Three-Year Plan for First Ocean Crossing

[VirtualVagabond]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

I'd sail her over to Europe.

Store her ashore until the next year and do a couple of months in Europe.

3rd year sail her back to US. (or go further afield)

Storage (and flights) will cost a few dollars (and maintanence from a distance a PITA / $$) but more certain than betting on fx movements and a s/h boat market. but probably in the 1,000's rather than the 10's of.

Also, if you plan to use it in the med for a few seasons, you can still keep an eye out for the opportunity to sell it if you can... just don't count on it as part of your plan.

Three years before you leave, then possibly 3 seasons summers in the med/Europe... that's 6 years forward planning... that's a hell of a lot of forward planning!
What ever you plan that far out, the reality is going to be something else... but that's the adventure of cruising

[boatman61]

Year 1/ NYC - Bermuda - Azores... spend remaining time cruising the 9 Islands... well worth it... Lift out in Terciera/Sao Miguel and put a for sale sign on her and advertise as a potential ARC boat... US base in Terciera so maybe good prices on flights home...
Year 2/ Azores - Portugal - Atlantic Spain - Madiera - Canaries..... if the boat has not sold.... Oh....!! readvertise boat as ARC possible....lol
Year 3/ Canaries - Caribbean - NYC..... "Wow... did I really do that...!!"

[savoir]

Originally Posted by OrangeCrush

Wow! Thanks for the input, all.

I have to keep reminding myself of the total costs involved. Buying a boat and keeping it in various places in Europe over the course of a few years is probably not realistic for me. I definitely want to explore the Mediterranean, but chartering something out there probably makes more sense for that trip. Dalmation Coast perhaps? That will have to be a separate thing.

What I want out of this trip is to have the experience of making a real ocean crossing as a skipper. Europe to US or US to Europe both sound like good options, but I think US to Europe would be easier in some ways. Most of all because I could get the boat in advance and take my time getting it ready, and getting some practice on it. Jordanship´s idea of finding a stranded US boat and sailing it back sounds good, but I don´t know how I could arrange that in time to make the trip. I wouldn´t want to buy a sailboat sight unseen.

The trick then, as Dockhead said, is finding something in the US that will still be sold at a favorable price after VAT and CE costs. But remember, I´m not out to make a profit. I feel comfortable losing some money on this venture, within reason. It seems like there are a lot of really good deals around here...
1973 MORGAN 36T sailboat for sale in New York
1975 PaceShip Sloop sailboat for sale in Maryland

Do you guys know of any other websites I can watch to get an idea of relative prices in different countries? Any other factors I´m not thinking of besides exchange rates, VAT, and CE costs? How quickly will can I expect to find a buyer, or would I try to arrange that to some extent in advance?

Thanks a lot for the help-this is exciting!

Jack

Maybe you should back off the pedal a little and start crunching some numbers.

Take the Paceship ad that you posted. That boat could easily suck up $50k before you cast off because it is not fitted out for cruising. Have you allowed for that kind of expenditure ? I don't know the boat but just from a quick look at the pics I can see it needs: ( the prices are averages )

Stove $1,000
Chartplotter $2,500
HF Radio $2,000
Dinghy $2,000
Outboard $1,000
EPIRB $1,000
Anchors, chain and rode $2,500
Propane plumbing and bottles $1,000
Dodger and bimini $3,000 (guess)
First aid & safety $2,000
Sails $20,000 (assume full set)

Plus there are things you may or may not want such as radar, cabin fans, boat cover, sun awning, stereo, sounder, navtex, BBQ, AIS, charts and/or chips, and on and on and on . . . . . .

Buying the boat could be the easy bit.

[VirtualVagabond]

Originally Posted by savoir

Maybe you should back off the pedal a little and start crunching some numbers.

Take the Paceship ad that you posted. That boat could easily suck up $50k before you cast off because it is not fitted out for cruising. Have you allowed for that kind of expenditure ? I don't know the boat but just from a quick look at the pics I can see it needs: ( the prices are averages )

Stove $1,000
Chartplotter $2,500
HF Radio $2,000
Dinghy $2,000
Outboard $1,000
EPIRB $1,000
Anchors, chain and rode $2,500
Propane plumbing and bottles $1,000
Dodger and bimini $3,000 (guess)
First aid & safety $2,000
Sails $20,000 (assume full set)

Plus there are things you may or may not want such as radar, cabin fans, boat cover, sun awning, stereo, sounder, navtex, BBQ, AIS, charts and/or chips, and on and on and on . . . . . .

Buying the boat could be the easy bit.

The cost of boat stuff is very broad.
On another forum a member has just bought a new, complete set of Rolly Tasker sails for his Formosa 51... headsail, battenless main and mizzen, with covers, for $5700.

And Zeehag bought her boat and will have it cruise ready, albeit possibly to a basic level, for under $20,000.

Ingenuity and scrounge-ability can go a hell of a long way... and many cruisers out there doing it, would never dream of spending the kind of money listed. Of course those that have it might...

[OrangeCrush]

Agreed, I think those estimates are on the high side. When outfitting my P26 for cruising last year, I spent $700 on a nice plotter, $1000 for radar, $300 for a rigid dinghy, $300 for dinghy motor, $1000 for a Rolly Tasker genoa, $600 on ground tackle and $600 for an EPIRB. Plus the paceship ad said the boat had sails, a propane stove and safety gear.

But your point is well taken, savoir, buying equipment quickly becomes exorbitantly expensive. It would be more economical to buy something closer to cruise-ready. And as for planning ahead VV, I think in my case that would effectively work out to 20% obsessive research and 80% saving up. This current stage is more about me brainstorming to see if the idea is actually something worth working toward. If the buy it here/sell it there idea isn't viable, I'll have to go the more traditional route of saving up for a decent boat, then saving up for an ocean voyage. May take longer that way (sigh).

One thing I haven't been able to work out for sure. There are no CE issues on a European made boat, right?

[savoir]

The sails on that boat are said to be 15 years old. You would not want to head to sea without some new spares. Similarly, buying the cheapest stuff you can get is not very smart. It won't last. You must realise early that most boat hardware is made for the proverbial " weekend warrior ". That's where the profit is but most of that kind of stuff will not suit your needs.

A one way Atlantic crossing can put as much wear on your boat as 5 years of regular coastal use. You might arrive in Portsmouth with 2 destroyed halyards, all spreader patches holed, half your main slugs snapped, 2 batten pockets torn, one batten gone etc etc.

Consider some specifics - small pvc dinghy $1500, small hypalon $2000, 4hp Tohatsu $1000, Raymarine A70 chartplotter $1200 + $200 per chip, Raymarine C80 Radar $2500 and on it goes all the way to the poor house.

My bottom line from all this is to suggest that you will be better of buying a proven cruiser. There is a much better chance of obtaining various boat systems which work just fine. Some will always be junk.

[boatman61]

Ok.... my turn... these are.. as always my experience and not a recommendation... just whats possible...
I've cruised the Med, Wesern Europe, Caribbean, Azores/Madeira, and a tad of the US NC Coast and 3 solo Trans-Atlantic's
without these...
Radar
Chartplotter
EPIRB
Liferaft
Fridge/freezer
SSB/HF
AIV
Dinghy outboard

With these...
Passage Chart Nth Atlantic 1, Passage Charts Med 2, Caribean 1. Assorted Charts with isets of ports etc.. eg La Coruna to Gib... and assorted others either copied/traded/bought secondhand or new.
Laptop for communication/entertainment
Mobile phone/H/held GPS and VHF
Good Inflatable Dinghy
Decentish Sails
A boat that floated

[steamgoat]

Hi Orange Crush, While planning, don't forget the WEATHER, you say you are a teacher and have July/August off each year, while that is fine for sailing in New England, it is NOT a good time to be further south in the Atlantic, Regards Bruce.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by steamgoat

Hi Orange Crush, While planning, don't forget the WEATHER, you say you are a teacher and have July/August off each year, while that is fine for sailing in New England, it is NOT a good time to be further south in the Atlantic, Regards Bruce.

Ahh... thats where Sabaticals come in.... a 6mth one (Winter/Spring) would cover yr 3 a treat...lol

[boatman61]

Something of the wall here... you may cringe or you may like it...
As its ..'as you put it "A 3yr plan"...
Why not set it up as a Charity Project... your a teacher... so why not to raise funds for disadvantaged Kids/Schools or something.... you have a large audience built into your job... students/parents/affiliations etc.... get them involved...
You'll get publicity for raising a lot of equipment through enthusiastic donations/gifts from folks seeking kudo's through association and also a fair hand from the average 'Joe'... maybe even the boat...
Charity Funds raised through T-shirts, DVD's of voyage and places visited, raffles etc....
You get your 'Adventure'.... People have something to get involved in and learn a little about the world... and hopefully some kids somewhere get a little lift into their lives...
I don't believe I just wrote that....

PS; You Raffle the now famous boat on return to NY and make more dosh for the Charity...

[David_Old_Jersey]

Gonna need a website

and a bikini

and possibly a greased pig

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

Gonna need a website

and a bikini

and possibly a greased pig

'D'.... Donate the Bikini n pig (on loan of course..)
He'll make a fortune....
I'm sure a programmer on here could turn out his 'Website...'

[goboatingnow]

One thing I haven't been able to work out for sure. There are no CE issues on a European made boat, right?

Yes as long as it isnt an export special its easy to check there will be an obvious CE builder plate.


Also Some US builders are building RCD compliant/CE marked boats as well .
Dave

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

Gonna need a website

and a bikini

and possibly a greased pig

Just WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Get rid of the bikini (leaves lines).

BBQ that pig (have with some boat brew)!

Website would probably get blocked if sucessfully done!

[OrangeCrush]

Thanks for all the tips, guys.

I will keep watching the boat listings and continue scheming about ways to satisfy my sailing ambitions. Sailing for a charity might be a really good idea, but I'll have to think of a good connection or angle for it to make sense.

I have never been motivated by money in my major life decisions, but the desire to sail the world is really making me wish I was independently wealthy. Hopefully I can overcome that setback with some careful planning, self discipline and creativity. But not the bikini. That's a tan line I won't cross