Visit our Popular Forums

nautical62 · 19-08-2014, 06:23

Due to a couple physical health issues, I've given up owning a sailboat. Powercats have a great appeal to me. For cruising the Bahamas, I doubt I'd use much more fuel than I do with a sailboat anyways.

Sadly, I have not seen them offered at a much lower cost. In fact with fewer powercats on the market, I find that the odds of getting the model I want at a good price is much less likely than with a comparable sailing cat.

Do a Yachtworld search for sailing cats under 150K and then do the same for power cats under 150K. Do the same for 100K. The difference will be notable.

valhalla360 · 19-08-2014, 06:42

When they first came out, a lot of trawler cats were just the sail cats with no mast and a slightly larger engines.

The vast majority of sailboats coastal cruising do so under power 90% of the time. We often joke that we are a trawler cat with a really tall radio antenna.

While I voted yes, if I was buying a cat that simply lost it's mast, I would want a steep discount as future buyers would likely want a discount also because it's clearly missing parts of the original design.

Our long term plan for shipping the boat to Europe to cruise for a few years. We are probably 90% that we will take the mast down and store it in my brother-in-laws pole barn before we leave. Saves a bit on the shipping costs and we don't have to deal with it when we are in the canal/river systems.

**Cotemar** · 19-08-2014, 07:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by valhalla360

The vast majority of sailboats coastal cruising do so under power 90% of the time. We often joke that we are a trawler cat with a really tall radio antenna.

While I voted yes, if I was buying a cat that simply lost it's mast, I would want a steep discount as future buyers would likely want a discount also because it's clearly missing parts of the original design.

Very good points.

Most sailing catamarans in the 45 foot range are over the 63 foot air draft needed to go up and down the 3000 miles of the ICW (Intracoastal Waterway) in the USA. They must stay offshore and travel much longer distances to go in and out of the inlets into the ICW.

If you removed all the material and labor cost of having a mast with all the hardware and accessories. That should save a significant amount of time & money invested upfront. If you buy the boat cheaper, then you would also have to pass that saving onto the next buyer.

This would also lower you boat operating cost with not having to repair any sailing hardware.

The boat would also have less windage and be quieter with the lower air draft.

valhalla360 · 19-08-2014, 09:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cotemar

Very good points.

Most sailing catamarans in the 45 foot range are over the 63 foot air draft needed to go up and down the 3000 miles of the ICW (Intracoastal Waterway) in the USA. They must stay offshore and travel much longer distances to go in and out of the inlets into the ICW.

If you removed all the material and labor cost of having a mast with all the hardware and accessories. That should save a significant amount of time & money invested upfront. If you buy the boat cheaper, then you would also have to pass that saving onto the next buyer.

This would also lower you boat operating cost with not having to repair any sailing hardware.

The boat would also have less windage and be quieter with the lower air draft.

I would differentiate what I meant. A cat that came from the manufacturer with no intent to be a sailboat likely wouldn't take nearly as steep of a discount compared to a sail cat that simply had it's mast removed. They may be functionally identical but I would bet the selling prices would be lower for the boat that came with a mast originally.

Of course, that may have been why some of the early sailboat hulls that were sold as trawlers replaced the typical 30hp engines with 75hp engines. It gives the buyer the impression, there are other costs that compensate for the lack of sails and rigging.

Cheechako · 19-08-2014, 09:32

I think you could. You wouldn't get some things you get in a trawler, flybridge etc. The other deficit may be the large rudders on a sail cat. They are exposed and you don't need them for a motor cat.
Personally If I did I would order larger engines than your average Cat. My 42 footer had 3GM30's and max props. in gusting 30 knot winds at anchor the boat wouldn't turn thru the wind. it would if it had some speed going.

**Cotemar** · 19-08-2014, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

I think you could. You wouldn't get some things you get in a trawler, flybridge etc. The other deficit may be the large rudders on a sail cat. They are exposed and you don't need them for a motor cat.
Personally If I did I would order larger engines than your average Cat. My 42 footer had 3GM30's and max props. in gusting 30 knot winds at anchor the boat wouldn't turn thru the wind. it would if it had some speed going.

I agree with the larger engines even for a Sailing Catamaran.

Most production sailing catamarans today are sold with a standard smallish engines with a cheap two blade prop.

If you purchase their upgraded higher horsepower engine with the three blade folding or feathering prop it really changes the whole performance of the boat.

darylat8750 · 19-08-2014, 10:06

If buying new I would want the boat designed for the purpose. If a used boat could be bought a a substantial discount due to rig needing to be replaced I would consider it.

ontherocks83 · 19-08-2014, 10:32

Now if there was an option to swap the mast out for lets say about an 8' tall chrome poll, maybe 4 inches in diameter, surrounded by strobe lights and a nice sound system then I think sir we would have a deal!

nimblemotors · 19-08-2014, 12:14

I'm not sure the point of the poll. Are you thinking of removing your sailing equipment and then selling the boat and want to know if it would sell?

The sailing equipment is expensive, a power boat could be a lot less expensive.
If you look at new self-builds, you can see exactly how much it costs to add that stuff, and some people just don't add it and save the money.

As already mentioned, a sailboat design has bigger rudders and boards or keels that are not needed for just a power boat and can slow it down. I'm not convinced there is much expense in adding strength for the mast/rigging in a cat, unless an unstayed mast, but perhaps.
I don't quite understand why they put 150hp in a powerboat, but only 30hp in a sailboat. It isn't like the sails make up 120hp!

Turnone · 19-08-2014, 12:17

As a novice, the idea seems legit, but what do I know? The power cats aren't as beamy but have the nice flybridge. The pricing seems similar between sailing and cruising cats of near identical LOA. The ability to tack and have reinforcements to handle the sailing loads shouldn't be a negative when just motoring.

I've often wondered why the power cats aren't more efficient? When I was looking at specs it seemed they are rated for roughly 3 nmpg (Nautical miles per gallon). I understand this isn't a normal measure but quite important to me as a future cruiser. If I were to choose the power route.

Has anyone talked to a Cat builder and asked for a quote on a cruising cat with upgraded engine/props without ANY sailing rigging? Seems that upgrading engines is an easy installation just more money for the parts. Not installing all the sailing rigging would seem to save a bunch of labor and even more on parts not purchased.

Chris

Cuttyhunk · 19-08-2014, 12:48

My Endeavourcat 36 comes in a power version. The keels are different and it has straight shafts instead of saildrives. Yanmar 125s, I think, instead of Volvo 30s.

It may be someday I decide I'm too old for the sails, and I'll swap this one for the power version. When I'm that old, having the exact same interior will make the change a lot easier! :-)

valhalla360 · 19-08-2014, 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cuttyhunk

My Endeavourcat 36 comes in a power version. The keels are different and it has straight shafts instead of saildrives. Yanmar 125s, I think, instead of Volvo 30s.

It may be someday I decide I'm too old for the sails, and I'll swap this one for the power version. When I'm that old, having the exact same interior will make the change a lot easier! :-)

Did they just change the keels and mount larger motors with shaft drive or are they completely different hulls? (not sure now but that was how they used to be)

nautical62 · 19-08-2014, 16:33

To answer your question, yes, I would buy a rig-less catamaran if it had two diesel inboards and was very heavily discounted.

I once considered buying an old Iroquois at a very cheap price - modifying the back compartments to be two outboards in wells, getting rid of all sail rigging and raising the cabin top. It would have been a cheap power cat, but more work than I cared to do. Insurance may have been an issue as well.