard over. There other option is to drill through the tiller and use short eye bolt. But it can be done only in the shop with proper equipment. I would have to disassemble the whole thing and find the shop too.
I think this was an intention of the design to make tiller longer and provide better leverage on the rudder. Just wonder if there is indeed some tensioning inside of the pedestal.
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Old 09-12-2020, 16:43   #9
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

I wonder if the design for this is to slide the bracket toward the rudder and make up the cables snug. Then slide the bracket forward along the tiller to pull the cables tighter, then lock the bracket in place with a setscrew? I can't see the turning points for the cable so hard to know if sliding the bracket along the tiller will allow you to get tension in the cables if they are made up snug at the shortest point.
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Old 09-12-2020, 18:09   #10
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

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Originally Posted by Dsanduril View Post
I wonder if the design for this is to slide the bracket toward the rudder and make up the cables snug. Then slide the bracket forward along the tiller to pull the cables tighter, then lock the bracket in place with a setscrew? I can't see the turning points for the cable so hard to know if sliding the bracket along the tiller will allow you to get tension in the cables if they are made up snug at the shortest point.
Looks like you are on something here...Except those screws on the bracket serve no purpose as I see it. The bracket is fixed to the slider by hose clamp. Still the same idea. Shall I add some sand under the bracket and the hose clamp before tightening to prevent it from moving? Will check tomorrow if there is enough room for two clamps.
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Old 10-12-2020, 09:05   #11
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Is there a place a turnbuckle could be introduced into the system? It does not matter where it would be placed, only that it tighten the cables without disturbing the buldog clamps. Only one would be needed to tension one cable.
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Old 10-12-2020, 11:50   #12
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

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Originally Posted by Paul Howard View Post
Is there a place a turnbuckle could be introduced into the system? It does not matter where it would be placed, only that it tighten the cables without disturbing the buldog clamps. Only one would be needed to tension one cable.
Yes, he needs some kind of a tensioning device and what he has will not do it. I really think he needs to get someone on the boat who can really figure out what he has. It doesnít look very workable to me. And yes you can drill that shaft on the boat.
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Old 10-12-2020, 12:04   #13
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Howard View Post
Is there a place a turnbuckle could be introduced into the system? It does not matter where it would be placed, only that it tighten the cables without disturbing the buldog clamps. Only one would be needed to tension one cable.
Paul, no there is no room for turnbuckle, There is hardly room for the short bolt on one side. The tiller is relativly long probably for two reasons 1) not to lose sliding tube when rudder is turned hard 2) it allows more leverage at the wheel.
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Old 10-12-2020, 12:22   #14
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Interesting, had not considered that as a slider, but that way the angle on the cables doesn't need to change as the helm is turned.

In that case I would try turning the helm hard over and fixing it at that position. Then loosen the cable clamp on the side that is accessible and use some temporary method to pull the tail of the cable until the whole thing is tight (I could see a temporary turnbuckle connected to the cable and to the rudder stop/wall I see in the pictures). Tighten up the cable clamp while the cable is held tight by the temporary tensioning system, then remove the temporary tightening device. Seems a bit of a pain, but if there is no way to install a permanent device... (but see coopec43's post, that kind of tensioner could be mounted on the top of the slider).

The tensioner does not need to be either end, it could be in the middle of the cable. There should be a turning block somewhere near the tiller and another under the pedestal? How long is the cable section between the two blocks? If that section is longer than the amount of cable required to go full over then there's possibly room to install a mid-span turnbuckle.
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Old 10-12-2020, 14:57   #15
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Re: Seaward 26 RK steering steel cables connections to the rudder? How to tension?

Looking at the pictures, nothing about that system looks like a factory installation or something a yacht designer would approve of. Hose clamps and bent, separated wires just don't seem seaworthy and shipshape. This looks like a cobbled-up temporary rig that replaced a properly built system that broke. I would call the designer and/or manufacturer for advice and recommendations.
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