What length Catamaran

[S.S.Minnow]

Hello all, first post and have a few questions about selecting the correct rig.
We have been casually looking at Cats for many years now and are finally in a position where we can move forward. We have done the catamaran tourist charter thingy and feel this might be right up our alley. Currently land locked traveling around in a Winnebago so used to the camping style of life.
My question is while there will be two of us onboard full time at what point does a Catamaran become too much for one individual to handle under sail?
Our experience is limited to a 1970 Seacraft 12' Sealight. Which does not sound like much but it really is allot of fun in our smaller local lakes.

What length Cat gets to be a little too much to handle if only one individual was available under sail?
Are there specific Manufacturers that are more single hand friendly?
Not against new rigs but the Wolf may prefer the price point of lightly used.
Thank you in advance for your time.
Skipper.

[Jeannius]

My wife and I when in our mid to late 50s circumnavigated aboard a 44ft cat. Never once did we feel we needed a bigger boat, in fact a well designed 40ft may have been just fine. Definitely recommend electric winches for everything and all lines back to the cockpit.

[Galumay]

I suspect size is not the primary factor in single handed suitability of a cat. Much more to do with setup of rig, sails, reefing, winches, clutches, line routing, auto pilots, anchoring setups etc. A poorly setup 10m cat might be much harder to single hand than a well set up 20m cat.

My wife and I have a 14m cat, fine with the two of us, but its not well enough set up (currently) for one person.

[fxykty]

Below around 60 feet there isn’t anything too big for a couple to handle, although docking and undocking becomes more difficult with higher-sided cats and bigger cats and is when you might wish for a smaller boat.

With an autopilot doing the steering there isn’t anything on our 55’ cat that we can’t do single handed, although some manoeuvres will take longer than with two people. Electric winches might be nice for hoisting mainsails and gennakers, but certainly are not necessary.

Look at as many boats as you can and decide which one best meets the list of features and capabilities that you want. And/or the one you fall in love with.

[chubby]

Originally Posted by S.S.Minnow

Hello all, first post and have a few questions about selecting the correct rig.
We have been casually looking at Cats for many years now and are finally in a position where we can move forward. We have done the catamaran tourist charter thingy and feel this might be right up our alley. Currently land locked traveling around in a Winnebago so used to the camping style of life.
My question is while there will be two of us onboard full time at what point does a Catamaran become too much for one individual to handle under sail?
Our experience is limited to a 1970 Seacraft 12' Sealight. Which does not sound like much but it really is allot of fun in our smaller local lakes.

What length Cat gets to be a little too much to handle if only one individual was available under sail?
Are there specific Manufacturers that are more single hand friendly?
Not against new rigs but the Wolf may prefer the price point of lightly used.
Thank you in advance for your time.
Skipper.

go to boat shows..
step aboard every boat that welcomes you (including the monos and motor yachts)
..you'll get a feel of how much volume increases by the length
(and ask questions... they know more than you)


volunteer to crew on passages...
on every type of boat.. be open to all sizes ..not just that pretty lagoon 55 from youtube.
if the boat is seaworthy...say "yes".. keep your mouth closed and be in learning mode.

you need "experiences" to answer these "how long is a string?" type questions for youself..

and to save youself from making future poor decisions... just toss that "cruising=tourist cat experience" idea into the rubbish now...



finally charter..
the ~40 footers
..mid 40s..
..still unsure.. splurge for a week on a 50 or 60 foot
i prefer to bareboat..but you may learn more in a crewed environment



you'll get an idea if you really want to be hand winching that main or pulling up a 100 pound anchor when your windlass blows


from my own experiences..

while yes more waterlength=more comfortable (sailing and at anchor) but a bigger also =significantly more work
...i'd try to target the smallest "comfortable" boat (for both) that you can handle..






my 1st boat was a 41 ft..
perfect for me but too much like "camping" for female.


re "work"
my "to do" list never completed and generally i was doing something for the the boat from waking to noon whenever i was aboard...more or less always.

i *think* i could manage up to a 62 footer (and would if a great deal came my way).. but in real world 55 would be my limit with a personal preference in the 45 foot range.




note: a lagoon 55 next to a lagoon 40 (both capable of being sailed by a cruising couple)

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Galumay

I suspect size is not the primary factor in single handed suitability of a cat. Much more to do with setup of rig, sails, reefing, winches, clutches, line routing, auto pilots, anchoring setups etc. A poorly setup 10m cat might be much harder to single hand than a well set up 20m cat.

My wife and I have a 14m cat, fine with the two of us, but its not well enough set up (currently) for one person.

Finally. It’s so common on this forum to have people incorrectly say a certain length is the limit for singlehanded sailing or for a couple.

That’s nonsense. The above post is 100% correct.

The only factors involved are if the rigging is set up properly and if the person knows the basics of keeping loads down on the running rigging. Things like easing a sail on a furler before attempting to roll it in.

A single person can handle a 100ft boat if it’s set up for that

[chris mac]

The answer depends on your abilities independently and as a team. It also depends on your cruising location and style. As an example, east coast usa. If you desire to explore the small towns and communities of the icw then an air draft sub 65'(under 64 is better).
If you are cruising Florida and bahamas, then water draft under 5' is better.
So in my opinion, digging a little deeper In to your plans will help answer your question

[boatman61]

It all boils down to your priorities..
Personally as a couple an L380 owners version is the best cat out there for 2 people plus occasional guests..
It has relatively low windage for a cruising cat, a helm position in the cockpit and generally adequate everything two people could need and sails reasonably well.
But then I am not from a country that prioritises large over everything else..

[S.S.Minnow]

Thank you so much all of your impute.
Sticking to the Caribbean to start with as we have a huge learning curve to accomplish in order to venture into the deep blue confidently. But have every intention of doing so, eventually.
Yes I am aware of the difference between the 40' and 50' cats and a 30' beam with a pair of 110's does interest me. As so eloquently stated we like it big over here. And I understand the opinion. Well that and a happy Wolf is a happy boat. And she's used to... big, so there is that. 45' Winnebago Tour guys n gals... keep your thoughts PG.
While I am certain a 40' would be more than enough boat for the two of us we have a large family and extended network of bums we hang with and most likely will have visitors from time to time. We have a pair of Doberman's so extra room is very desirable.
I see Sun Reef is now producing a 50' and I like the overall fit and finish of the rig. None on the used market yet.
We will look at many rigs before deciding on one and asking many specific questions to insure we are educated enough to succeed in picking the right one.
Thank you in advance for your time and expertise.
Skipper

[Kinkircating]

This definitely is a personal preference type of thing. The list of questions I’d ask yourselves (as my wife and I did) are:

1) what are your plans with the cat. Blue water cruising the world crossing oceans or island hopping the Bahamas/Caribbean
2) do you really care about the sailing aspect of the adventure. Performance or comfort (or both)
3) Budget - you can have all the features you dream of, but don’t buy a boat that you can only marginally afford. My rule of thumb is if you are living abroad don’t have the boat be more than 20% of your overall net worth, preferably closer to 5%.
4) 40-45 feet cats have about the optimal interior volume for couple.
5) 50 foot cats and larger have a better motion at sea, the extra length means a better ride and less hobby horsing
6) Quality of construction. There is nothing wrong with polyester balsa cored glued together boats that weighs 20T, but just don’t be fooled by the salesperson that it’s going to hold up in the same manner that a boat built specifically for crossing oceans will. You get what you pay for.
7) payload capacity- are you going to have lots of stuff? Start a list with what everything weighs because cats don’t like to be overloaded.
8) get a whole lot of experience chartering and visiting boat shows so you can know what it’s like to sail a slow condo cat that’s comfy as well as a light performance boat that’s cramped. Take a bunch of test sails with various manufacturers.
9) give yourself a couple of years to go through the learning and exploration phase….it is part of the fun
10) whatever boat you choose,, someone out there will tell you why your decision sucks.
11) once you actually get out there, the community is freaking awesome and the people are extremely helpful and could care less if you are on a 30 year old charter boat and a brand new multi million dollar rocket ship. The sunsets are the same for everyone.
12) Realize that 2 years in you’ll probably know a hell of a lot more and want to change the boat to one that suits how you live and sail. You don’t know what you don’t know.

That’s about it, if you’d share more, like your plans for cruising grounds and rough budget for the boat, I’m sure you’ll get plenty of feedback on good cats to consider.

[boatman61]

Now you've opted for some workable info here's what you need.. https://www.catamarans.com/used-sail...0/calma/256824

[SV Confianza]

I would say more length is a trade off between speed, space, ability to handle higher seas, vs cost, maintenance, danger.

You can definitely get a 55 that’s set up for a cruising couple, but when something goes wrong, it then becomes much harder to handle than a 40. The forces involved are just much bigger.

Then there’s the maintenance. Cost goes up on a hurry for bigger things. Bigger winches, bigger sails, bigger engines, bigger lines. It all costs much more, if not double.

Plus you have double the area to keep clean and maintain.

We are very comfortable on our 44, and it’s not nearly as big as todays 44s. If we had a family, we would go bigger 50 plus).

But, as others have pointed out, it’s very hard to compare even one 44 to another. We saw maybe 20 cats in person before settling on ours. We opted for more cockpit space to hang out in and a helm position that’s close to others who are also on the boat. Didn’t think that would be a main criteria until we saw many.

Good luck in your search. Some good memories for us!

[Kinkircating]

Originally Posted by SV Confianza

I would say more length is a trade off between speed, space, ability to handle higher seas, vs cost, maintenance, danger.

You can definitely get a 55 that’s set up for a cruising couple, but when something goes wrong, it then becomes much harder to handle than a 40. The forces involved are just much bigger.

Then there’s the maintenance. Cost goes up on a hurry for bigger things. Bigger winches, bigger sails, bigger engines, bigger lines. It all costs much more, if not double.

Plus you have double the area to keep clean and maintain.

We are very comfortable on our 44, and it’s not nearly as big as todays 44s. If we had a family, we would go bigger 50 plus).

But, as others have pointed out, it’s very hard to compare even one 44 to another. We saw maybe 20 cats in person before settling on ours. We opted for more cockpit space to hang out in and a helm position that’s close to others who are also on the boat. Didn’t think that would be a main criteria until we saw many.

Good luck in your search. Some good memories for us!

It’s an excellent point that it’s nearly impossible to compare one boat of a similar size to another. A 44-46 boat from Lagoon/Leopard/FP has more interior living space than a 50+ foot performance cat. But also from a safety standpoint, you’ll need full sails up in 20 knots of wind to be sailing at8 knots, where you could be triple reefed on the performance boat with much less stress on the rig and crew and be maintaining that same 8 knots in total comfort.

That’s why it’s important to step aboard all different types of boats and better yet get some time actually sailing in various conditions. It’s all a series of trade offs.

[Cpt Mark]

It's interesting that most everyone seems to think they have to have a 40 foot or much bigger boat. This is true on monos as well. In the late 70 the AVERAGE size cruising mono for a family of 4 was 27'.

Every year the boats get bigger. It's how the mfr's have a new thing you must buy. Do you really need that much boat? Why? Is it safer, maybe, maybe not. What is your experience level?

My cat is 35' long, 15' wide and built strong. Plenty comfy for 2 people and 4 for occasional use. It's is rigged for single handing. Fits into a standard 40 foot slip and can be hauled out anywhere with a regular travel lift.

I was Captain on a 55' tour catamaran built for speed. Loved it. Would I want to own one that big? Nope. Everything is big on that boat and when the **** hits the fan and it will, I want things to be of a size and manageability that a singlehander can do. Someone might be sick, injured etc. I have an electric winch that all lines can reach to. But if thewinch fails for whatever reason, the sail plan can be managed by regular winches without a lot of drama.

Besides all these reasons for me the other is money. I have a smaller, capable boat that costs less to own, operate and gives me more money for cruising. My 2 cents worth.

[S.S.Minnow]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Now you've opted for some workable info here's what you need.. https://www.catamarans.com/used-sail...0/calma/256824

She's a beauty but 60' is more than the two/four (dogs) of us need. 50' is a stretch for our first cat. I spect the first year the iron sails will get plenty of use.