Vaccine Certification Restriction of Travel

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by cyan

There are many flaws in what you have written- or were you joking? (can't tell)
1. The annual flu shot is just a guess at maybe 3 strains of viruses that MIGHT be spreading in a future flu season. That guess is not always correct.
The new covid vaccines are NOT guesses.
2. "yet to be proved" immunity is false. Why do you think this? In fact, the efficacy testing for these vaccines has been straightforward because there are so many places where the virus is still rapidly spreading. (The Ebola vaccine testing was hindered by only small outbreaks) It's not rocket science. Give thousands the vaccine and give thousands the placebo at the same time, randomly, without revealing up front who got what. After enough time to have many confirmed virus infections, count up the infections and reveal whether the infected individuals had received the vaccine or placebo. If 95% of these total infections were in individuals who only got the placebo, then Bob's your uncle. Proven.

There are many good questions, but you are not asking them, as you seem lost in a sea of misunderstanding. Can the immunized person carry the virus without getting sick? We don't know. Are there any long-term health effects of tricking your cells (with mRNA) into producing spike proteins? We don't know. Will enough people get a vaccine to eradicate this thing, in spite of all the weird misconceptions? We don't know.

In that case how can an unvaccinated person be a threat to a vaccinated person..
I was raised where many diseases were rife, smallpox, leprosy, TB (my dad got it), diphtheria, malaria, polio amonst others and vaccines were not widely available out there back in the 50's.. Smallpox and polio vaccines I had around 10yrs old.. Measles and mumps I contracted, but life kept going with none of the brewha of today over a 98%+ survival rate infection.
WTF has happened to people over the last 60yrs that has led to mass arse pucker..
Immunity is also an unyet proven thing, how long if at all, if folk catch it and recover only to catch it again as has been reported.
Medical science is far from perfect as history has shown with survivors of the more recent mistakes still walking amongst us and Big Pharma usually denying responsibility and fighting not to compensate its victims...
Mind this time there's no come back on them as not only have the taxpayers funded the research, they will also end up paying for the vaccinations and.. Governments have granted immunity from any prosecutions should it be a cluster flock.
Remember how medical science sold Opiates as the miracle pain relief for the masses.. today you have millions of Pharma addicts..
Medical science denied Cannabis had any medical value for decades yet today its recognized as a safe treatment for MS and various other ailments..
So forgive me if I take it with a grain of salt for now and trust a proven 72yr old prescription..
My Immune System..

[JRSHAW]

Originally Posted by CarlF

Yes. No one needs to be vaccinated if they would prefer to live alone. But of course they don't want to live that way.

Those who do believe in vaccinations have always been a large majority and have frequently restricted the movement of those who don't. You really can't blame it on the government or the drug companies - the great majority of voters want it.

This is nothing new. Before we could prevent disease with a vaccine, we isolated sick people in special camps - that's why the leper wanted Jesus to cure him.

==============================

Well said

[billgewater]

Originally Posted by cooper1991

I have no plans to risk my life with an untested vaccine but it seems like the powers that be will give us a choice (a) take the vaccine, get a certification card and travel wherever you like (b) don't take the vaccine and you can't leave your country. It is an assumption that the covid PCR tests/isolation periods will be phased out putting more pressure on taking the vaccine.

This is without looking at the deaths, palsy and other vaccine side effects so far and not considering the views that there's a global strategy of de-population.

I want to buy a boat. I refuse to take an untested, possibly dangerous vaccine.

For liveaboards and world cruisers, does anyone share my concerns, or are they groundless?

Just full of factual errors, unwarranted implications and totally irresponsible. Please don't even consider sailing to Australia.

[DEAN2140]

"This is without looking at the deaths, palsy and other vaccine side effects so far and not considering the views that there's a global strategy of de-population"

Are you suggesting that the vaccine is part of a Qanon conspiracy to rid the earth of certain undesirables? No vaccine can cure such wacky thoughts.

[clockwork orange]

Originally Posted by DomPerignon

Quantas already announced they will require proof of vaccination to be allowed onboard. That is forced vaccination.

Their choice, you don't need to fly Quantas.

[cyan]

Originally Posted by boatman61

In that case how can an unvaccinated person be a threat to a vaccinated person..
I was raised where many diseases were rife, smallpox, leprosy, TB (my dad got it), diphtheria, malaria, polio amonst others and vaccines were not widely available out there back in the 50's.. Smallpox and polio vaccines I had around 10yrs old.. Measles and mumps I contracted, but life kept going with none of the brewha of today over a 98%+ survival rate infection.
WTF has happened to people over the last 60yrs that has led to mass arse pucker..
Immunity is also an unyet proven thing, how long if at all, if folk catch it and recover only to catch it again as has been reported.
Medical science is far from perfect as history has shown with survivors of the more recent mistakes still walking amongst us and Big Pharma usually denying responsibility and fighting not to compensate its victims...
Mind this time there's no come back on them as not only have the taxpayers funded the research, they will also end up paying for the vaccinations and.. Governments have granted immunity from any prosecutions should it be a cluster flock.
Remember how medical science sold Opiates as the miracle pain relief for the masses.. today you have millions of Pharma addicts..
Medical science denied Cannabis had any medical value for decades yet today its recognized as a safe treatment for MS and various other ailments..
So forgive me if I take it with a grain of salt for now and trust a proven 72yr old prescription..
My Immune System..

I think you listed many good reasons to be wary of big pharma and government messaging. I give a bit more weight to information from accepted journals The Lancet, JAMA, etc. The speed of the vaccine race means even some of the safeguards are lagging, such as peer reviews and long term studies. Should we wait for 12 months to see if the vaccines provide immunity for at least that period, or proceed with the jabs? Most want this thing to end sooner than that. Where I live (California), we proceeded with cannabis before long term medical studies. That turned out pretty well as far as I can tell.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by cyan

I think you listed many good reasons to be wary of big pharma and government messaging. I give a bit more weight to information from accepted journals The Lancet, JAMA, etc. The speed of the vaccine race means even some of the safeguards are lagging, such as peer reviews and long term studies. Should we wait for 12 months to see if the vaccines provide immunity for at least that period, or proceed with the jabs? Most want this thing to end sooner than that. Where I live (California), we proceeded with cannabis before long term medical studies. That turned out pretty well as far as I can tell.

Yup.. I was treating a lady friend who suffered from MS with Lebanese Gold crushed and sprinkled over stewed rhubarb then covered with crumble and baked till golden back in the 80's.. one slice was enough to let her sleep through the night without spasms constantly waking her through the night..
Lost that drawn exhausted look in a very short time as quality of life improved, it's also very good with bronchial problems..
As for Efficacy Trials.. they have recently started in the UK.. should have the results late 2021..

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by boatman61

... how can an unvaccinated person be a threat to a vaccinated person..

The idea is still to stop transmission. An unvaccinated person is still a potential vector of transmission. A country with too few vaccinated will still have big problems with waves of infection, additional serious illness and deaths.

Immunity is also an unyet proven thing, how long if at all, if folk catch it and recover only to catch it again as has been reported.

Have a peek. Here too. We wouldn't be going to the trouble of vaccinating if it seriously looked like it wouldn't work.

So forgive me if I take it with a grain of salt for now and trust a proven 72yr old prescription..
My Immune System..

wow. Do you even know how a vaccine works? (hint - immune system)

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

wow. Do you even know how a vaccine works? (hint - immune system)

Actually I do know how a vaccine is supposed to work thank you.. like the disease it's supposed to trigger one's immune system to create antibodies and battle the invading virus or bacteria but using dead/inert samples of the disease.
Some immune systems however are lazy, that's why you may need a flu shot and I don't.
Wow.. Are you always so superiorly smug..

[Dave Lochner]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Actually I do know how a vaccine is supposed to work thank you.. like the disease it's supposed to trigger one's immune system to create antibodies and battle the invading virus or bacteria but using dead/inert samples of the disease.
Some immune systems however are lazy, that's why you may need a flu shot and I don't.
Wow.. Are you always so superiorly smug..

This is how most vaccines work. However, this is not how the Covid vaccine works. My technical knowledge is limited I this area, however, as I understand it, the vaccine is a protein that mimics the spike that allows the covid virus to enter a cell. This protein is what triggers the immune response and the body remembers for some unspecified time how to make the antibody if the real virus shows up.

Vacine researchers have been studying this kind of process for years. Covid gave it them the first chance to apply the science. It seems to be working quite well.

At least until the virus mutates, which seems to be happening if you watched the news today. In South Africa and the UK there appears to be a variant that is more virulent.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Dave Lochner

This is how most vaccines work. However, this is not how the Covid vaccine works. My technical knowledge is limited I this area, however, as I understand it, the vaccine is a protein that mimics the spike that allows the covid virus to enter a cell. This protein is what triggers the immune response and the body remembers for some unspecified time how to make the antibody if the real virus shows up.

Vacine researchers have been studying this kind of process for years. Covid gave it them the first chance to apply the science. It seems to be working quite well.

At least until the virus mutates, which seems to be happening if you watched the news today. In South Africa and the UK there appears to be a variant that is more virulent.

There is also a vaccine being developed using the traditional method of an inert sample of the virus.. I will wait for that to deliver its results..
The UK mutation was discovered a few days ago and is alledgedly 70% faster with transmission rates leading to Boris cutting right back on the planned Christmas break in the S/SE of England.. Likely Scotland will follow and NI is already on a six week Lockdowns.
Potency is as yet unknown.

[Boatguy30]

Originally Posted by zeehag

if new zealanders are allowed to freely return to their nation why is it a friend of mine, a kiwi, is disallowed to return to his home in new zealand..
c

Unless he has some legal problems, the current issue is quarantine hotel rooms. Believe they are now booked out next 2 months. Doesn’t help that customs is randomly subjecting yachties to quarantine in hotels after also completing a recognized sea time quarantine. Obviously a small number of rooms being allocated to this, but would have happily given him my at the Grand Millennium Auckland

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Actually I do know how a vaccine is supposed to work thank you.. like the disease it's supposed to trigger one's immune system to create antibodies and battle the invading virus or bacteria but using dead/inert samples of the disease.

Some immune systems however are lazy, that's why you may need a flu shot and I don't.

Wow.. Are you always so superiorly smug..

No it just means you may not have been in contact with the actual flu virus.

for the first time ( im now 60 ) i got my free flu jab.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

No it just means you may not have been in contact with the actual flu virus.

for the first time ( im now 60 ) i got my free flu jab.

I think I have been in contact with it a few times.. including a with couple of partners who got it over the years..

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by boatman61

I think I have been in contact with it a few times.. including a with couple of partners who got it over the years..

That’s just man flu