Contessa 32 vs Rival 32 vs Renown 32?

[GTom]

I am (still ) looking for a reliable, stable first boat for a family of 4. LOA must be a bit below 10.00m/32.8".

The first two above are space kings with aft cabins, etc., but their sailing reputation is in the skies. Latter seems rather spacious with an aft cabin.

Financials are of course also important with a twist: being our first boat, it probably wont be the last: true, the "celebrity" Contessa is expensive but it will be likely easy to sell in case we move on.

Besides space and seaworthyness, draft is an important factor, here the contessa with its almost 1.7m seems to be more restrictive than the other two (1.4m).

[boatman61]

How old are the kids and can they share a cabin.. reason I ask is the Renown is a centre cockpit with the aft cabin being the equivalent of 2 quarter berths below and only accessible via the cockpit..

[GTom]

The older is 4 the younger is just in.planning The aft cabin would most likely serve as storage until they grow up. Just realized that some Renowns are rigged as ketch, I'll look for sloops.

I am also looking at a Malo 40h, which is almost design identical to the Renown.

[Pete7]

What is the budget? How about this? oh just seen the size limit, shame.

1987 Moody 346 Power New and Used Boats for Sale - www.yachtworld.co.uk

[Pete7]

This will be much more family biased, which is why we bought one. The Renown and Rival are dated, the Contessa tiny, wet and I am not keen on the heads forward cabin door arrangement.

For £23k less offer this Mk 2 is a bargain.

1989 Moody 31 Sail New and Used Boats for Sale - www.yachtworld.co.uk

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Pete7

This will be much more family biased, which is why we bought one. The Renown and Rival are dated, the Contessa tiny, wet and I am not keen on the heads forward cabin door arrangement.

For £23k less offer this Mk 2 is a bargain.

1989 Moody 31 Sail New and Used Boats for Sale - www.yachtworld.co.uk

Tis lovely Pete. Really.

Missing a hull though....

[GTom]

Thanks Pete! Indeed, the Moody 31 is a decade younger. However, actual value depends on maintenance, some 40 year old boats got repowered 5-10years ago, got new sails, etc...

As for budget, I am aiming below a total of 30k£, which includes boat price and all refit needed for offshore. This can be a 30k £ turn-key boat or a 15k £ piece that can be revived on a ~10k budget.

What I am a bit worried about is iron keels, some tend to rust (counterpart of the keel-bolt nightmares of modern keels). AFAIK Rivals and Contessas have lead, Westerly and Moody are iron.

[Pete7]

Not sure if you have seen but that Moody has had the engine replaced, a Volvo 2003 was the original engine for these yachts. Since its a generation younger the layout has the heads by the cockpit locker rather than forward which I think is a much better layout.

I wouldn't worry about cast iron keels, they will still be cast iron when we have both departed this earth. Each year I grind the odd rusty bit down and slap half a dozen coats of Primocon on followed by antifoul paint, then go sailing. Occasionally I will strip the whole side of a keel (I have two) but normally doesn't need this level of work.

Pete

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by GTom

Thanks Pete! Indeed, the Moody 31 is a decade younger. However, actual value depends on maintenance, some 40 year old boats got repowered 5-10years ago, got new sails, etc...

As for budget, I am aiming below a total of 30k£, which includes boat price and all refit needed for offshore. This can be a 30k £ turn-key boat or a 15k £ piece that can be revived on a ~10k budget.

What I am a bit worried about is iron keels, some tend to rust (counterpart of the keel-bolt nightmares of modern keels). AFAIK Rivals and Contessas have lead, Westerly and Moody are iron.

Not going to debate iron and lead keels as lead is better in everyway. Few production boats are built with lead due to costs so iron has been accepted by most buyers these days. Now to give Moody a point or two they have an outstanding record with their keels and build them properly with a stub and proper bilge. They are not simply bolted on a flat spot on the underside of the hull. The bolts they use will not suffer from crevice corrosion like SS will and they are very easy to individually remove and inspect/replace either in the water or on the hard by simply doing one stud at a time. If studs are cast in to the keel your only option is to drop the keel which is expensive. Iron keels have to be properly maintained and treated with epoxy and if properly looked after will not rust. So while lead is better if your going to use iron nobody did it any better than Moody and by the way almost every stud that has been pulled from 30 year old boats has looked like new.

[Pete7]

Based on the description it has 2 Genoas, main and storm jib. Could do with the two 110 AH batteries joining together and adding a separate engine start battery rather than use one of the 110AH batteries. Could also do with a fresh water pump at the sink as well as the electric pump taps, just in case. Say £500. Add another £600 for AIS transducer and say £400 for life jackets, seeping bags etc and she is probably ready to go, after all she sails now in the Scottish Western Isles.

Otherwise it looks quite up together with dinghy, engine and liferaft. The two GPSs and newish engine suggest the owner wasn't afraid to spend money on her.

Did you clock the gate valves and the loose gas cylinder in the anchor locker on the Malo 40H.

Pete

[GTom]

Thank you Robert for the details on the keel story, sounds reassuring that it's not the "falling off"-type. As for effect on performace, the other designs I am looking at are encapsulated keels, "diluting" the lead.

The Moody looks like a good package but also keeping watch to well-kept 70's boats as well, there are some real bargain-looking offers out there, like this Longbow.

[boatman61]

The Longbow is a great cruising boat.. had mine for 4yrs and it took me from Poole down to and around the W Med for 4 yrs as a liveaboard with my then partner.. good performance to boot.

[GTom]

Originally Posted by boatman61

The Longbow is a great cruising boat.. had mine for 4yrs and it took me from Poole down to and around the W Med for 4 yrs as a liveaboard with my then partner.. good performance to boot.

Interesting, the Longbow and the Renown have an identical hulls but the Longbow has a heavier keel (same draft). Also Longbow sloops seems to me easier to find, all Renowns I saw were ketch so far. Anyway I'll check out a few before pulling the trigger.

[boatman61]

Yup.. same hull as the Berwick as well.. it's a nice hull just different versions.. long fin sloop.. centre cockpit ketch and a bilge keel in sloop and ketch versions and assorted internal layouts.
If you look closer you will see that its a scaled up version of the 26ft Westerly Centaur.
The Longbows extra 400 odd lbs is for counterbalancing the taller sloop rig.

[out42]

From experience, don't go down the Contessa/Rival route with a young family. They were brilliant at the time of their design and early sale dates, but design has moved on and greatly for the better IMO. Boats aren't built like that any more because they were so restrictive. Sailing abilities were good for their time as was interior space, but in 50 years even boat design moves on.
You will have much more fun with an F27 with kids of that age, and if the idea of a trimaran worries you, just talk to someone who has had one and ideally beg a ride. I well recall about 11 years ago leaving Cherbourg in an F27 for the return from a cross-channel race with a whole bunch of Contessas and other monohulls and then sitting in our home marina listening to the unfolding dramas of a few of the 'seaworthy' monohulls being pulled in by various life-saving agencies. The F27s are seriously seaworthy and will look after you.
You can also drive them up the beach for camping and other adventures with young kids without much thought or worry being necessary.
Choosing slow, heavy, cramped boats in the belief that they are somehow better all round is not the way to go IMO.