Going up the mast on an older boat

[Howie Curd]

I recently purchased a 1978 Cape Dory 27. The rigging is strong based of of our inspections of the standing rigging (we have not inspected the standing rigging above what is observable on the deck) we have replaced the halyards and purchased a bosun chair. We are going to use both halyards and have one person manning each one. I was wondering if anyone had any advice on how to make this as safe as possible. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[psk125]

As safe as possible? Lower the mast. It’s stepped on deck and sending anyone that weighs more than 100 pounds up to the top of the 34’ mast, with two other people handling lines below, sounds like it could quickly turn into problems. Others, if you’ve actually gone up the mast on CD27’s, please chime in. I wouldn’t do it.
It should be simple to rig a line to a jib halyard, undo the forward lowers, and gently ease her back. Perhaps tie off the butt of the mast to keep it in place (holding it might be difficult because of the leverage) and have some people ready to catch it. Having someone with a 2x4 pole with a “Y” at the end could help catch it before outstretched hands could.

[sanibel sailor]

I used to routinely go up my CD 26 mast. I use Petzl ascenders and a Lirakis harness. Just climb a halyard. Check halyard first to be sure no chafe etc. Safe. I never had a problem. I am 170 lbs and no sense of stability problems. Much easier than cranking up. Several orders of magnitude easier than dropping mast, which is an accident prone process. Not hard on a trailer sailer, but the balance point is 17 feet up. That's a lot of leverage and a long 2x4 to catch it with. Not too difficult to damage the mast as a DIY process.

[carlosproa]

ATN climber or DIY gear using the same concept as repelling

[Jim Cate]

I agree that there should be no stability issues, and also that using some form of ascent other than cranking up with the halyard winch is advisable. On boats of this size, said winches are not powerful enough for that task. Cranking up even a smallish man will over stress the gear, but the halyard(s) themselves are quite strong enough (if in good nick).

Going aloft is far easier than dropping the mast, and learning the process is an important bit of knowledge for the skipper of every boat... and this won't be the only time access to the masthead is needed.

Jim

Jim

[LittleWing77]

Hey Howie,

Let's see. First ensure your CD27 is tied off as securely as possible to prevent excess movement while you're aloft.

Then, generally, I give a stern caution to those on deck manning the winches and lines that this is one of the most dangerous things one can do on a boat and they will literally have my life in their hands so I would like them to pay attention. (It never works, but I always do try.)

Get yourself situated in your bosuns' chair so it's not going to cut off the circulation in your legs while you're seated in it and make sure you've got it secured to the primary halyard in some sort of double-fashion. (Depends on the set-up) and secondary line (and person on that halyard) ready to take up the slack. If you have halyard clutches, make sure the winch-people understand their use for on-the-way up/on-the-way-down - and how to control the speed of ease for on-the-way-down.

Now, before going aloft, check your tools. Do you have the tools you need? Are they safely stowed so they're not going to fall on anyone's head or through your deck?

Finally, climb as much of your way up as possible. Hang on to shrouds, etc. "One hand for you, and one for the boat" still applies when going aloft...

Um, that's my checklist as far as I can think at 5:00am... can anyone else think of more Top Tips?

Warmly,
LittleWing77

[Gary Mc]

Good advice above, we always tie our halyards with a bowline rather than depend on the shackle and have a second halyard manned by another person as a safety.

I also always tie a light line to the bosuns chair so if you do need another tool etc. once you are up there, you can just haul it up.


As to stability, years ago a friend had a Shark which is a light weight 24 footer. We talked our friend Rick into going up the mast. Once there we went side to side rocking the boat and gave him quite a ride!

He was not impressed, we probably had him rocking over 25 degrees but no real problem with stability.

[rhubstuff]

Tie your heavier tools with a lanyard led to your tool bag. And once you're up there, tell everyone below to get away from the mast in case you drop something. A small pair of pliers can really hurt someone if its dropped from that height. If you're unsure of what you'll find up there, take an extra long line with you that you can drop to the deck so your crew can send up that cotter pin that you dropped.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Howie Curd

I recently purchased a 1978 Cape Dory 27. The rigging is strong based of of our inspections of the standing rigging (we have not inspected the standing rigging above what is observable on the deck) we have replaced the halyards and purchased a bosun chair. We are going to use both halyards and have one person manning each one. I was wondering if anyone had any advice on how to make this as safe as possible. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

How old are you? It shouldn't be a problem for someone fit.

[Mo Surprises]

The key word here is “older” boat. I too have an older boat, a 1979 CSY 44. One of my jib halyard snap shackles broke two days ago. A half hour ago I climbed the mast (steps) to the top, grabbed the halyard and fed it down. No big deal although the the halyard was slightly jammed in the Harken block and I had to yank on it a bit. Climbed back down and was fiddling with the halyard to untangle a twist when “bam”, here comes the Harken block and jib halyard a tumbling down with a near miss.

Two points, NEVER trust an old fitting, be it a block or shackle with your life, and two, I need to put focus on my old rigging! I never saw what was obviously an almost broken shackle attaching the block to my mast head. Neither of the items that broke are original, and have seen their share of saltwater use.

I swear that’s a true story and I just learned an important lesson. So be careful going up that old mast.

[roverhi]

The ATN mast climber or mountain climbing gear are the way to go. No need to take other people away from what they are doing or trust them to haul you up safely. If someone can't go up the mast with either of these climbing aids they need to seriously evaluate their fitness. I'm 75, a bit overweight, and not in great shape but go up the mast once a year or more often with this gear.

Look at the expense as a long term investment in gear you should use at least once a year to check out your rig for as long as you own a boat. Of course have back up lines on another halyard using Prusik or Kleimheist knots. Never climb on a spinnaker halyard. The blocks take a beating and the cranes are quite often a bent 1/4" rod welded to mast head.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YsM...6Eir9EaZC9y-Lj

Sailboat Gear- ATN Sailing Equipment
Mast Climbing:

Mast Climbing

Have used the set up in this video but with a climbing harness. It works but the climbing harness is not comfortable for hanging for longer periods. Notice they used the seat/harness from the Mast Climber in the video. The Ascender/Grigri system is cheaper to put together, but not by a whole lot, than the Mast Climber. Going with off brand hardware and a used bosun's chair could bring the cost down. Limited experience with the system, a couple times up the mast. Initial experience, it seems to take a little more effort to climb with it than the ATN Mast Climber. Using both legs and arm felt iike more work than the Mast Climber system. Flash!!! Now that I’ve had a little more experience with the rig, Can climb faster but still no easier than the Mast Climber.

Way easier and faster to descend, however though you do have to do some rerigging to come down and go back up. To descend have to remove the ascender and foot straps which is a little scary and takes some time. Don’t overshoot on the descent cause you’ll have to rerig the ascender to go back up even an inch like if your forget to release the safety Prusik knot. The Grigri was so easy to use. Could descend as fast or slow as I wanted with virtually no effort.

Had to make some modifications to the foot straps mainly sewing a bit of seat belt material onto the stirrups to hook them together so had leverage against the mast. The rock climbing harness that I used had high rating for comfort but wasn't comfortable for more than a trip up the mast and very limited work while up there for me. The waist belt began to dig into me and was quite uncomfortable. Tried another harness and that dug into my legs. That’s why i highly reccomend getting the ATN seat/harness if you can find one and still keep your limbs after paying for it. The climbing rope doesn't have to be anchored to the deck with climbing gear which makes swinging out to work on spreaders or around the mast to work on the side opposite your climbing line. People say GriGri’s are line diameter sensitive but mine works on 5/16” through 1/2"

Have a Mast Climber that I've used extensively. The foot straps work out of the box. The harness/seat is very comfortable and safe for working hours aloft. The ascenders are a little clunky in use and hard on my hands releasing them to climb or descend. There were/are two different types of ascenders that came/come with the Mast Climber. The early ones are black anodized aluminum and have to have the climbing line fed from the end. They only work if you have external halyards or a dedicated climbing line hauled up by a halyard. The current version ascenders are gold anodized. They can be fitted anywhere on a line so no need to thread the bitter end of the climbing line into the ascenders. Find it easier to use with the climbing line anchored to the mast and winched tight. Climbing is straight forward and relatively easy with either type ascender though not a walk in the park. Descending is its weak point as you have to carefully gauge how far you move the ascenders down the rope. It’s the opposite of climbing but hard to gauge how much you move the foot and seat ascenders if you only use them once a year or so. Lower the foot ascender too much and you can't release the seat ascender and vice versa. You have to reposition the foot or seat ascender to be able to release the opposing ascender and descend. Takes more energy than you'd expect with gravity working with you. It was slow but you get in the rhythm the more often you use the system. It still gets you down but takes longer than the GriGri though maybe not if you include the rerigging that the GriGri requires and especially if you overshoot on the descent and have to reinstall the ascender/foot straps to go back up.

You could do the Mast Climber thing with just rope and Klemheist or Prussik knots and a bosun's chair or climbing harness. Use one length of line for a foot strap and another for the chair/harness and up you go just as you do with the Mast Climber ascenders. One word of caution, the Prussic knots on the 5/16" halyard locked up on me when put under load. Discovered this when I kept forgeting to slide the Prussik knot safety line down as I descended with the Grigri. Had to take tension off the P/K knot with the ascender foot harness and physically loosen the P/K knots to get them to slide up or down. Don't seem to remember this happening on the 3/8” or larger halyards on my otther boat so it may have something to do with the smaller rope diameter.

Caution about Bosun's Chairs. Without a restraining strap that will keep you on the seat it's really easy to slide forward off the seat and find yourself hanging by your armpits. That is dangerous especially if you silde completely through the seat and fall free. At best it can be difficult to get back onto the seat. The Mast Climber chair/harness has heavy duty leg restraints that keep your butt firmly in place on the seat. Best of all, the seat is so damned comfortable I spend way too much time when I climb the mast with Mast Climber seat enjoying the Zen moment because of the seat..

Safety lines. Use a separate line/halyard with a Prusic or Kleimheist knot always attached to your seat/harness. If something should happen to the primary line, you'll still be hanging around up there. A fall of even a few feet can be painful and 10' or more deadly. Keep a separate line to rig if you ever end up suspended by your safety line. If your primary line fails you'll still be hanging around unharmed BUT you'll have no way to get down on your own. With a second Prusik/Klemheist knotted safety line that you can rig, you can use that as the foot stirrup to work your way down. Would save you the embarrassment of having to flag down passers by to call the fire department to get you down.

I've got low stretch, Dyneema/Spectra cored, dacron covered halyards and use them to climb. Way better when working at the mast head as you can get a few critical inches higher than with a dedicated climbing rope tied to a halyard. When you tie two ropes together, as you would with a separate climbing line, the knots take up critical space that limits how high or even if you can get your head above the mast head. Halyards won't work as the climbing line if you have wire halyards or have stripped the dacron cover off your exotics so don't do that. The low stretch exotics make climbing a lot easier as you waste way less effort with lines that don't stretch. My favorite is T-900 as stretch is practically zero even in 5/16" but it's way pricey and stiff. If you are replacing halyards, do at least one in the lowest stretch line you can afford. Even StaSet X takes less energy to climb on than straight Dacron double braid.

[check327]

Hello Howie, I have been in your position and have tried both methods(hoist vs. ascenders) on a 27ft. boat and much prefer the ascenders. If I may suggest, get full size ascenders that your whole hand fits in, not the small "glacier travel" kind. Petzl and Black Diamond make excellent ones. You will need a climbing harness, a couple of locking carabeiners and 6-7 regular beiners(not bent gates), 2 prussik loops, a pair of etriers, a belay/descending device like a BD ATC and your tools in a strong bag with really strong handles. If you are unfamiliar with aid climbing I would refer you to a text like "Mountaineering, Freedom of The Hills" or similar and PRACTICE what you learn on the ground because once you start up you are on your own and need to be solid with the concepts.


Choose the strongest halyard sheave(not spinaker halyard) and secure both ends of halyard to a strongpoint near the base of mast and clip an ascender to each side of the halyard. If possible, tie in to another strong halyard and have a mate belay you on that rope. Clip your etriers to the ascenders with a short sling from the top ascender to a chest harness, and attach a prussik loop above the ascenders, around both lines, that goes to your harness. Now you are ready to climb the ropes with a safety from the prussik in case something goes south down below. Trail a line to pull up your tool bag and bosuns chair(attach to both lines w/ prussik).



When it's time to come down, if you have a mate belaying you, they can lock off the belay line while you detach the ascenders and lower you. You can leave the prussik on just in case until you get down. If you are alone, you will not be able to descend the halyard you climbed because it's secured at the deck; grab another halyard and load it into the ATC and rappel that line. You can rig a prussik on your rappel line as a safety.



Sorry for how long-winded this reply became but I kept thinking of things as I wrote. It's not rocket science but it's not trivial either and the price for failure is high. Please acquire the gear well ahead of time and practice with it before attempting your repairs. And for sure pick a calm day; any rolling of the boat will feel like you're getting a slinshot to the moon. Good luck and be safe.

[DanCan]

I’m subscribed to this guy, not saying you don’t know how to climb at all, just saying I found it interesting. But I wouldn’t trust an old fitting, I agree with Mo Surprises.
https://youtu.be/2txLv9yb1hw

[MJH]

Originally Posted by Howie Curd

I recently purchased a 1978 Cape Dory 27. The rigging is strong based of of our inspections of the standing rigging (we have not inspected the standing rigging above what is observable on the deck) we have replaced the halyards and purchased a bosun chair. We are going to use both halyards and have one person manning each one. I was wondering if anyone had any advice on how to make this as safe as possible. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Going aloft can be done safely with a good plan. Think of everything you want to accomplish with the person aloft. Pick a good weather day with the boat secured as much as possible from traffic wakes.

In picking the person to go up, selecting someone lighter is a strong consideration...I prefer using my stepdaughter who is mechanically savvy and not afraid of heights (my mast top is 54' above the deck).

Always pick a halyard that goes over the mast top sheaves, never an attached block, i.e. spinnaker block. Use main halyard for work aft and use jib halyard for work forward of the mast. Route the line to the largest winch available, some folks use their anchor windlass. The second halyard can follow as a safety backup. NOTE: My professional rigger won't use my wire-rope halyards but always rig their own. However, I always use my halyards and have never had a problem.

Use a long handled winch handle for more torque, have a second man tailing the winch rope, don't trust the self tailing winch function...always tie off the line when at the top.

Chair should have appropriate straps to keep the person in the chair including a crotch strap. Tape the shackle closed that attaches the chair to halyard. The person going up should help as much as possible pulling himself up via shrouds, etc. Think of everything plus tools he might need and put it all in a bag attached to chair with long enough line to lower to the deck if need be. The man in the chair and at the winch must stay in voice contact on the way up and down...so turn off all other noise/music sources...no distractions, all business while someone is aloft!

Lastly, for safety no-one should be standing under the mast while work is being done incase of a tool, etc. being dropped.

Good luck.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH

[sanibel sailor]

If your halyard winches are mast mounted, as they are stock on a CD, how does one stay out from underneath while winching? Also, if I recall the stock winches on the CD are #7 non self tailing... Different situation from those with bigger boats.