Gemini Catamarans - Problems

[videorov]

I was reading where one guy had a steel bolt break that was holding
up one of the swinging keels. Why would they not be using stainless
for this boat from the factory? His is older model, I wonder if the new
models use stainless bolts for the fold up keels.
The guy had some water about 8 gallons come through around that
bolt aswell. I thought that pivot bolt is located high enough there
would not be that much water reaching up that far, guess it does.
Anyone have this same problem?
I like the idea that these boats can get into shallow water but don't
want to have alot of problems either.

[nautical62]

I can't speak to the Gemni, but I had a Telstar Trimaran made by the same company which also had a swinging board system. In my case the bolt was also well above waterline, but when the boat was underway, water was forced up into the entire trunk and leaked in great volumes from the pivot bolt. It was a real problem. (I had a very small inspection port at the top of the trunk to maintain the lowering and raising system and water would gush out of it if open underway).

I share this only to point out that the bolt doesn't need to be below the water line to cause problems and hope you are able to find experiences from people with the exact model you are interested in.

I personally am a bit leery of centerboard systems in cruising boats. In addition to being more complex than keels, there is the potential when grounding to have the centerboard cause serious damage to the trunk. I know from personal experience, this can be incredibly difficult to access and repair even on the hard. I can't imagine having that kind of damage under way.

I don't know specifically about the bolt Gemini used, but there are many grades of stainless, all of which are subject to varying degrees to corrosion and failure.

That said, the Gemini is a boat I'm still considering down the road, when I can afford a cat.

[Tropic Cat]

Originally Posted by videorov

Anyone have this same problem?
I like the idea that these boats can get into shallow water but don't
want to have alot of problems either.

It would be fair to say that older Geminis were never designed to age gracefully. I can't speak for the newest design although I understand that they have made significant improvements.

There are better alternatives out there.

[Therapy]

Originally Posted by Tropic Cat

There are better alternatives out there.

I haven't found one.
I am going to get a Gemini.

The newer ones have the bolt "accessible".

[billangiep]

I just replaced the winch line for the center boards on a freinds Gemini and it did have a stainless pivot bolt. I'm not at all impressed with the system. Plastic drum and misc. hardware holding the thing together.

[SunKing]

I have a Gemini 105M... my bolt is stainless, accessible and approx 18 inches above the waterline... you will get water slopping up the trunk as you are moving... I've never had a leak or problem operating the boards...

[Joli]

You should be able to gasket the opening so you do not have water sloshing in the trunk.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Therapy

I haven't found one.
I am going to get a Gemini.

The newer ones have the bolt "accessible".

Look at the PDQ group site (PDQ Forum • Index page). I did take a Gemini for a test drive and didn't like it a bit. Poor visibility forward, hard to reach the winches and only 1 on each side, pounding in any chop, poor visability in the salon... and finally a repair record that I did not like. They have some great features and I do not want to bash them; very weatherly, fast, shoal draft, great interior space. But there are options. I choose a PDQ 32 and love it. The space is a bit less, speed is ~ equal if matching sails are set and the construction quality is on a different level. For example, the Gemini uses glassed-in ply bulkheads around the rudders, the fridge won't fit through the door (goes in before the roof), and the finish tabbing in hidden areas is sloppy.

Be patient and don't marry the first girl you meet ! Alway sound advice.

[xxuxx]

Originally Posted by Therapy

I haven't found one.
I am going to get a Gemini.

The newer ones have the bolt "accessible".

DUDE!!! DON'T DO IT.....YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!!

[Therapy]

Originally Posted by xxuxx

DUDE!!! DON'T DO IT.....YOU'RE BETTER THAN THAT!!

..........

[sandy daugherty]

Stainless Steel does not do well if constantly wet. The solution is to plan to replace a centerboard bolt (and hoisting hardware) as par of your periodic maintenance.

The decision to buy a Gemini over another boat is almost always heavily influenced by price. If you can't afford a PDQ or a Mainecat, its a no-brainer. Just go sailing!

If you catch up and keep up the maintenance, you will know you have a reliable cat that will take you more places than you have time to see!

Just do this: splurge on a really qualified surveyor, and insist he look at everything, from the top of the mast to the bottom of the rudders, just to have a prioritized list of things to do. Buy the boat and get to work!

[jcmcdowell]

Originally Posted by thinwater

Look at the PDQ group site (PDQ Forum • Index page). I did take a Gemini for a test drive and didn't like it a bit. Poor visibility forward, hard to reach the winches and only 1 on each side, pounding in any chop, poor visability in the salon... and finally a repair record that I did not like. They have some great features and I do not want to bash them; very weatherly, fast, shoal draft, great interior space. But there are options. I choose a PDQ 32 and love it. The space is a bit less, speed is ~ equal if matching sails are set and the construction quality is on a different level. For example, the Gemini uses glassed-in ply bulkheads around the rudders, the fridge won't fit through the door (goes in before the roof), and the finish tabbing in hidden areas is sloppy.

Be patient and don't marry the first girl you meet ! Alway sound advice.

If you can point me to a $30,000 PDQ I will be the first to buy it, but until then I can't find a better alternative than a Gemini. I think the key, as it is with all boats, is finding one that has been properly maintained. I've seen 1986 to 1996 Gemini's that were basically abandoned and are worth as much.

Any boat, with proper care and maintenance, can fulfill the mission it was designed for. I recently inspected a 1996 Gemini in Key West that had one dagger board broken in half and the other removed. You can't fault the builder for poor operation and maintenance. The dagger board bolt was stainless. Clearly, like your rigging, you'll need to replace the lines and bolts after so many years.

[Therapy]

Originally Posted by sandy daugherty

Stainless Steel does not do well if constantly wet. The solution is to plan to replace a centerboard bolt (and hoisting hardware) as par of your periodic maintenance.

The decision to buy a Gemini over another boat is almost always heavily influenced by price. If you can't afford a PDQ or a Mainecat, its a no-brainer. Just go sailing!

If you catch up and keep up the maintenance, you will know you have a reliable cat that will take you more places than you have time to see!

Just do this: splurge on a really qualified surveyor, and insist he look at everything, from the top of the mast to the bottom of the rudders, just to have a prioritized list of things to do. Buy the boat and get to work!

Yep.

That is what is working for me!

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Therapy

Yep.

That is what is working for me!

Actually that's wrong - I wasn't waiting. The Stiletto is great for it's own reasons, but the point is still to be patient. The primary reason I did not go with the Gemini was that I did not like the "feel", and that statement had nothing to do with the construction - it was personal. Many aspects of the design are brilliant - really - but there were are few that did not appeal to me.

Get an older boat that is solid, and there is no doubt you can make a solid coastal cruiser from her, a beautiful classic, I have no doubt. I have seen a few with structural problems, and that is where the surveyor comes in. I had a survey on my PDQ. He put in over 15 hours I estimate, and he did find some interesting things I might not have found for many years. He looked EVERYWHERE.

[Tropic Cat]

Originally Posted by thinwater

Get an older boat that is solid, and there is no doubt you can make a solid coastal cruiser from her,....

This is solid advice and people would do well to heed it.

Walk on a Gemini first to get the feel of her. If you weigh anywhere near 200 pounds, one walk along a deck or cockpit is all you'll need. My experience is '87 through 2004 model boats. I can't speak for newer models.

If...and only if the boat was maintained, People looking in that price range are better off buying any older British Catamaran of the same age.