S/V Delos discusses mono vs. cat with cruising couple.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by smj

I'm guessing there are a lot more monohull owners that would like to have a cat vs catamaran owners that would like to have a mono. Main disadvantage of a cat? Cost.

Yes Cost is a disadvantage but depending of the sailor program and tastes there could be other disadvantages. It really depends on a lot of factors, many of them related with personal preferences.

The expansion of the Catamaran sales has to do mostly with condo cats and the possibility of having the bigger possible living space for the money. Sailing potential is not the reason why most that have cats have chosen them otherwise the type of cats that sell would not be condo cats, the fatter, the better. Look at the success of boats like the new FP Lucia 40.

The increase of sales regarding motor catamarans have been even bigger than the one of condo cats and I believe that trend as well as the one of more and more compromised cats in what regards sailing versus more interior space it will continue to be, by far, the major trend in what regards cruising cats.

[smj]

Originally Posted by Polux

Yes Cost is a disadvantage but depending of the sailor program and tastes there could be other disadvantages. It really depends on a lot of factors, many of them related with personal preferences.

The expansion of the Catamaran sales has to do mostly with condo cats and the possibility of having the bigger possible living space for the money. Sailing potential is not the reason why most that have cats have chosen them otherwise the type of cats that sell would not be condo cats, the fatter, the better, in what regards sails. Look at the success of boats like the new FP Lucia 40.

The increase of sales regarding motor catamarans have been even bigger than the one of condo cats and I believe that trend as well as the one of more and more compromised cats in what regards sailing versus more interior space it will continue to be, by far, the major trend in what regards cruising cats.

I completely agree.


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[Andrew Grace]

Originally Posted by smj

I completely agree.


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+1

I also had the same option to go for the condo style , was actually offered a pretty good deal on the first Lucia into Singapore but so glad I went with the alternative choice as there is nothing better than being able to sail at speeds of 7 to 10 knots in only 12 knots of true wind...

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Andrew Grace

+1

I also had the same option to go for the condo style , was actually offered a pretty good deal on the first Lucia into Singapore but so glad I went with the alternative choice as there is nothing better than being able to sail at speeds of 7 to 10 knots in only 12 knots of true wind...

Let me make something clear: For most there are obviously things better than performance on a cruising sailboat and that's the reality even if you prefer otherwise.

I may have given the impression that I found the Lucia 40 badly designed. It is not the case. It is well designed regarding the cruising/sailing program it was meant to accomplish. That's just that most people prefer to compromise sail ability to interior space in what regards a cruising boat and that is just a choice, the most common one. There is nothing wrong with it.

The same happens, maybe in a lesser way, in what regards monohulls. Almost all main market monohulls are, to put it in the words of my daughter, "fat" and have very simplified rigging.

My impression is that most cruisers don't really care about sailing. Sailing is just a mean for cruising. Normally the ones that have made sportive sailing through their live, and now are cruising, won't buy that type of boats as cruising boats and like sailing as much as cruising....but they are just a minority.

[Wakey]

Delos completes rigging.

http://youtu.be/A1tq5z0ocTo


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[Factor]

Originally Posted by Polux

Let me make something clear: For most there are obviously things better than performance on a cruising sailboat and that's the reality even if you prefer otherwise..

How do you know, have you undertaken a survey? What an extraordinarily opinionated thing to say.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Factor

How do you know, have you undertaken a survey? What an extraordinarily opinionated thing to say.

Why "opinionated"? I think it's quite obvious, and should not be controversial.

A large percentage of cruisers -- maybe, for all I know, even the majority -- don't really care about sailing at all, much less performance sailing. Both mono and cat sailors. To the extent that they would make any serious effort or incur any significant expense, to achieve sailing performance, especially upwind ("gentlemen don't go etc.").

I don't have the slightest problem with that -- to each his own. I care about performance a lot, and have spent a lot of effort and money chasing it, but I am definitely in a small minority and don't impose my taste on others. Polux is just stating an obvious fact. He's attempting to put the discussion about performance into perspective.

[Wellington]

Originally Posted by Polux

What the video proved was that a Barramundi 470, a performance catamaran, upwind, in light conditions is slightly faster than a slow heavy monohull like the Amel Super Maramu and that with medium conditions the Amel is faster upwind.

Yes, on that day, in these specific conditions, the video shows that a heavy (but with a longer waterline) Amel could keep up with a light performance catamaran. Conversely, will you believe me (sorry, I have no video to "prove" anything) if I tell you that our overloaded condomaran (Lagoon 440) was faster tacking into the wind than a Charles Morgan 62? Wind speed was about 20 kts. She would point 10 degrees higher, but we were faster. Many factors other than SA/D etc... come into play. For a start the Charles Morgan 62 had a really dirty hull with barnacles, we had just hauled out.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Factor

How do you know, have you undertaken a survey? What an extraordinarily opinionated thing to say.

Sometimes you miss the obvious. If, like i said, "for most there are obviously things better than performance on a cruising sailboat " was not true and just an opinion, the boats that would sell more, and by a factor, would not be condomarans or condomonohulls but performance cruisers.

On cats that tendency is even more marked regarding the characteristics new models from the main cat brands show: bigger freeboard, bigger cabins, bigger volumes. A comparison between a 15 year old Fountain Pajot and a new one leaves no doubts about that tendency and about what most sailors prefer.

[Wakey]

Some old as balls dude buys a 38' Ericson. ;-)

http://youtu.be/C7mpbcCa-u4


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[arsenelupiga]

let me guess...

as this is posted in multihull forum, although is cat vs mono, it is targeted campaign to promote monos, due to alarming increase of cat ownership. Have not watched interviews, but I bet that delo guy will at the end say mono is just better in all possible ways, so just buy mono.

it is a bit over the top the whole thing though.

[Wakey]

Originally Posted by arsenelupiga

Have not watched interviews.

I might have identified your problem.


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[Factor]

Well I learn't something. A "mottled" underwater surface "gives you better grip on the water".

[arsenelupiga]

ok, i will watch it one day. never, know, may learn something new as well.

[arsenelupiga]

Originally Posted by Polux

The expansion of the Catamaran sales has to do mostly with condo cats and the possibility of having the bigger possible living space for the money. Sailing potential is not the reason why most that have cats have chosen them otherwise the type of cats that sell would not be condo cats, the fatter, the better.

in my case different reasons. me and my wife have seriously considered 40 to 50 ft mono but decided against for the following reasons:
1. vertical windows due to sun protection
2. covered cockpit - same reason
3. there is always shade on cat
4. seasickness - my wife quite prone - cured on our cat
5. forward net - nothing nicer than having gourmet lunch while sailing or sleeping in anchorage on summer night
6. view from panoramic windows in hulls and common area. one does not need to stand up.

Space was not decisive, although we do not mind.