Radar is now redundant ?

[Erik de Jong]

Originally Posted by sv_pelagia

But apparently we're some sort of "edge case".

Whatever, if it keeps them away....

I hate to break it to you, but the strongest tidal currents in the world are not in BC, but in Norway. 20+ knots to be precise.

[sv_pelagia]

Originally Posted by Erik de Jong

I hate to break it to you, but the strongest tidal currents in the world are not in BC, but in Norway. 20+ knots to be precise.

Don't need to break it to me...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saltstraumen

How are the Norwegian deadheads? [emoji6]

[Erik de Jong]

As devastating as in BC or in my new home town Sitka

[guyrj33]

Originally Posted by BB7

Ok, thanks for the many responses, clearly radar still has its fans !

Maybe I should have play with my system and see if I can get a better resolution. Its really only at night or in fog that it becomes useful, and any ships the radar has found are more accurately shown on the chart plotter by their AIS info, which includes their speed. However, I shall go to work...

We use GPS to identify any anchor dragging on a stormy night, rather than radar which uses much more power.

Many thanks, BB7.

IMHO it sounds like you were hoping everyone would agree with your opinion that radar wasn't needed. But I think the real issue is you don't fully understand your navigation instruments.
You already have Radar, take the time to really learn how to use it. Get someone knowledgeable to help you.
I also have to suggest that you work to understand the accuracy and repeatability of GPS and associated AIS information.

[SV__Grace]

This has been a very foggy winter in PNW and our radar has allowed us to continue cruising rather than waiting for days for the fog to clear.

As other have said, using radar in an anchorage to gauge distance between nearby boats is useful. It's a good tool for identifying if a neighboring boat is dragging their anchor.

While all commercial traffic has AIS, I would estimate that 50% of recreational boats do or use it in inshore waters (such as Puget Sound). How can I estimate that? I have mine on all the time!

I notice that naval ships and smaller military boats (except for escorts), as well as law enforcement usually do NOT transmit their AIS, so if you try to rely just on your chart plotter w/AIS for navigation you risk colliding with an aircraft carrier or surfaced submarine or law enforcement boat- but they will probably hail you on the radio or PA system to yell at you before that happens, so no worries!

My radar also helps me identify hazards in the water- dead heads, logs, fish/crab trap bouys, etc. A bird in the water can look the same on radar as a crab trap, but better safe than sorry in the dark or dense fog. When you're a displacement boat going 3-6 knots you can use your radar and have time to identify and avoid these hazards, but not if you're planing fast.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by SV__Grace

A bird in the water can look the same on radar as a crab trap, but better safe than sorry in the dark or dense fog. When you're a displacement boat going 3-6 knots you can use your radar and have time to identify and avoid these hazards, but not if you're planing fast.

That becomes an issue at times just trying to identify things visually. I've spotted or dodged a piece of debris that turned out to be a bird multiple times.



The speed thing is a big point. I've got a boat that can plane, but as far as I'm concerned, if it's dark or visibility is bad, we're restricted to running at slow cruise only (6.5 - 7 kts for us). Only way I'd run faster at night is if some urgent situation required it (can't really think of anything that would) and I'm in an area with minimal debris risk and little other traffic.

[SV__Grace]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

That becomes an issue at times just trying to identify things visually. I've spotted or dodged a piece of debris that turned out to be a bird multiple times.

I was remiss not to mention that using radar for smaller objects in the only works in calm conditions, otherwise there is too much noise from wave action to be useful.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by SV__Grace

I was remiss not to mention that using radar for smaller objects in the only works in calm conditions, otherwise there is too much noise from wave action to be useful.

That too. In some conditions, you just have to run as if you're guaranteed to bump something at some point as there's no way any equipment or eyeballs will see it in time.

[Moontide]

Originally Posted by mnh

I would refer you to Rule#5 for the definition of a lookout.
If you are involved in a collision in the fog, or at night, assuming you survive , and it goes to trial, the prosecutor may ask “radar..why not?”. Instead of “why”……
mnh

I think maybe you have implied something that is not in the rules. My recollection is that you are required to use all "available" tools/equipment. I am not aware of any cases where there was liability assessed against a boat that did not have radar on board, only if it was available and not used when appropriate.

[rick bertram]

Radar is still needed and will be for some time. All boats are not required to have AIS. Sure most commercial vessels have it however private boaters are not required to have it. Using radar in conjunction with AIS gives me a pretty clear picture of what’s out there.

[GoodFolkes]

My boat only receives AIS it does not transmit! I have been on a wait list for 4 months to get one that transmits. Can you see me at night without radar?

[Manlio Laschena]

Originally Posted by BB7

With a large screen displaying GPS location on a super detailed chart, and AIS streaming from every other vessel, I wonder if Radar is now an outdated and redundant technology?
I have radar, but very rarely use it since the GPS chart is better.
Will soon be speccing up a new boat, and wonder if Radar is worth having.

Thoughts from your experience ?

I do not agree. Apart from other's comments I like to point out that with a bit of experience and some training, radar is very usefull to see bad weather approaching and help to avoid it for a safer routing

Manlio sy.Amarose HR40

[svfinlandia]

Originally Posted by rick bertram

Radar is still needed and will be for some time. All boats are not required to have AIS. Sure most commercial vessels have it however private boaters are not required to have it. Using radar in conjunction with AIS gives me a pretty clear picture of what’s out there.

Even if every boat in the world had an AIS transponder radar would still be essential IMHO.

Al, S/V Finlandia

[Statistical]

Originally Posted by rick bertram

Radar is still needed and will be for some time. All boats are not required to have AIS. Sure most commercial vessels have it however private boaters are not required to have it. Using radar in conjunction with AIS gives me a pretty clear picture of what’s out there.

Yeah requiring AIS (and turned on) for all vessels in national waters even above say 27 ft is unlikely to happen for decades if ever.

Although many of us would consider it stupid to take a large boat out without a radio there is not even a VHF requirement for privately operated boats (non-commercial, no paying customers) under 65.5 ft. So yes today you could legally operate a 65ft sailing or high speed motor yacht with no radio much less AIS.

[theBigKahuna]

Yes, radar is necessary... 2 recent events come to mind and, yes, we love our AIS.

A couple months ago we were doing a night crossing from the FL Panhandle to Little Manatee River. Our primary MFD failed us coming down Ole Miss so.... no radar. We comforted ourselves because, yes, we have AIS. However, around 3 a.m. on a moonless passage all of a sudden this LARGE fishing vessel pulled along side about 200 yards to our stbd beam. Scared the bejesus out of me.

Recently we were anchored in the Everglades waiting out a small craft advisory. We were communicating w/ the vessel next to us whether to head out or wait another day. He indicated that his RADAR showed the squall that had just passed was the brunt of the storm and the next 2 were 'milder'. We had forgotten radar picking up storms as we hadn't had radar in so long. We did humbly ask him that if he noticed a big one headed our way to give us a shout out on CH16.

Your call, but I'd rather not be without radar.

Cheers!
jBrad
sv Fuzzy Logic