The New Fastcat 405: Please Comment and Help Us Make the Perfect 40-41' Cat

[fastcat435]

Originally Posted by Nordic cat

I find it telling that despite being faced with your own log for the trip, you still maintain that you had an average speed of 8.81 knots, when in fact your own notes in the log claim an average of 6.95 knots over 3608 Nm in 519 hours.

Why did you remove the log from your site, when not much else gets removed? I might me suspicious, but I'm getting more sceptical about your claims as you lose credibility every time you get caught embellishing the truth.

How many other "facts" about your boats and methods have you embellished?

I'm sure you do many great things, and I have no doubt that you are very focused on trying to improve your boats, I just feel a need to react when your salesmanship goes into overspeed, and the truth starts suffering.

Regards
Alan

Hallo Alan

The facts are different from what you say and I never removed the log from the site and do not know who did.
The original speeds given where taken from a sat tracker each 12 hours and although it gives a correct location of the vessel it by no means gives the speed.
If I recall well ( and my memory is Good ) we had to tack all the way from Barbados to Miami with the wind on the nose and the actual covered distance was double that of the direct routing . Also the stops made in St Helena , Barbados , and Tortola where not taken into account when the post was made as you can clearly see .
Why not show up sometime , be polite for a change and come for a sail with us.
Danmark is not that far and than you can see as a witness what a wellbuild and lightweight
Catamaran can really do in way of performance.

Greetings and happy sailing

p.s. How is your new Cat coming along ? have you started building yet or are you just talking and thinking about it ?

I a way you remind me of a old joke that I will share with you

A man is telling his friends in the Pub he has got to halve his sex life since the doctor has told him so.
His friends immediately react and ask him the question
is it the thinking about sex it or the talking about sex that you have to stop with ?

Still wish you good luck with your new cat.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by pilot

I use IE and a normal desktop screen, nevertheless you are the only one producing this "superwide delivery"!?
Any IT specialist for a solution of this phenomena?

Hold down the shift key and simultaneously roll the scroll button on your mouse towards for minus and away for plus. If no scroll button, hit the minus key while holding shift down. To reverse do the same with the plus key. This works in the latest Firefox, and in IE. All smiles now?

[schoonerdog]

regarding the barrocka, it should be a seperate post for seperate comments. I like the Schionning, one of the few with real water tight compartments. I personally like retractible outboards as a nice, cheap solution, I owned a PDQ 36 for 6 years which was powered exclusively by outboards. But that was a catamaran which sold for new 186,000 in 1998. It's also solution that's definitely not for everyone, outboards are less fuel efficient, less reliable than diesels and using them in rough seas can be difficult. On the plus side of outboards, you can replace them very easily and work on them very easily and retractible drives have so many advantages.

[pilot]

Thanks for the IT hint, BigCat,

I will try that on the next occasion!

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by pilot

Thanks for the IT hint, BigCat,

I will try that on the next occasion!

Hi, Pilot - You're welcome - This isn't just for when photos are too large - it is for zooming in / out any time. TD

[vanrudder]

My mail was off so i was not able to answer. I work with Brazapi (mainly technical) and am interested in all technical issues and discussions. When you have questions i would be glad to give my opinion and discuss

[fastcat435]

Originally Posted by vanrudder

My mail was off so i was not able to answer. I work with Brazapi (mainly technical) and am interested in all technical issues and discussions. When you have questions i would be glad to give my opinion and discuss

I think if you want to let other people know about the products you make that a new Thread should be started on the Brazapi cats and not barge into a exhisting thread that has nothing to do with Brazapi.
I wish you good luck with your cats

Greetings
Gideon

[fastcat435]

Originally Posted by Nordic cat

I agree with most of Idrhawkes comments to and about Gideon,it does sometimes annoy me that he keeps going on as if he is the only one who keeps his boats light. He often makes statements that are not entirely truthful, yet not a complete lie. I think it is high time we call his bluff.

I have often asked him to clarify or substantiate statements about the weights and load carrying. The last time was regarding the CE marking of the 455. He claimed 8 tons load carrying ability, the CE certificate said 5 tons. Read the thread and form your own opinion, take note of his usual tactics when he has been caught out.

He wrote the message as though the green motion system was specifically CE approved as the first in the world. You can not get CE approval for a propulsion system!!! The system has to fulfill the general requirements that are relevant, but it does not get a specific approval by a third party as he tries to make out in his press release.When challenged, he never admits that he was a bit over zealous with the truth.

The fastcat 435 is in effect a Norseman, google up some pictures and you can barely tell the diiference.

By the way Gideon is not the designer, Angelo Lavranos is. Gideon was a successfull car salesman/dealer in Holland before he took his sales talent to the catamaran market.

It sounds like he has alot of boats out there and plenty of orders. In fact he has only built 4 boats in 4 years, maybe number 5 has been launched, so the story about being flooded with orders must be something that has suddenly changed in the last months, about the same time frame as the global economy went into a tailspin

His claims for the speed of his boat across the Atlantic from Capetown has grown with time. Originally he had the complete log of the trip on his site, but that got removed quite quickly, (I wonder why?) now he is claiming 9 knot averages for ocean crossings, whereas his customers blogs show 5-6 knot averages.

Gideon, I have asked you to be more respectful of the truth earlier, yet you seem to persist, so it's great that more people are catching on to what you are doing and reacting to it.

I am really looking forward to hear from Setttingsail2009, when he gets his 435 weighed, so we can see if it only weighs around 5 tons like you claim.

Sorry for the negative stuff guys, but I just hate salesmen who aren't truthfull, or people who tart up their story to make money.

I am working on the design of a cat at present, witha very experienced NA, when we look at the figures we have and compare to Gideons weight claims, then it sure looks like there must be a ton missing somewhere, whether it's in the claim or in the quality (lack of material?) I don't know. I would like to see you substaniate your weight claims Gideon, using a certified weight/weigher. Are you up to the challenge? I'm sure we can find a CF member or 2 to be present as witnesses....

Regards

Alan

Hallo Alan

Just noticed the remark on the weight claim
You are always welcome to see the actual weight on our cats.
We have progressed from 8000 kilo for hull number 1 to 5.8 tons for hull number 4 and that is for fully outfitted cats.
I am trying hard to get the weight of a ready to sail but no option FastCat 455 below 5000 kilo and am sure that we will succeed.
Once this is done I will invite you to see the actual weight and you are welcome to sail with us

Greetings

Gideon

[freetime]

30-40 minutes at this thread... Very interesting info on the green 435. What´s inside a lagoon 430 hybrid? Simular or...

[catty]

[quote=fastcat435;177303]Hallo Alan

The original speeds given where taken from a sat tracker each 12 hours and although it gives a correct location of the vessel it by no means gives the speed.
If I recall well ( and my memory is Good ) we had to tack all the way from Barbados to Miami with the wind on the nose and the actual covered distance was double that of the direct routing .



Gee Gideon, what exactly are you trying to say? To cover double the rhumbline distance were you tacking through 120 degrees.? Do the math.

Or are you admitting to "guilding the lilly" ?

Like Alan I see no reason to exaggerate, there are many people coming to this site to learn, so I'm not sure this helps. You are producing good looking boats however.

[BigCat]

"Gideon, I have asked you to be more respectful of the truth earlier, yet you seem to persist, so it's great that more people are catching on to what you are doing and reacting to it......Sorry for the negative stuff guys, but I just hate salesmen who aren't truthfull, or people who tart up their story to make money."

I second the motion. All in favor?

[GordMay]

Refute the math, not the man.

[ldrhawke]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Refute the math, not the man.

Nothing wrong with the math............it's the selective use of numbers by the man doing the math.

[fastcat435]

Originally Posted by ldrhawke

Nothing wrong with the math............it's the selective use of numbers by the man doing the math.

I understand you are a sailor or so you say, if sailing from A to B in a complete straight line
over a 12 hour period and the distance is lets say 120 miles and the speed is 10 knots the distance should be covered in 12 hours.
If the same distance is covered but the boat has to tack all the way and the best VMG is an angle of 90 degrees between tacks and that is almost impossible the sailed distance is doubled and so is the sailed time to reach B or 24 hours , if this same track is covered in these 12 hours but into the wind so tacking all the way not taking currents and drift into
the speed should double.
I do not know about your math but I must have gone to a different school !!
Now with the example of the FastCat the perfect line is never sailed ( unfortunately )
and the actual covered distance is longer the all the added up distances as taken from the sat tracker. The times are correct since the entry,s where made each 12 hours but the distances are always longer than the exact distance from one sat track point to the other.

Greetings and happy sailing.
Gideon

[fastcat435]

The Lagoon Hybrid is equipped with a system made by Leroy somers from France in combination with a Kohler generetor and inboard electric motors with big props.