Non-Marine Generator Choices?

[Manateeman]

Gentlemen. Please. Do not joke about nuclear. Gasoline just destroys things and people within a limited range and finite time. Nuclear ? So let’s just set aside an unwanted event and also pretend there is some sane way to dispose of the spent fuel. With what means are you prepared to repel someone intent on forcibly taking your mini-reactor as material for a dirty bomb. Surely not ...wait for it...starting your construction generator and opening the exhaust dump valve ? Will the noise and fumes drive them away? Or will they think you’re only another stinkpot.
Mark, a manatee now equipped with a n95 mask, welding goggles, ear plugs, a Geiger counter and potassium iodine pills.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

Gentlemen. Please. Do not joke about nuclear. Gasoline just destroys things and people within a limited range and finite time. Nuclear ? So let’s just set aside an unwanted event and also pretend there is some sane way to dispose of the spent fuel. With what means are you prepared to repel someone intent on forcibly taking your mini-reactor as material for a dirty bomb. Surely not ...wait for it...starting your construction generator and opening the exhaust dump valve ? Will the noise and fumes drive them away? Or will they think you’re only another stinkpot.
Mark, a manatee now equipped with a n95 mask, welding goggles, ear plugs, a Geiger counter and potassium iodine pills.

It’s evident why you have 2 stars.

[Michael Cobbe]

EFI generator (Ryobi).Two prorblems it will have to be used on deck and the noise will drive boats near you mad. The other thing is you have to ensure that the CO cannot reach inside the boat. This is a full list of the problems:
Generator Safety | Boat Safety Scheme | Go Boating - Stay Safe


It is something I would not do.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

Gentlemen. Please. Do not joke about nuclear. Gasoline just destroys things and people within a limited range and finite time. Nuclear ? So let’s just set aside an unwanted event and also pretend there is some sane way to dispose of the spent fuel. With what means are you prepared to repel someone intent on forcibly taking your mini-reactor as material for a dirty bomb. Surely not ...wait for it...starting your construction generator and opening the exhaust dump valve ? Will the noise and fumes drive them away? Or will they think you’re only another stinkpot.
Mark, a manatee now equipped with a n95 mask, welding goggles, ear plugs, a Geiger counter and potassium iodine pills.

We're not joking.



We don't have to pretend about spent fuel disposal -- a commercial permanent deep geologic facility has just been opened in Sweden.


And the contents of a boat-sized reactor won't even be the start of a dirty bomb. A scrap x-ray machine will be more useful for that purpose. No one will be interested.



I'm totally buying one of these as soon as they are available -- can't wait.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Michael Cobbe

EFI generator (Ryobi).Two prorblems it will have to be used on deck and the noise will drive boats near you mad. The other thing is you have to ensure that the CO cannot reach inside the boat. This is a full list of the problems:
Generator Safety | Boat Safety Scheme | Go Boating - Stay Safe


It is something I would not do.

You should have read the whole thread instead of googling the list of problems.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

We're not joking.



We don't have to pretend about spent fuel disposal -- a commercial permanent deep geologic facility has just been opened in Sweden.


And the contents of a boat-sized reactor won't even be the start of a dirty bomb. A scrap x-ray machine will be more useful for that purpose. No one will be interested.



I'm totally buying one of these as soon as they are available -- can't wait.

And you could build the cost of disposal into the purchase price, along with incentives not to dump the reactor when its lifespan runs out. Proper disposal being putting the spent fuel aboard a properly designed spacecraft and sending it into the sun.

Although the deep geological method is fine as well I’d think.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Chotu

And you could build the cost of disposal into the purchase price, along with incentives not to dump the reactor when its lifespan runs out. Proper disposal being putting the spent fuel aboard a properly designed spacecraft and sending it into the sun.

Although the deep geological method is fine as well I’d think.

Sending it to the sun will be much more expensive.

Deep geological method seems fine.

Sorry, brain fart, the permanent waste disposal facility I was talking about is not in Sweden, but in Finland:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onkalo...uel_repository

Waste is already being put into it. I think a similar one is being built in Sweden.

The Finns are serious about carbon-free electrical power. Their grid is already 90% carbon-free and they are building the first third generation European Pressurized Reactor in Olkiluoto, and another new plant in Hanhikivi, to take their nuclear power from 30% today to over 60% by the end of the 2020's.

Electrical power in Finland is the cheapest in Europe. Smart guys.

I would love to have the first nuclear-powered yacht in the Baltic.


Naturally, you build the cost of waste disposal into the purchase price of a recreational reactor (like the sound of that ). Every kWH of electrical power sold in Finland has a small surcharge for nuclear waste disposal (and is STILL the cheapest in Europe). They have collected a fund of €1.2 billion already so far, but the Onkalo plant will cost less than €900 million, so they've already paid for it!

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I'm totally buying one of these as soon as they are available -- can't wait.

I wouldn’t hold my breath, it may be feasible, I don’t know, but I wouldn’t expect any of us to live to see it.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by Chotu

That’s correct. After all the design work, these are exactly what I’m using.

The best fit the design parameters while being easiest to install and rather nice looking compared to other options.

As long as you can keep lines from snagging on it, a far better solution than a marine unit.

My Dad's camper was 40yrs old and the original air/con had never had any work done to it. Yes, we beach camped, so it saw salt air. You might consider some sort of cover, for rough conditions that would send waves over the top of the boat. Worst case you can buy a brand new air/con unit for maybe $700 and install it in an hour.

Compare that to a marine unit at 3-4 times the cost, a day or two to install. Regular checking and maintenance on the water cooling system, etc...

Assuming you have sound insulation for where you are mounting the generator, I wouldn't worry too much about buying the gold standard inverter honda/yamaha units...when you hear people talking about having one for 10-15yrs, 10-15yr ago they were the only game in town for quiet inverter generators, so that doesn't prove they last longer than some of the newer brands. They are nice but they are 2-3 times the cost. Also, when running flat out (ie: running the air/con units), inverter generators aren't noticably quieter. Most of the sound benefits happen at low draw.

You would have to look at the energy audit of your power usage, but you could probably downsize to around 4000-5000w generators. Continuous draw is usually around 1200-1500w for an RV air/con unit...so two would be 2400-3000w. As long as you don't try to start them simultaneously, that would leave you a little overhead for some misc other electrical draws.

One issue to look into is the fuel delivery. A lot of brands use gravity feed, so while it's possible, supplying fuel for longer run times requires some thought. The small hondas were easier as they used a fuel pump, so a simple suction device added to the fuel cap could hook you into a 6 gal marine tank.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I wouldn’t hold my breath, it may be feasible, I don’t know, but I wouldn’t expect any of us to live to see it.

It would be a mistake to hold breath of course.


We shall, as they say, see.

[CarlF]

You might investigate attaching an aftermarket catalytic converter to reduce CO, particulate and especially NOx emissions. Given your respiratory issues you want to avoid NOx as much as possible. There's a lot of evidence that Covid cases have been higher in areas with where people breath more NOx from diesel exhaust that has caused long term damage to their lungs.

There's no current way to reduce marine diesel's very high NOx emissions so the marine industry does it's best to ignore the considerable health danger.

The new Tier 4 engines actually put out more NOx than the old Tier 1. (the SCR systems for trucks have so far not become available for marine engines and they have serious problems in marine use). But a tri-catalyst catalytic converters on a gasoline engine remove well over 80% of NOx along with a lot of other stuff.

It's one thing to be spewing NOx from a propulsion engine where you leave it behind in your wake. A diesel genset running in a windless anchorage leaves you breathing an elevated level of NOx all night.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

As long as you can keep lines from snagging on it, a far better solution than a marine unit.

My Dad's camper was 40yrs old and the original air/con had never had any work done to it. Yes, we beach camped, so it saw salt air. You might consider some sort of cover, for rough conditions that would send waves over the top of the boat. Worst case you can buy a brand new air/con unit for maybe $700 and install it in an hour.

Compare that to a marine unit at 3-4 times the cost, a day or two to install. Regular checking and maintenance on the water cooling system, etc...

Assuming you have sound insulation for where you are mounting the generator, I wouldn't worry too much about buying the gold standard inverter honda/yamaha units...when you hear people talking about having one for 10-15yrs, 10-15yr ago they were the only game in town for quiet inverter generators, so that doesn't prove they last longer than some of the newer brands. They are nice but they are 2-3 times the cost. Also, when running flat out (ie: running the air/con units), inverter generators aren't noticably quieter. Most of the sound benefits happen at low draw.

You would have to look at the energy audit of your power usage, but you could probably downsize to around 4000-5000w generators. Continuous draw is usually around 1200-1500w for an RV air/con unit...so two would be 2400-3000w. As long as you don't try to start them simultaneously, that would leave you a little overhead for some misc other electrical draws.

One issue to look into is the fuel delivery. A lot of brands use gravity feed, so while it's possible, supplying fuel for longer run times requires some thought. The small hondas were easier as they used a fuel pump, so a simple suction device added to the fuel cap could hook you into a 6 gal marine tank.

Ahhhh. You understand!!!

This is exactly the design philosophy. These air conditioners run for decades without any maintenance at all. They cost less and can be replaced in an hour if needed at low cost.

This is my design philosophy for the whole boat. To use as many items like this as possible so I’m not spending my life fixing things in exotic places. Common, off the shelf items, no through hulls below the waterline and keeping the weight off.

The simultaneous start is why I need the bigger generator I think. It’ll be annoying to have the power drop out every time they decide to kick on the compressor at the same time or when I’m running a battery charger too or other loads at the same time.

The lines aren’t on the roof of my deckhouse at all so I should be good to go there. I have a sail control area like the forward cockpit in a gunboat.

[rslifkin]

With 2 A/Cs, the 5.5kw generator seems reasonably sized to me. Especially being that it should provide headroom to run a water heater and do some battery charging while both A/Cs are running.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

With 2 A/Cs, the 5.5kw generator seems reasonably sized to me. Especially being that it should provide headroom to run a water heater and do some battery charging while both A/Cs are running.

Can you clarify? That’s 5.5KW continuous output?

Hot water heater is on demand propane (located outside) so it’s not a factor in electrical loads thankfully.

[NaClyDog]

Originally Posted by Chotu

The simultaneous start is why I need the bigger generator I think. It’ll be annoying to have the power drop out every time they decide to kick on the compressor at the same time or when I’m running a battery charger too or other loads at the same time.

Are any of the soft start units not compatible with those types of air conditioners?