Question for Liveaboards

[gordonhinds]

I am a die hard sailor but I’d be tempted with a trawler. Cats are expensive and difficult to berth. Mono hulls have limited space unless big and then you have other issues - maintenance costs, berthing, gear weight etc… a 45’ or 50’ trawler would make a great live a board boat. We motor sail a lot so you end up motoring anyway. I think the journey part of the program on a power boat would be dull. Given your European ambitions the canals need to be part of your planning… if you were going to the Caribbean or pacific a cat is a no brainer. But the med, a trawler would be best… you can get power cats - they could be good (except no canals).

[Joli]

Originally Posted by davidkaleta

Hi All. I'd like an honest answer based on actual experience. My wife and i are planning to buy a boat to live on full time in the Med, and maybe venturing up north to Norway (possibly). We both have a number of years sailing both monohulls and catamarans. Now, here's the question, how much actual sailing do you actually do, vs using your engines. My experience is a 70/30 split for motors.

I'm tempted to start looking at trawlers, due to the fact that their fuel consumption is better per mpg usually and that a lot of time will be spent in one location, maybe a month at a time.



Cheers

Honestly, a nice air bnb will be the least expensive.

[Cynara]

Are you always in a hurry. To get somwhere. Do you mind spending an extra night at sea.we sailed even if doing one knot. We met people who motored if they weren't making at least 6 knots. Only you can decide

[Adornan]

Maybe somewhat unusually we went from a 43ft cat, twenty years ago, to a 39ft mono to a 37ft motor boat. The cat was brilliant for long ocean passages and anchoring in the Caribbean and Pacific. But it was difficult to find marina berths big enough and berthing cost was usually 2x that of a mono. Forget the rubbish claimed about performance for most cats.
The mono was much easier to handle but my wife got bored with the time it took to get everywhere.
So now we have a Scandinavian built motor boat in Croatia. We love the quality of the fit out, having only had French production boats before. We can blast home or to the islands at nearly 40kts, but we don’t typically because of the fuel cost. So instead we potter around at 7-8kts biting about 20 litres an hour. We never used to think about cost of fuel before - 2x27hp on the cat and a 40hp on the mono. We might sell the motor boat this year if we don’t decide to take it up the rivers to holland and on the Sweden next year. If I was to replace it right now I would be looking for a big volume quality monohull in the 38-40ft size. On thing I do like is to be able to see what’s around me from the saloon, the cat and motor boat are much better for that than most monos.

[Jef & Marin, Netherlands]

It is all a matter of your philosophy.

We like sustainability and autonomy. We sail on average 5000nm/year. Our fuel consumption is around 200 liters/year, for the 2 55hp engines and the 5.6kW generator.

The generator runs 5-10 hours/year; we have almost 2000 W of solar panels, and the boat uses only 10A including a big fridge and freezer.

We use the engines mainly for getting in and out of anchorages. During an ocean passage we don't care if we do 3 knots.

If there is even less wind, and there are waves, so the sails are flapping, we drop the sails, watch a movie, switch on the anchor light in the middle of the ocean, and set the AIS alarm. And enjoy a night together. Unless there is bad weather coming, then it might be better to use the engine.

[arsenelupiga]

Originally Posted by Jef & Marin, Netherlands

It is all a matter of your philosophy.

We like sustainability and autonomy. We sail on average 5000nm/year. Our fuel consumption is around 200 liters/year, for the 2 55hp engines and the 5.6kW generator.

The generator runs 5-10 hours/year; we have almost 2000 W of solar panels, and the boat uses only 10A including a big fridge and freezer.

We use the engines mainly for getting in and out of anchorages. During an ocean passage we don't care if we do 3 knots.

If there is even less wind, and there are waves, so the sails are flapping, we drop the sails, watch a movie, switch on the anchor light in the middle of the ocean, and set the AIS alarm. And enjoy a night together. Unless there is bad weather coming, then it might be better to use the engine.

yeah, that is excellent philosophy. You inspired me to check total consumption of diesel over years from our records. We used 640 L of diesel per year. With each engine clocking 160 hours per year, means that our average use was 2L per hour.

Is the difference of 450 Litres more per year than you came from your boat sails better - ie longer waterline? Sure at least some of it.

[Jef & Marin, Netherlands]

Arsenelupiga,
You ask for the reason for the difference in consumption.
I don't know.
Maybe we stay longer on anchorages, and then do longer trips; like in French Polynesia and sailing to New Zealand and Fiji; and maybe you do more day trips.
We would certainly using be more fuel if we were in the ITCZ like SE Asia, and not in the trade winds of the southern pacific.

Our boat has a longer waterline and daggerboards, so goes upwind well; and is light, so needs little wind.
And for us it is a sport to use little fuel.


At more than 800 liters of fuel, and using 200 per year, the diesel stays too long in the boat. we like to keep the boat light, thus the tanks never more than half full; but there is the risk of condensation and diesel bugs.

We will now change the fuel plumbing: stop using one tank, and take all fuel from the other tank. It will include a fuel transfer pump so that we can easily resume use of that tank; for Suez, Panama or Kieler canal or Patagonia for instance where you get more engine use.

[Snowgoose35]

Our last season in the Med we used €22 of fuel for the year on a 35 foot cat. We sailed everywhere and had a good suite of light airs sails including an enormous asymmetric with a foot almost as long as the boat. It would move us in 4 knots of wind .

I have a 50 foot cat now that sails much better than the 35 and as part of the rebuild I took the fuel tanks down from 700L to 200L to save weight and space which tells you something.

The big problem is how much diesel costs - it jumped after the Russian invasion of Ukraine and could do so again or become limited in availability with many geopolitical events. I would hate to be unable to move at all in a motorboat in such circumstances

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by Jef & Marin, Netherlands

At more than 800 liters of fuel, and using 200 per year, the diesel stays too long in the boat. we like to keep the boat light, thus the tanks never more than half full; but there is the risk of condensation and diesel bugs.

We will now change the fuel plumbing: stop using one tank, and take all fuel from the other tank. It will include a fuel transfer pump so that we can easily resume use of that tank; for Suez, Panama or Kieler canal or Patagonia for instance where you get more engine use.

It is worth doing as bug is a major consideration especially with bio-diesel. We have 4 x 65 litre tanks 2 for each engine and run on just 2 unless we are somewhere remote. We always filter and use stabilizer but still picked up bug in Asia. We attached an air line to the engine end of the lines and blew the paste/gunge back into the tank before removing the tank to clean it. They are poly tanks so can be easily removed for cleaning if necessary.


We average about 75 hours per year per engine. We use more hours in places with marinas compared to anchorages. FWIW we use about 10% more bio-diesel than mineral diesel for the same engine hours.