Can I reef the genoa?

[chubasco]

Hello fellow sailors, I'm a novice just now learning to sail on my 25 ft Watkins. Here's my question, my boat came with a main sail and a really nice Genoa with a roller furling.Before I set sail for the Bahamas next winter I was looking at backup sails including a jib sail. I have two questions, one is why couldn't one just partially use the roller curling to reduce the sail area of the Genoa? Can it be used this way? Does it act as a jib in this particular case if it's partially rolled up on the roller furling? The second question I have is using multiple sails on the furling itself. How is this done? I see two slots on the roller furling for sails. Can someone put a Genoa as well as a headsail or a staysail.. or any combination at the same time on the same furling and unfurl them at the same time? Thanks for taking the time.

[C420sailor]

Two tracks allows for the hoisting of one headsail before dropping the other. More common in racing. I’ve also heard you can run two headsails wing and wing when running, but I’ve never seen or tried that.

You can use the roller furling to reduce sail area. It isn’t optimal from a performance standpoint, but for cruising it’s fine.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by C420sailor

Two tracks allows for the hoisting of one headsail before dropping the other. More common in racing. I’ve also heard you can run two headsails wing and wing when running, but I’ve never seen or tried that.

We have done that but there isn't a lot of space or a stable platform on a small yacht if you have to use a pole as well. Our cruising chute is simpler and quicker to take down if the wind picks up.

Originally Posted by C420sailor

You can use the roller furling to reduce sail area. It isn’t optimal from a performance standpoint, but for cruising it’s fine.

Might be worth the OP seeing if this genoa has foam or rope strips just behind the luff to help take the bagginess out when its partially furled in stronger wind strength. If not then chat with a sailmaker to see if he will add them.

[Tetepare]

I hope you can do it, I did it for 26 years with one sail!

As said you won’t get the best shape, but unless racing who cares?

There are those who will say in a big blow it will unfurl and sink the boat, but never happened with my Harken or the POS ProFurl.

[chubasco]

So if I was to use the second track for hoisting a sale while the other one was still up? So that would require a second halyard? Or do you mean just insert the sale into the second slot then you just pull the other sail down and switch to how you're out

[boatman61]

Yes..

[Pete7]

Do you have a spinnaker halyard or a spare?

Pete

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by chubasco

So if I was to use the second track for hoisting a sale while the other one was still up? So that would require a second halyard? Or do you mean just insert the sale into the second slot then you just pull the other sail down and switch to how you're out

Generally you cannot switch from one sail to another using a roller furling set-up. The reason being is that the first sail is attached to the top furling swivel and when you try to pull it down the new sail's head becomes an obstacle for the top swivel.

You could conceivably hoist a second sail in the other groove if you raise the first sail by attaching the halyard directly to the head of the sail, not to the swivel. It will push the top swivel up but not be connected to it. After a second one is hoisted in the other groove, using a second halyard, drop the first one and the swivel would just stay up there.

This is called a double grooved headsail change. Common for racers (who have no upper or lower swivel) but it's quite a lot of pfaffing around for a cruiser.

It is easier to take the first sail down completely (after it is unfurled) then install the other sail on the furler.

If you want to have two sails up at once (for going downwind) you could put a second sail up in the other groove, using a second halyard, but you'd have to take it back down before you could do much with it like furl them or drop the first one.

I have to admit that while I have done thousands of headsail changes over the year I don't actually know squat about roller furling.

But sail shape...that I understand. If you "reef" your roller furling genoa to a smaller size by rolling it partially you will certainly have a reduced sail area. Some sails designed for roller furling have foam or other bulky stuff sewn into the luff of the sail which gets rolled up and reduces the bagginess. These work better. But any sail can be reefed by rolling it. The shape will be very baggy half way up the luff and it won't be very effective going into the wind. Some sails might even be damaged by the stress of sailing partially rolled up.

The best approach if you are going where you might experience higher winds is change from the genoa to a smaller headsail before you even leave the dock. It's better to be underpowered in the light stuff than over powered in the heavy stuff.

Judy and I don't even put up a large genoa when we are cruising, we use a 85% jib. It's usually enough.

[Greg Mason]

When we had our sails built, we knew we would have to furl the genoa, especially at night. The sailmaker put in a foam insert at the luff to take up the slack built into the sail, so the sail shape would remain fairly stable.

[shimari]

Here's how one person has been using the dual head sail:

https://www.rhbell.com/Simbo/simbo-d...d-sailing.html

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by chubasco

I have two questions, one is why couldn't one just partially use the roller curling to reduce the sail area of the Genoa?

That is what the majority of sailors do, in the majority of situations, assuming that they have a boat with roller furling.


The whole point of roller furling is that it is less work and requires fewer sails.


It will work fine. The sail shape won't be as good particularly if you roll in a great deal of the sail just leaving a little triangle, but it is much easier to do than a headsail change.

The second question I have is using multiple sails on the furling itself. How is this done? I see two slots on the roller furling for sails. Can someone put a Genoa as well as a headsail or a staysail.. or any combination at the same time on the same furling and unfurl them at the same time? Thanks for taking the time.

So the point here is that this is an advanced, specialized technique that most sailors never use. Racing boats that have larger crews do it to shave of a few seconds. It doesn't make sense in your situation.

If you want to switch sails then you fully unfurl the one that's on the furler, take it down, and put up the other one. Still not a routine move outside of racing. Usually people have one headsail that fits the furler and they just leave it there. Most sailors would do that if they have to put up the spare sail because the one that's already on the furler has a rip in it or something.


Sails are bulky, I would not carry a spare sail on a boat the size of your boat. On my last boat I had hanked-on sails rather than roller furling and so I always had an extra sailbag to push around the cabin. Glad to be rid of it. If your sail is in bad shape and you're not confident of it the best move is to get rid of it and get one that you believe in.


Finally, regarding nomenclature, usually the term "staysail" is used to refer to the middle sail on a cutter rigged vessel, that is, one with a main and two foresails.

[olivert]

I don't recallver seeing a furling unit with 2 tracks. This begs the question whether your boat had a furling unit or if it is just headfoil. Maybe you cold post a photo of the bottom of the unit. if it is a foil it is designed for racing to make sail changes more efficient by stopping the boat being without a headsail and providing the best aerodynamic situation as previous posts say and will not work for reefing at all

[Jim Cate]

I don't recallver seeing a furling unit with 2 tracks

You should look harder! Nearly all furler foils have two tracks these days (and for years before). Every one that I've had (6 in all) have had the twin tracks. With the exception of the NZ based Reef-rite, which boasts a means of dropping one sail and hoisting another without removing the first from the foil), there is little use for the second slot as shown in several previous posts.

Jim

[danstanford]

Don't forget to adjust the jib led car forward as you furl in a reef.

[Chotu]

Question. Why would one care if the shape of a genoa isn’t perfect when it’s partially furled?

I mean the reason you are partially furling is to take off some of the power the sail is developing. An imperfect shape will do that too. So I’m not seeing the side concern everyone always mentions about this topic.