New wind generator install

[DanCan]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I'm glad you did. And I'd really love to hear back from you if you do go ahead with it.


I like my SilentWind, but if it ever died (it's going on eight years old now), I'm not sure I'd replace it. But if there was something just as good at the price you're talking, I'd definitely go for it.

Has anyone used a hydro generator as the third option for power?

[Matt Johnson]

Originally Posted by Nightsky

Good to know. I almost didn't ask the question, not wanting anyone to know I was considering cheap, Chinese stuff, but I figured I can't be the only one thinking it, and there are probably some that have already tried it. Not that many decades ago, people thought the same of Japanese products, now they are synonymous with high quality. I think the Chinese are the same, they can build to any spec that the market demands, including high quality.

I proudly worked for Toyota, so totally understand that logic

Matt

[warrior 90]

Have no experience with wind gen. I get along well with solar till now.
However I am open to play with the idea. At just 4 amps that is 1150 watts per day.
How realistic is it to make steady 4 amps.

To put this a little more in perspective....
A 40 Qts Engel freezer Mod.MR040F-U1
Power Consumption: Variable from 0.7- 2.7 Amps (12V DC)

I compare 1150 watts is about average 6 hours of solar @ 190 watts.
I also think 500 watts to the batteries at night when there is no solar could make quiet a difference to the state of charge of the battery which might be an important difference to life cycles of the battery.
I would like to know more about real live production numbers.

As to the noise. I asume it´s the design of the blades and not the generator. Can´t imagine there is a noticeable difference in regards to noise between the high end and the el cheapo ones.
So where is the difference in blade design between one and the other ?

Another interesting question about the noise might be the RPMs required to produce a certain amount of power. Now we are getting to the design of the rotor and stator of the permanent magnet alternator.....
How much copper ?
How many magnets ?
What quality of magnets ?
Is there a difference between the expensive marine PMAs and the cheap Chinese PMAs ?

The rest to my knowledge is a question of quality of the housing, the bearings and the slip rings.

Is there more to it ?

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by DanCan

Has anyone used a hydro generator as the third option for power?

Yes, we have hydro as well as solar and wind. If you plan on doing some long downwind passages or your AP pulls a lot of power (or other sources), this is where the hydro shines. We installed the hydro before we installed our AP and assumed it was going to pull a ton of power. To our surprise the AP is generally very frugal on power consumption.
Another consideration for hydro is boat speed. Similar to the wind gen., look at the power curves to see what type of boat speeds you need to get good output from the hydro.

[DanCan]

Originally Posted by Bill O

Yes, we have hydro as well as solar and wind. If you plan on doing some long downwind passages or your AP pulls a lot of power (or other sources), this is where the hydro shines. We installed the hydro before we installed our AP and assumed it was going to pull a ton of power. To our surprise the AP is generally very frugal on power consumption.
Another consideration for hydro is boat speed. Similar to the wind gen., look at the power curves to see what type of boat speeds you need to get good output from the hydro.

Thank you for the response!

[Nightsky]

I pulled the plug and went ahead and ordered a 400W unit from Amazon: YaeMarine Wind Turbine Generator, 400W 12V Wind Turbine Businesses 5 Blade Wind Controller Turbine Generator kit for Home/Camping
by YaeMarine
4.5 out of 5 stars 2 ratings
Price: $159.89 & FREE Returns
Now I have to assemble parts for the install such as wiring, bridge rectifier,breaker and shutoff switch, etc. I want to connect it to a Victron Solar charge controller so that I can integrate in to my Victron setup with CGX display. Does this sound feasible? What about a brake? Any ideas on that?

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by warrior 90

Have no experience with wind gen. I get along well with solar till now.

How realistic is it to make steady 4 amps?

It isn't realistic at all to expect a 4 amp average from a wind gen unless you are in very windy conditions. Also in combination w/solar (and you have good solar input), typically the solar controller will reduce or totally shutdown the input form the wind gen during the day and the wind gen will kick in at night.

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Most of my cruising has been at mid-high latitudes (upper 40/lower 50 degrees North). As you say, in the summer we do great for solar. Long daylight hours and short nights mean the batteries are always happy June through most of August.

But I do notice that as we move into September and beyond that it takes longer each day to get back to full battery charge. Luckily it tends to get windier at the same time, which is where the wind-gen really helps.

Mike's comments are from direct experience and are IMO, spot on. His suggestion to max out the solar first is a very good one.
If you combine wind and solar, another basic question is what are the charge characteristics of the wind gen controller (if separate)? If you have a sunny, windy day will the wind gen be useful or will it be shut down due to the solar.

Originally Posted by warrior 90

Now we are getting to the design of the rotor and stator of the permanent magnet alternator.....
How much copper ?
How many magnets ?
What quality of magnets ?
Is there a difference between the expensive marine PMAs and the cheap Chinese PMAs ?

The rest to my knowledge is a question of quality of the housing, the bearings and the slip rings.

Is there more to it ?

These questions are interesting and do play into the design features, but realistically good luck getting finding out this info from the manufacturers. Not to go down the political rabbit hole here, but would assume all the parts are Chinese made and are either assembled in China or sent somewhere else then assembled.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by warrior 90

Have no experience with wind gen. I get along well with solar till now.
However I am open to play with the idea. At just 4 amps that is 1150 watts per day.
How realistic is it to make steady 4 amps.

The problem with wind is, it is quite irregular. Some days I'm making more power than I can ever use. But a lot of the time it's closer to 1-2 amps. Commonly at anchor it is zero.

So it depend on your location, the season, and also the type of win-gen you get. My experience with Air-X and now Silentwind (both very similar wind-gens), is that they didn't produce anything till about 12 knots. Here my Silentwind will start to show maybe 1/2 to 1 amp charge. By around 15 knots we're up to around 2-3 amp, and from there the power curve climbs steeply. At 25 knots I'm seeing something like 18 amps, and I've seen sustained 25 amps in a near-gale conditions.

Originally Posted by warrior 90

As to the noise. I asume it´s the design of the blades and not the generator. Can´t imagine there is a noticeable difference in regards to noise between the high end and the el cheapo ones.

So where is the difference in blade design between one and the other ?

I don't know for sure, but I suspect you're correct. This is what led to one company creating the famous "blue blades" for the Air-X types of wind-gens. These apparently made those screamin' banshees a lot quieter. I never tried that, but I did end up with a SilentWind, which is made by the same blue-blade company. And the SW comes with the blue blades, and yes, it is pretty quiet.

Originally Posted by Nightsky

I pulled the plug and went ahead and ordered a 400W unit from Amazon: YaeMarine Wind Turbine Generator, 400W 12V Wind Turbine Businesses 5 Blade Wind Controller Turbine Generator kit for Home/Camping
by YaeMarine
4.5 out of 5 stars 2 ratings
Price: $159.89 & FREE Returns
Now I have to assemble parts for the install such as wiring, bridge rectifier,breaker and shutoff switch, etc. I want to connect it to a Victron Solar charge controller so that I can integrate in to my Victron setup with CGX display. Does this sound feasible? What about a brake? Any ideas on that?

That's great. Will love to hear how it goes (literally love to "hear" it).

With regard to the controller connection, I'm not sure if you can run a wind gen through an MPPT (if that's what you have). I think you'll need a separate, or perhaps different, charge controller for the wind. At least that's how mine is set up.

[Discovery 15797]

I'm again with Mike on this one...I like my SilentWind, and it is far better than the Rutland 913 I had previously.

Rutland is a fine and quiet wind generator; however, I think the SilentWind is just as quiet (if not more so) and more efficient in energy conversion IMHO.

I also have 600 watts of solar, and the wind generator helps on cloudy / rainy days. Of course it also depends on where you are. Steady trades help tremendously.

A couple of tips....

Make sure you get a unit that either has an automatic or electric (switch) brake that retards or stops the blades in winds above 30 - 35 knots.

Use 3/8" or 1/2" rubber pads between the pole that the wind generator is mounted on, and also the support poles (if they mount to the hull) to deaden any vibration.

If you have an SSB...use lots of toroids.

Most of these units come with PWM charge controllers. There is some debate as to whether PWM or MPPT is better for wind generators, but MPPT is more efficient for solar. If you use the PWM for your wind, use MPPT for your intended solar panels.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Discovery 15797

...Use 3/8" or 1/2" rubber pads between the pole that the wind generator is mounted on, and also the support poles (if they mount to the hull) to deaden any vibration. ...

This is a really good tip. I think a lot of the noise from wind-gens are due to hull or mast vibrations. I've got mine mounted on it's own mast as far aft as possible. It sits on a rubber pad, and I have the mast snugged in with a couple of smaller lines which act as dampeners.

Just for reference, our SilentWind is located on our boomkin, aft of our open cockpit. With it running full-tilt we carry on normal conversation without any need to raise our voices over the sound it makes.

This, to me, is critical. I would not live with a noisy wind-gen, so I'll be very interested to hear Nightsky's report.

[Discovery 15797]

Originally Posted by Nightsky

Now I have to assemble parts for the install such as wiring, bridge rectifier,breaker and shutoff switch, etc. I want to connect it to a Victron Solar charge controller so that I can integrate in to my Victron setup with CGX display. Does this sound feasible? What about a brake? Any ideas on that?

Victron solar controllers will not work with a wind generator.
https://community.victronenergy.com/...d-turbine.html

As for a brake, it appears you will have to drill a hole in the tail and install a pennant to swing the unit around manually to reverse airflow to stop the blades, then secure the blades with a bungie.

Interesting it states that "safe wind speed: 45 m/s." That's essentially Cat 2 hurricane winds....very little is safe at that speed.

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

This is a really good tip. I think a lot of the noise from wind-gens are due to hull or mast vibrations. I've got mine mounted on it's own mast as far aft as possible. It sits on a rubber pad, and I have the mast snugged in with a couple of smaller lines which act as dampeners.

+3 to use vibration dampeners to reduce noise. We made our mizzen mast mount for the wind gen. and added extra vibration dampening to reduce noise. The wind gen mount post is glued in w/5200 to the arm that is mounted to the mizzen and then we have also have rubber pads between the arm and the mizzen mast.
We sleep in the aft cabin and the wind gen is very quiet. There is a slight increase of whir when the wind pipes up and find this helpful to possibly check up top.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Bill O

...We sleep in the aft cabin and the wind gen is very quiet. There is a slight increase of whir when the wind pipes up and find this helpful to possibly check up top.

At night I can usually tell within a few knots how fast the wind is blowing just by listening to the whir. I find it rather comforting to be able to cock an ear without ever having to get out of my nice cosy berth.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

At night I can usually tell within a few knots how fast the wind is blowing just by listening to the whir. I find it rather comforting to be able to cock an ear without ever having to get out of my nice cosy berth.

We can’t hear our wind gen inside when it’s actually producing power, but have gotten odd looks when we mention to other people that it was gusting to 15 amps last night!

[Simon B]

I replaced my bathroom and I took the Chinese copy of the beautiful German model glass sliding door. The man selling it said " You can replace it three times for the price!"
It think this applies here (except for the noise) but it is so that many wind generators look similar to what is offered on Aliexpress. Even Apple is made in China!
What I'd like to know what are the differences in blade design, some wrap around the horizontal axel and others a the fan type. The wrap around I've noticed where particularly silent, see screen dump, ant experiences?
https://www.aliexpress.com/af/windtu...20200315065801