How to de-install marine head for composting

[zachduckworth]

Ok, so phase 1 of the de-install is complete. The saltwater intake valve is gone along with the head itself, and hoses going from the head to the first y-valve. I managed to dump a cup or two of gunk into a hard to access spot underneath the shower sump. I’m not sure how to access that area, and it did not seem to drain into the bilge. Ugh.
After than happened I cleaned up the pedestal that the toilet used to sit on in preparation for installing the Nature’s head. I need get the holding tank out still as well as the remaining stinky 13 yo hoses, pump, and y-valves. Lots of grossness left to go..

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by zachduckworth

Lots of grossness left to go..

Sounds like you're making excellent progress . Removal is, by far, the worst part of this transition. Luckily you only have to do it once (unless you get another boat with a stink old standard marine head ).

[pcmm]

I would cut out the old tank to complete the removal of the old system. The rest is just typical gutting of a system.

My boat had bladder tanks when we got it 9 years ago. We ripped all of it out and intitially installed a C-head, which we liked. Last year we installed an OGO in the aft head and the wife loves it. She won't use the C-head any longer. This summer the C-head is getting its own send off and replaced with an OGO

As for the unit you install, I would highly suggest looing at an OGO. much more compact than a Natures head and I think better thought out. It does require 12v as it has an electric agitator for the solids, a level monitor for the liquids and a built in fan...

[mvweebles]

BTW - another compost head has hit the market. Looks pretty small - probably for VanLife types along with Ogo size. Would have worked well on my old Newport 28.

https://mytrelino.com/

Three sizes priced from $350-$525. I have no affiliation whatsoever.

[zachduckworth]

Ok, so here is my plan for removing the holding tank...
I'm going to take a jig saw and cut the top off the thing.
Then I'll shove some diapers in it. A a dozen or so until it is competley sucked dry.
Then I will extend a siphon pump into the hose that goes to the Whale pump. I'll suck all the gunk out into a bucket. Later on that'll go into the marina toilet.
Then I remove the Whale and the hose leading to the outlet through hull.
At that point I'll remove the rest of the holding tank.
And that'll be that. Any reason that couldn't work?

[peghall]

There's a much easier way:


Everything you need to get out of the tank is on the bottom, so before you cut the top off the tank (I'd use a sawzall instead of a jigsaw, btw), put 4-6" of water into the tank via deck pumpout fitting, cuz that sends the water into the tank at the bottom so it can stir up the sludge (if you've already removed the pumpout line, the water will still fall into the tank at the bottom)and hold it in suspension so it can be pumped out ...pump that out... repeat, repeat till you're sucking out only clean water. Use a shop vac if it's too late to pump out. don't worry if you have a spill,you have to clean the bilge anyway. Dump the shop vac into a marina toilet...after the first rinse out,you should be able to dump the shop vac over the side.

Now you're ready to cut the tank out.

--Peggie

[jen1722terry]

There have been some threads on CF over the years on converting to a composter.

Bascially, what we did was keep the holding tank and installed a NH with the liquids tank drilled and plumbed into the old hose from the head to the tank. Otherwise, if you're living aboard like we do, you have to empty the liquids every few days.

Now we pump out the liquids from our 18-gallon holding tank every 2-3 weeks. If we're in an unrestricted zone off shore, we just pump the liquids overboard.

Much less work and we don't get much sludge in the holding tank. We do flush it with a hose before each fall haul out.

We also spray some vinegar in the head after each pee. This seems to keep the hoses open and minimizes sludge build up.

We love our composter if, for no other reason, we've haven't had to clear a clog in our head or worry about sinking the boat by forgetting to flip off the valve. The NH has really improved our live aboard experience.

Cheers, happy #1 and #2!

[bvimatelot]

Ahh - Marine Heads - don't we just love 'em!! My experience with composting heads is that its a messy game taking an over-filled pee container to where one can dump it. Maybe that's improved since I used one a few years ago. However - I do reckon that it is better than having "all electric". I did a transatlantic delivery with a boat that had all the bells and whistles and 3 electric heads. Electrics failed and we had to revert to "bucket and chuck it". Not to mention hand steering, sextant and papercharts but that's another dit.

[EdenRose]

I recommend keeping the black water tank and using it to direct from the liquids portion of the composting toilet. Carrying the tank throught the boat is a pain. And you can likely discharge the liquids legally from the black water tank.

[X Fernandez]

Originally Posted by zachduckworth

Ok, so phase 1 of the de-install is complete. The saltwater intake valve is gone along with the head itself, and hoses going from the head to the first y-valve. I managed to dump a cup or two of gunk into a hard to access spot underneath the shower sump. I’m not sure how to access that area, and it did not seem to drain into the bilge. Ugh.
After than happened I cleaned up the pedestal that the toilet used to sit on in preparation for installing the Nature’s head. I need get the holding tank out still as well as the remaining stinky 13 yo hoses, pump, and y-valves. Lots of grossness left to go..

I made this shift 3 years ago when I moved aboard. One clogged joker valve was enough to get me into a Tyvek suit with a respirator and gloves. But yeah, it was a nasty day.

Could not be happier with my Natures Head tho. No smell, cleans up easily, just keeps working. I have a couple of notes:

I used the extra space created by removing the tanks to install a reverse cycle AC. Nice.

My deck pump out fitting was conveniently located more or less above the new head location. I ran the exhaust hose directly to the old fitting. Then I found an 8” PVC pipe that matched the size and threading of the fitting on the deck and made a standpipe for the exhaust. With a cap at the top, drilled with holes to ventilate and screen to keep bugs out it keeps the deck water out. Again, the location of the fitting is luckily located where it doesn’t interfere with any rigging. I’d rather be lucky than good.

I’m haven’t looked at the OGO heads but I will say that the Natures head sits pretty high. It’s the only complaint I ever hear about it. The hardest part is convincing my male friends they need to sit to pee. Makes everything easy of they do.

X

[jen1722terry]

I don't sit to pee in our Nature's Head. Unless they've changed the design (our NH is 11 years old) you can pee in the bowl standing up, if that's your style.

Great things, composters. Simple, very little maintenance.

We do note that, in the solids tank, we only add about 3 inches of peat moss in the tank bottom in the spring, then add a few tablespoons of peat moss after each use. This seems to abosrb nearly all excess moisture and makes emptying the solid much more pleasant, or as pleasant as this chore can be, at any rate.

Cheers to all. Spring's on the way for you northern folks.

Anyone want to buy a nearly new, 2013 Honda 2.3 hp outboard, let us know.

[zachduckworth]

Update!

So on Saturday I finally finished the project. I had already removed the toilet and the salt water intake line, and the two lines (connected at an elbow joint with a vent) going from the toilet to the first y-valve (split to direct discharge or holding tank.

On Saturday I completed the following:

1. Removed lines from the first y-vale to the holding tank
2. Removed line from first y-valve to direct discharge through-cock.
3. Removed line from holding tank to second y-valve.
4. Removed line from second y-valve to Whale pump.
5. Removed line from whale pump to seak cock.
6. Removed both y-valves.
7. Removed holding tank.

I used a reciprocating saw to cut the hoses into manageable pieces. As it happened the holding tank had completely emptied when it failed, so there was literally nothing to clean out. Unfortunately the hoses were packed full of sewage. By using the reciprocating saw I was able to get everything cut apart in about 90 minutes, including the holding tank. The saw did result in sewage spraying all over the place. I spent about ten hours cleaning my boat, including a run out to the 3 mile line to pump out the bilge (three times with increasingly clean water). I abandoned the hand pump when it failed (I used a cheap $6 pump from Harbor Freight, do not recommend) by the one hose popping loose and spraying pressurized sewage into my face. Fortunately I had a mask and goggles on. Still, disgusting. I then installed the Natures head in just a few minutes. By midnight I had scrubbed the boat completely clean, so that there is not a single sign that there was ever a marine head system on it aside from the sea cocks, and one section of hose from the pump out that I didn't bother to remove (it was barely used to my knowledge and doesn't smell, unlike the other hoses). The boat smells great now, and I have freed up a lot of new storage space.

Having done the removal, I can't imagine a world in which I would re-install everything I just took out, especially with the idea that I would someday need to do all that again. Helllllll no. In fact unless I really hate the Nature's Head to the point that I cannot bear it I will never again have a boat with a marine head aboard, unless the head is brand spanking new The biggest problem I see with the Nature's head is that it is pretty high, and it sits on a pedestal, making it even higher. I may actually need to cut the pedal down, or built in some fit rests at the level of the pedestal to make it a bit more accessible. But that will be a very minor project compared to what I just did. I'm very, very glad to be done so that I can get back to sailing.

[dlj]

I can feel your pain. When I removed my aft head, it wasn't as bad as yours in terms sewage remains, but I did have to cut the holding tank out in small pieces. I've never figured out it was installed in the first place. Must have removed a wall is my best guess. It took me several days to get all the piping and holding tank out as it was so hard to get to.

I think you'll love your composting head. I certainly love both of mine. Everyone I've sailed with that has never used one before has been surprised at how nice they are to use - especially in the odor free department. I do have the OGO which sits notably lower than the Nature's Head. In fact I would not have been able to use a Nature's Head because of the height.

Good luck with it!

dj

[Mike OReilly]

Congrats Zach. Sounds like a horrible job, but now that it’s done, you never have to look back. And if you have any issues with the new head, there are lots of experienced compost users here on CF that are happy to help. It does require a new set of skills, and it’s not without its challenges. But most users agree these heads are way easier, safer, and better than the old way of managing sewage.

[hzcruiser]

Quite a journey you've been through, Zach!

Now it's time to harvest the crops of your hard work... well, that might've come out wrong?