Newport, RI to Lake Erie - options for deep draft sailboat

[RDB]

Thanks to all for the responses. I'm up to speed on the air clearance issues in the canals and have a plan (will be shipping mast to either Oswego or Buffalo if I don't go the long way around through St. Lawrence). I've also read a lot about the locks and boat handling, as well as viewed a number of videos. Will have several crew members and lots of fenders... My main concern is the draft - don't want to get far into the canal and find it too shallow. Doesn't seem like there are a lot of options if you get stuck.

I'm also comfortable with the COVID situation - meaning it is what it is. That information is well published, so will just have to wait and see.

I've reviewed the materials on the NY canals website and seen the areas listed that denote shallow areas. Does anyone have advice on how to get the most up to date information on the water levels and accuracy of the published photos of low depth areas? I tried calling the NY Canal Corp phone numbers but got no answer.

Also appreciate everyone's advice on the journey, but this is a delivery, so mainly interested in speed. I'll take my time on the way back when I have a favorable current and more time to enjoy the ride.

Seems like Oswego is a deeper canal so worst case I have to go north there and do the Welland to get to Erie. Would love to be able to transit the entire Erie Canal to Buffalo, though. Seems like the shortest way.

[Captain Graham]

Here is the up-to-date info page for the Erie Canal.
(You will need to click on the 3 sections to get the details)
Below is the summary of the 3 sections.
You will have no problems if you stay in the middle of the canal.

https://www.canals.ny.gov/navinfo/index.html#water

EASTERN ERIE CANAL
14 foot minimum depth unless noted otherwise; Lowest overhead clearance is 21 feet.

CENTRAL ERIE CANAL
12 foot minimum depth unless noted otherwise; Lowest overhead clearance is 18.8 feet.

WESTERN ERIE CANAL
12 foot minimum depth unless noted otherwise; Lowest overhead clearance is 15.6 feet.

[Floaton]

Newport to Lake Erie is a nice trip. Going up coast and down St. Lawrence avoids you taking the mast down but is VERY LONG and against the current flow on the St. Lawrence. We spent a summer in the great lakes and the route up Hudson was most enjoyable- Schedule to have the mast taken down at Hop O Nose and put back up at Oswego Marine. Both are very experienced. This year, the snag could be if the Erie Canal does not open fully due to covid/repairs. last year it opened very late. Transiting the canal/locks can go from serene to terrifying. Be sure you have 3 crew and know where the ends of your boat are with the mast hanging out. DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT be in a hurry. High winds are no go through the locks as well as across Oneida Lake. Last but not least, be sure to have 3 people on board to go through the welland canal to lake erie- they require it and have people you can call to the tune of $500 for the 6 hour trip! ouch.

[rslifkin]

In particular, with the high winds warning about the locks: high winds aren't so bad when going up unless it's crowded (by the time you get to the top and are fully exposed to the wind, you're getting ready to cast off and get moving anyway). Going down, high winds can be a real nightmare (I've made the mistake of pushing the limit twice now). You end up having to try to keep the boat in place and secured while exposed to the wind for a while while the lockmaster gets the doors closed, walks to the other end of the lock and starts dropping you.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by RDB

Also appreciate everyone's advice on the journey, but this is a delivery, so mainly interested in speed. I'll take my time on the way back when I have a favorable current and more time to enjoy the ride.

If that's the case, price up trucking it. Once on the trailer, it can be there by the next day.

St. Lawrence is going to be a much longer trip that sounds inconsistent with quick delivery. I would figure a month at least and you have to be careful not to let time pressure you into going out into bad conditions. (now if you had a full summer to make an adventure out of it...totally different situation).

You might try the Erie Canal with the idea that if you run into depth issues, you can pull up and get a transport company to get you the last couple hundred miles. The mast will already be down, so no issues prepping the boat for transport. Good chance in the spring, the snow melt will give slightly higher water.

[AiniA]

Originally Posted by Floaton

Newport to Lake Erie is a nice trip. Going up coast and down St. Lawrence avoids you taking the mast down but is VERY LONG and against the current flow on the St. Lawrence. We spent a summer in the great lakes and the route up Hudson was most enjoyable- Schedule to have the mast taken down at Hop O Nose and put back up at Oswego Marine. Both are very experienced. This year, the snag could be if the Erie Canal does not open fully due to covid/repairs. last year it opened very late. Transiting the canal/locks can go from serene to terrifying. Be sure you have 3 crew and know where the ends of your boat are with the mast hanging out. DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT be in a hurry. High winds are no go through the locks as well as across Oneida Lake. Last but not least, be sure to have 3 people on board to go through the welland canal to lake erie- they require it and have people you can call to the tune of $500 for the 6 hour trip! ouch.

Oswego Marina cannot do a mast for a boat this size unless they bring in a crane (3 hour minimum). We did our mast (Bristol 45.5) at Katlynn marina in Sodus Bay which has a big crane and skilled crew. If mast is on deck you need a calm Lake Ontario for thee 20 miles or so. I would check with Hop O Nose to make sure they could do it. Seems to us that the canal people take two routes when a section is shallow. They may find the deepest path around shoal until they can get around to dredging. They add buoys as needed. Often the shoaling happens where a creek enters the canal and the shoal reaches 3/4 of the way but there is a way around. If the shoal extends across the canal, we ran into this just east of Lake Oneida, they get there quickly to dredge. The work crew will direct you as to where to go. I doubt there was more than 6' when we went through. No way to predict where or if you will run into problems. Going direct to Buffalo is best if you can manage it. I would not be worried about keeping the mast on deck, but I have done the canal numerous times.

[Benz]

It's impossible to speak to speed for going 'round, with so many variables. Average boat speed needs to be factored in; weather; are you willing to go upriver at night (I was)? I took twelve days of pushing hard to get from Mingan to Sorel-Tracy, but my boat is small and my outboard engine not powerful. I'd definitely budget a month, but again, I like to stop and smell roses when I can.

[Northbound44]

Originally Posted by Benz

It's impossible to speak to speed for going 'round, with so many variables. Average boat speed needs to be factored in; weather; are you willing to go upriver at night (I was)? I took twelve days of pushing hard to get from Mingan to Sorel-Tracy, but my boat is small and my outboard engine not powerful. I'd definitely budget a month, but again, I like to stop and smell roses when I can.

Without wanting to decrease your enthusiasm for this project, I would like to remind you that the border is currently closed and may still be closed for a good part of next summer.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Northbound44

Without wanting to decrease your enthusiasm for this project, I would like to remind you that the border is currently closed and may still be closed for a good part of next summer.

And on that note, the Western Erie is the only route that doesn't involve Canada.

[sscoll]

Fella noted putting your mast on deck. If you do the Erie route there's a self serve lift at Castleton on Hudson you can use to take your own mast down. You wind up giving some cash to the bar tender for use of the lift and everyone is happy. There should also be any number of large 2x4 "X"s laying stacked against one of the sheds. We were told that any of them without names on them were fair game so we found two and lashed them in place to support the mast above head height. You leave these in Tonawanda and they travel back and forth along the canal for folks just like you to use. Wardell's Boat Yard in Tonawanda will help you restep your mast.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by sscoll

Wardell's Boat Yard in Tonawanda will help you restep your mast.

Go up the Niagra River a bit.

Wouldn't use Wardell again. Horrible attitude and not helpful.

[Benz]

Originally Posted by Northbound44

Without wanting to decrease your enthusiasm for this project, I would like to remind you that the border is currently closed and may still be closed for a good part of next summer.

The OP can worry about closures: he asked for a time estimate in simply the navigation portion. The closures are a separate factor to consider, but have little bearing in how many miles a transit would be. Miles and tides are constant in the ever shifting world of politics.

[rognvald]

We sailed from Chicago to the Gulf of St. Lawrence two years ago(1750 miles). Your draft is really not a problem, even on Lake Erie if you watch your charts, but I would never sail west on the St. Lawrence against the current with its 20 foot tides, ripping currents, and tricky, bolder-strewn navigation. We did the Southern route going East and there is no safe place to anchor until you get close to the mouth of the Gulf and between waiting for tides and calculating currents, it would be quite a nerve-wrecking trip. Then, factor in weather and you have a complicated journey. However, some have done it but I wonder if they would do it again? Your chartplotter, IMO, is worthless. And, it cost us about $2400.US for all the charts/guides needed. You should be proficient in chart navigation. This is no daysail. However, it is breathtakingly beautiful.
Safe sailing . . . Rognvald

[ikebartlett]

I’ve made the Passage via the St. Lawrence twice in the last 4 years. Cape Cod to Nova Scotia ( beware you can only clear Canada Customs in Yarmouth or Halifax area marinas, due to COVID you can’t go ashore for 14 days but you can buy fuel and have groceries delivered). Clearing in Yarmouth is better as it starts your quarantine clock 2 days earlier the Halifax. One free easy lock to bypass Cape Breton or enjoy Lake Bras Dor, From Rivere Renard(Fox River) you’ll have to play the tides almost up to Quebec City, there is a great little book that gives tide info that I followed(the tidal currents are not what you’d expect, the book give very accurate times before and after lower and high tides to travel) then only the current from Quebec. You’ll need 2 aboard for the Locks from Montreal to Lake Ontario and 3 onboard for the Welland Canal, it’s a stunningly beautiful trip, About $600 in lock fees, My 5 knot vessel did the trip in 17 the first time and 27 the second because I stopped to site see a bit.
FB Sailing Florence Clara

[jr_spyder]

Another resource for the canals is Active Captain which generally tends more towards power boats than sailboats, and you'll be a power boat in the canals. A quick glance shows quite a few entries along the way. Worth a look.