Looking for people familiar with repairing and rigging a cal 20

[cyrano138]

I'm repairing not one, not two, but three holes in the hull this week.
I only have to repair the deck in one spot but after completely redoing the bottom (barrier coat and paint), the really big job is pulling out all the rotten bulkheads and replacing them.
at least I know how to do all that stuff. One of the things I haven't been able to figure out is how to put proper cockpit drainage into it since in this particular case the engine well has been glassed over. I bought two sets of 1 and 1/2 inch bronze thru hulls and some hose that I'm going to run from the sides of the cockpit to the alternate sides of the transom. I'm just not sure how high to put everything. Like, do I put the through holes right above the waterline? Seems like on the following sea Id get some backwash even with the hose running to the alternate side of the boat.

[TrentePieds]

SCM:

Yes, the "chain plate", the bit the back stay attaches to that is bolted to the transom, is offset. Doesn't really matter whether it's to the one side or the other. On the ones I've sailed it was to starboard. Because it lines up thwartships with the hinge line of the gudgeons and pintles (more or less), just a few inches of offset will enable the tiller to lay over the required amount for a decent turn.

You will need an OB motor I'm sure. The raising mount for the OB was on the port side of the transom on all the ones I've sailed. Mind when you fit it, that the rudder laid to port will clear the propeller when the motor is in use.

You are right, there is no need for an adjustable backstay, even if you were going to race her. We had a lot of fun racing our teaching Cal20s fifty years ago :-)

TP.

[TrentePieds]

Cyrano:

I've never seen a Cal20 with cockpit drains. Doesn't mean such boats don't exist - just that I haven't seen one. Because of that, I don't know if the cockpit sole is sufficiently far above the water line to permit cockpit drains.

Lay a 2x4 across the cockpit coamings. Then measure down to the cockpit sole and down to the boats waterline to get an idea of whether it is actually possible to fit drains.

Since it's a keelboat, I imagine you'll be keeping the boat afloat? Launching a keelboat off a trailer and setting up the rigging every time you launch gets real old real fast :-)

TP

[cyrano138]

If I don't put some drainage in there won't be any. I'd be concerned about getting swamped by a following wave. The sole is too low toput any drainage at the bottom of the cockpit, but I was thinking of raising it up 4 or 5 inches so that at least the majority of the cockpit would drain if I did get swamped. I'll be keeping mine on a mooring.

[TrentePieds]

The only time I ever thot I wouldn't see shore again was single-handing in a rented Cal20. Seriously over-pressed having only a 135 genny and having - suffering from the morning after - relied on someone else's weather forecast. Nasty! Tried to go forward to douse the genny when I realized my error, but broached before the job got done. One more broach and I woulda sunk. The water that came over the side while I was in the trough went straight down the drop slides As the bows came up on the next wave the free surface rolled in under the cockpit sole, and I lost my freeboard aft. but the stern still had enuff buoyancy to lift as the wave rolled under me and the free water rolled forward so I did a submarine in the next wave.

I got the boat under control by letting the jib sheets fly and bearing off a little. Unable to turn without broaching again and sinking, I did a thirty mile crossing to weather in 25 knots of wind and 6 foot waves like that. Puking 40 minutes out of the hour. After a while the genny blew to bits and the boat became easier to control. No fun at all, and I made landfall 40 miles from my intended destination.

So, yes! Do put drainage in above the cockpit sole, and make sure your drop slides can handle any water that gets into the cockpit. Wet feet are far preferable to a visit to Davy Jones!

TP

[cyrano138]

Oh, wow. Yeah I think even if the holes are higher than the sole by 4 or 5 inches at least 2/3 of the cockpit will drain.

[roverhi]

I would use 5200 to seal the keel to the hull. The hull/keel joint flexes so a rigid join material will crack and allow water ingress. 5200 and other flexible caulk will remain pliable and maintain the water tight seal.

From your description it seems like the cavity had a layer of epoxy laid in as leveler/filler so the keel to hull join wouldn't have any voids. They used paper or whatever so the keel wouldn't be glued to the epoxy. Sounds like you may have ground off all the fairing epoxy and may have to start over.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by cyrano138

Marine Tex on the advice of a guy who works on them a lot out in CA. I'm in FL.

Marine Tex is an epoxy I believe, that’s for bonding, not bedding.

When I got my new bolts from SealsSpars he declined to make a recommendation but pointed out they had originally been bedded in Dolphinite so that’s what I used to bed the bolts. . When I removed the bolts there looked to be cotton to but I didn’t use that.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by cyrano138

.....One of the things I haven't been able to figure out is how to put proper cockpit drainage into it since in this particular case the engine well has been glassed over. I bought two sets of 1 and 1/2 inch bronze thru hulls and some hose that I'm going to run from the sides of the cockpit to the alternate sides of the transom. I'm just not sure how high to put everything. Like, do I put the through holes right above the waterline? Seems like on the following sea Id get some backwash even with the hose running to the alternate side of the boat.

Normal Cal20s drain into the motor well. There’s a small scupper on centerline for small amounts of water. If a large amount of water comes into the cockpit it overflows the lip of the motorwell and is gone very fast.

Since the motorwell is glassed over the boat is no longer class legal. Alternate side scuppers sounds like a good idea. The cockpit sole is high enough it won’t backfill. If you are worried about following seas pushing water in the put flaps over the transom thru-hulls. You might consider putting some holes thru the glassed over motorwell.

[cyrano138]

Originally Posted by roverhi

I would use 5200 to seal the keel to the hull. The hull/keel joint flexes so a rigid join material will crack and allow water ingress. 5200 and other flexible caulk will remain pliable and maintain the water tight seal.

From your description it seems like the cavity had a layer of epoxy laid in as leveler/filler so the keel to hull join wouldn't have any voids. They used paper or whatever so the keel wouldn't be glued to the epoxy. Sounds like you may have ground off all the fairing epoxy and may have to start over.

I think the way I'm going to get around this --because I don't want to use 5200 to do the whole joint -- is to rebed the keel with Marine Tex and as I'm putting in the bolts coat them with something like silicone lubricant so that the Marine tex isn't going to make it impossible to take the bolts out again, and then when the Marine Tex sets I'm going to remove the bolts one by one and bed them individually with 5200. When I do the epoxy barrier coat on the hull I'm going to cover the area between the hull and keel flange anyway, so it won't matter if water is getting in there.

[cyrano138]

Originally Posted by Adelie

Normal Cal20s drain into the motor well. There’s a small scupper on centerline for small amounts of water. If a large amount of water comes into the cockpit it overflows the lip of the motorwell and is gone very fast.

Since the motorwell is glassed over the boat is no longer class legal. Alternate side scuppers sounds like a good idea. The cockpit sole is high enough it won’t backfill. If you are worried about following seas pushing water in the put flaps over the transom thru-hulls. You might consider putting some holes thru the glassed over motorwell.

I'm not worried about class stuff since I'm not a racer, and I considered putting the holes through the glassd-over motor well but the hose is heavy duty sewer hose and if it exits the bottom of the cockpit it'll have to dip down too low and then back up to the transom so that there will be always water sitting in the hoses.

I don't know that that's necessarily a problem but it's something I wanted to avoid. Like I was saying above I'm only worried about the cockpit filling up completely which can happen in a couple days of Florida summer rain (or getting swamped by a big wave from behind), so as long as the drain holes are somewhere in the lower half of the cockpit I'm not too worried about it. It can sit half full of water and not sink the boat. Also, I plan to build something like a cooler or storage box that will be fixed in the rear of the cockpit and reduce the volume significantly, so that if I am under way and I get swamped, there's less of a chance that the extra weight will be a hazard.

[bwhit3]

Hello Cyrano138. I am embarking on a Cal20 renovation project with my father-in-law. Not really a restoration as the boat is in pretty decent shape. Any intel you gathered on your own you can share would be much appreciated. Based out of Seattle.

[Adelie]

I have a Cal20.

What do you need to do and how do you want to use the boat?

Cruise? Daysail? Race?

Where in Seattle is the boat?

[cyrano138]

Let me know if you have any specific questions. I thought mine was pretty decent when I got it but it turned into a total overhaul. Hope you have better luck!

[bwhit3]

Thanks so much for the quick response. The boat will be located in Poulsbo. It has family significance to my wife and her sisters. Most likely day sailing and perhaps a few family overnights. No racing.

One specific question regards repainting the front deck "I’m not sure how to paint the non-skid area to both seal the deck and maintain the non-skid quality. There are coatings, over lays and things to sprinkle on the wet coating but I have never waded through all of the research."

Another is regarding the integrity of the front deck "how to repair the deck itself if the plywood core has been compromised by moisture penetrating the gel coat. I’ve read articles on how to patch the deck (generic—not necessarily a Cal 20) and I’ve heard people say that’s when you replace the boat. "