Should there be mandatory liability insurance for boats?

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Try being a UK flagged boat cruising the Med, Caribe and US.. no problem..
I notice that my company Pantaenius has serious limits and much higher prices in the US of A.. ever thought that might have a reason.???
Wharram cats once could be insured easily.. bad Wharram owners closed that door.

Actually Pantaenius doesn't offer liability insurance in the US any longer! I wanted to use them last year in the U.S. and was told that they no longer offer liability only insurance in the U.S.

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by pcmm

Actually Pantaenius doesn't offer liability insurance in the US any longer! I wanted to use them last year in the U.S. and was told that they no longer offer liability only insurance in the U.S.

Let's please make this thread more helpful.

If you have a US liability only coverage can you state the provider and cost?

P.s. Technically if you have an umbrella coverage in the US and and declare your boat to the provider your boating liability is covered. I pay about $400 per year for 2 mil umbrella coverage, BUT you can only get umbrella coverage if you have a homeowners policy...

[Mike OReilly]

Last May I ran an insurance survey using members here, as well as over at SN. Part of the survey included questions on liability insurance. Here is the results on this part of the survey. It lists name of broker or insurer, fee paid, and region covered:

http://helplink.com/CLAFC/wp-content...ility-only.pdf

And here is the full report:

http://helplink.com/CLAFC/wp-content...nce-report.pdf

Perhaps it is time to run the survey again.

[surf_sail]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Last May I ran an insurance survey using members here, as well as over at SN. Part of the survey included questions on liability insurance. Here is the results on this part of the survey. It lists name of broker or insurer, fee paid, and region covered:



http://helplink.com/CLAFC/wp-content...ility-only.pdf



And here is the full report:



http://helplink.com/CLAFC/wp-content...nce-report.pdf



Perhaps it is time to run the survey again.

Thanks for this. Looks like it's mostly Geico and progressive for liability only in the US. What puzzling is the price variability (e.g. One Geico liability insurance is $700 per annum). Unfortunately we also don't know if these cover environmental cleanup.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by surf_sail

Let's please make this thread more helpful.

If you have a US liability only coverage can you state the provider and cost?

P.s. Technically if you have an umbrella coverage in the US and and declare your boat to the provider your boating liability is covered. I pay about $400 per year for 2 mil umbrella coverage, BUT you can only get umbrella coverage if you have a homeowners policy...

I bought umbrella primarily because of a piece of business property. Umbrella only covers you for amounts beyond your primary coverage. Someone might do the math. on minimizing all your primary insurance and buying an umbrella they are reasonable. I think it is because the primary coverage carrier generally settles any claims.
I believe it insures you. Checking on it extending to marine insurance might be a thought. Marine might be a horse of another color?

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by surf_sail

Thanks for this. Looks like it's mostly Geico and progressive for liability only in the US. What puzzling is the price variability (e.g. One Geico liability insurance is $700 per annum). Unfortunately we also don't know if these cover environmental cleanup.

Yes, I wasn’t specifically thinking about liability only when I designed the survey. We could set one up to look specifically at this question.

If you look into he full report there was a broad question about “additional coverages.” Nearly 50% reported they had some sort of “Environmental Damages” coverage.

And there is a large range of rates being paid. Not sure why that’s the case, but it underscores the advice to ‘shop around’.

[jmschmidt]

Mandatory insurance is impossible to enforce. My boat was one of those 750 boats removed by crane and barge in the BVI. (Repaired and back in charter service now) Coast Guard had nothing to do with it (thank God), private contractors did it all, working through the insurance companies in most cases. Every citizen, resident and guest in the BVI pitched in and helped get the job done, unlike in Puerto Rico. I was 7,000 miles away but would have loved to have been there to get my hands dirty along side the good people of those islands.

[jmschmidt]

Agreed. Let's please make this thread even more helpful. Your US umbrella coverage and boat coverage is worthless outside of US territorial waters. I have both, as well and a homeowner's.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by jmschmidt

Agreed. Let's please make this thread even more helpful. Your US umbrella coverage and boat coverage is worthless outside of US territorial waters. I have both, as well and a homeowner's.

It sounds like read the fine print!

[Lepke]

I have a private dock in Oregon and have to have a million dollars insurance even though it's on cedar logs, can't sink and has no fuel or pollutants. And another million on the boat.
From what I understand, most, if not all, marinas require insurance to tie up.

[dwedeking2]

I have geico liability and it covers environmental to an extent (I think 800k or 1mil). I pay a little extra for additional coverage to satisfy the marina.

The problem with mandatory insurance is that it will be capped policies so won't satisfy the people on CF that think having insurance "will make all parties right". The minimum requirement will be skewed in pricing and coverage to maximize profits as the insurance lobby will write the law.

[dwedeking2]

Originally Posted by Lepke

From what I understand, most, if not all, marinas require insurance to tie up.

Not in Florida. I was only asked here after 90 days when I changed from the transient to liveaboard category.

Most overnight transients only meet one of the minimum wage dockhands, gone before management even knows.

[Lost Horizons]

Originally Posted by pcmm

How is the govt requiring boat insurance an issue. Doesn't the Govt require you to have car insurance? or do you not have car insurance? whats the difference?

The difference is, boats are not typically operated on public roads. As long as you do not drive a car on public roads, insurance is also not required.

[markpierce]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Virtually every marina and yacht club in North America have a written policy requiring a minimum (variable) amount of liability insurance however ...... In almost 30yrs of cruising I have never been asked for proof of insurance unless booking a slip for the entire season.

Some marinas (such as Berkeley) in the Bay Area require proof of insurance even for an overnight stay. Some marinas here have limited staff on weekends and require payment and proof of insurance before one arrives.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by Lost Horizons

The difference is, boats are not typically operated on public roads. As long as you do not drive a car on public roads, insurance is also not required.

True boats are not operated on public roads, but the waterways are Public property so the argument stated above could easily be used on the waterways.