I hate my dinghy motor

[Ida_Lewis]

It's not equivalent to a 10 hp, but for my scenario -- southern New England harbors -- it's just fine. I have an extra battery for peace of mind and more range. Works great for my needs at the moment and I don't have to fool around with carburetors, which sounds like a big pita. Plus I can move it around myself.

It's all a compromise, it's just a question of the ones you personally can live with.

[Matsubob]

The primary (idling) jet is minute. Physically passing a soft material is the best insurance that you have cleaned it well. Brass jets, though, are vulnerable to abrasion, so the metal must be something softer. A length of copper filament from a multi filament wire won't abrade it but is strong enough to clean the orifice. You will find that the motor starts easily and idles well!
Available regular gasoline has a short shelf life. It quickly becomes less combustible because of non-polluting additives, yes, per EPA, so, blame them! If the engine is not to be used for several months, turn the fuel off and run the engine dry. That way, no corrosive fuel is left in the carburetor bowl. Or it can be drained by backing the screw off and allowing it to drain.
Ethanol does have an effect on ALL aluminum carburetor parts, NOT just those made in Japan!

[Mirage35]

Can I throw in a rant on this ever-popular subject?

First, I feel your pain (mostly in my right arm!) Our Tohatsu 6 hp is incredibly temperamental - I'm gradually understanding its quirks but am getting a lot of exercise on the way.

But in general, why does it seem so hard to make a reliable outboard? My only other experience with small four cycle engines is a Toro 5 hp snowblower (photo attached for you tropical dwellers who don't know what that is ). It starts first pull, every time, in all conditions.

What do they know that the outboard manufacturers don't?

[Seabeau]

You haven't really hated an outboard until you've owned a British Seagull for any length of time. Hard to find parts, cantankerous, irritating and crazy, however 30 years ago while crossing St. Catherine's Sound in GA. in 6 to 8 ft. chop, it withstood repeated total immersions, arising sputtering each time but still running. Dang thing saved my life and I still have the little motor. And no, it is not for sale.

[olivert]

The best example of motors that won't start because of exhaust back pressure. You guys who struggle try a little less of the motor immersed. Maybe that's why your snow blower always starts first time

[olivert]

The British Seagull was designed for the D Day landings and the spec was for it to run for, I think, 5 miles pushing an assault craft with 20 men. After landing they were to be buried in the sand and I know at least one was dug up kin the early 1970s and it worked!

[Matsubob]

On gasoline engines, a "hard starter" can be either fuel related, ignition related, or both. So if the carb is impeccably clean and the fuel is clean and flows smoothly, even through the tiny idle/primary orifice, and still doesn't start on the first lick, I would look at the timing. Advance it a little and try it. Too much advance will cause overheating of the head but it can be dialed back once the starting issue is resolved. If it still uncooperative, a compression check will show if there is something amiss mechanically. Hard starting motors can be cured; the cause for it simply has to be singled out and addressed. And small engines are more sensitive and cantankerous and more difficult to adjust because of their tiny nature, but it is possible.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by Matsubob

>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
........yes, per EPA, so, blame them! ...............
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Misplaced blame here. The Congress legislated the use of ethanol during a limited fuel supply period. The farmers liked it so much 'cuz they had somewhere to sell their corn. It then grew like weeds: 5% became 10%, and now they want 15%!!! BoatUS is fighting it. Even the old 5% started ruining built-in fiberglass fuel tanks in many boats!!!

An understanding of government is also essential here. Agencies do NOT make laws, they only implement them. If Congress had not passed the legislation, the EPA would have nothing to enforce.

Wanna blame someone? Blame your Congress-critter, not the EPA.

And the $$ from the Big Ag corn producers is NOT going to the EPA, it IS going to the Congress-critters, who will most likely never reduce the amount of harmful, stupid ethanol. Gee, guess why???

And the cost of food is going up because of all of the corn being used for making ethanol. Vicious cycle, eh?

[TrentePieds]

@ #81:

Amusing, but not in conformity with the facts :-) The British Seagull was one of those manifestations of the British propensity to settle for second-best whenever it is available. Right up there with Girling shock absorbers and Lucas electrics.

It hailed from the early 1930s, Conceived and begot in the inland city of Wolverhampton, just down the street from one of my former abodes. Any BS that I have been familiar with would have been utterly incapable of pushing a craft containing 20 men and their battle gear.

I recall vividly lying to a can in Whytecliff Bay many years ago in a Seabird - the Thomas Day job - and starting the BS on the transom. Every time I cranked up the BS the boat would pitch on the gentle surge coming in from the straits, and the plug would immerse, killing the "engine". As I got on the poop for the umpteenth time and wound the string around the pathetic little flywheel, my eye fell on the "corporate" slogan moulded into the flywheels bakelite cover: "The Best Outboard for the World". That cost that infernal device it's life!

I'm sure that these fifty years later it is STILL on the bottom of Whytecliff Bay :-)!

The answer to my predicament was, of course, to simply sail out of the bay.

TP

[Peregrine1983]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

Misplaced blame here. The Congress legislated the use of ethanol during a limited fuel supply period. The farmers liked it so much 'cuz they had somewhere to sell their corn. It then grew like weeds: 5% became 10%, and now they want 15%!!! BoatUS is fighting it. Even the old 5% started ruining built-in fiberglass fuel tanks in many boats!!!

An understanding of government is also essential here. Agencies do NOT make laws, they only implement them. If Congress had not passed the legislation, the EPA would have nothing to enforce.

Wanna blame someone? Blame your Congress-critter, not the EPA.

And the $$ from the Big Ag corn producers is NOT going to the EPA, it IS going to the Congress-critters, who will most likely never reduce the amount of harmful, stupid ethanol. Gee, guess why???

And the cost of food is going up because of all of the corn being used for making ethanol. Vicious cycle, eh?

Yes. This is my understanding of why we have ethanol in our fuel as well. It's a handout to big ag/corn farmers. It's also been green washed... but there's nothing green about using a food crop for fuel... I digress.

Long story short I brought the motor to my mechanic friend and he is also a tohatsu dealer. He said the dirty secret on these motors is (and some here have said this) that I have to drill out the brass cover (placed on the carb to comply with EPA regs) over the idle mixture screw. Then I can adjust the mixture and the motor will idle properly on American fuel. Seems insane, but I think this is exactly the issue.

[SecondBase]

Originally Posted by olivert

The British Seagull was designed for the D Day landings and the spec was for it to run for, I think, 5 miles pushing an assault craft with 20 men. After landing they were to be buried in the sand and I know at least one was dug up kin the early 1970s and it worked!

"Buried in the sand after landing". Was that procedure mindful of Dunkirk - in case D Day was pushed back? I looked it up and yes that was the reason.

So let me understand. A 1.5 Brake Horsepower outboard engine can push an assault craft with 20 men for 5 miles???? But now the chatter is that we need 4 or even 8 horsepower per tonne of displacement hull today?

[olivert]

There was also a 4hp Seagull and it was also a slow Rev job with the correct prop for that particular job.

I used to sail a 20' Caprice with a Seagull for auxilliary and it would push me at Hull speed all day. I did need ear defenders but so what. Not everyone needs to plane found the anchorage!

It always started 2nd pull.

[luciarose]

I have the exact same Tohatsu. Similar issues. It's a finicky motor to start and to keep running. We've never used any fuel with Ethanol and still have issues. I hate being in the dinghy and wondering if we'll have power to return to the boat....

Check out this website to find ethanol free fuel:https://www.pure-gas.org/

hopefully they have something near you listed.

[malbert73]

3.3hp 2 stroke mariner has never let me down. Run it dry after every use. But noisy stinky and pollutes.

6 hp 4 stroke mercury quieter but heavier and already has been balky.

My solution is to use a 10 foot trinka as our primary dinghy so rowing is always a viable option in case. Will likely go torqueedo or the like in future


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by AnglaisInHull

Can I throw in a rant on this ever-popular subject?

First, I feel your pain (mostly in my right arm!) Our Tohatsu 6 hp is incredibly temperamental - I'm gradually understanding its quirks but am getting a lot of exercise on the way.

But in general, why does it seem so hard to make a reliable outboard? My only other experience with small four cycle engines is a Toro 5 hp snowblower (photo attached for you tropical dwellers who don't know what that is ). It starts first pull, every time, in all conditions.

What do they know that the outboard manufacturers don't?

I've been using outboard motors all my life, and on the contrary I've never had a bad one.

If you can't get that one to run right, then ditch it and buy a different one -- that's my advice.

My last outboards have been --

5hp two stroke Yamaha. Beautiful little motor. Starts first time every time even if it's been left sitting for a year. Used on a nice little skiff at my lake house. Somewhat heavy for what it is, but oozes quality.

25hp two stroke Mariner, the U.S. made (non-Tohatsu) variant from the late '90's. A real gas guzzler, but wonderfully smooth and endless power. Best starting outboard I ever had -- the electric starter was totally superfluous -- it would start not just first pull, but first half-pull. Every time, even in below freezing weather. Bulletproof until parts started to rust off of it. Never let me down. Sold it with my last dinghy.

8hp four stroke Selva "Black Bass". One-lunger and as light as any 8hp two stroke. This is the Italian job, and not the stencil branded Yamaha Selvas, so supposedly a cheap and nasty motor. So it has lots of flimsy plastic parts, but nothing whatsoever has broken in two happy years of use. It used to be slightly hard to start, but has gotten easier and easier during these two years and now never takes more than say two pulls. Incredibly economical. A bit rough due to only one cylinder, but this does not disturb in the slightest for dinghy usage.


If you can't get your outboard to work right, then ditch it! The world is full of excellent outboard motors.