Buy a sailboat, it'll be fun they said.....

[Snore]

Originally Posted by Yojimbo

Snore-

Agree with your post and assessment they were too far out of their competency to be sailing there. But to my question- if conditions exceed the skippers skills on a boat like that, what would be the best tactic? Deploy the staysail as someone mentioned above thread to make steerage until conditions changed or something else?

Agreed they were overwhelmed by conditions that would be underwhelming to an experienced skipper, but what steps should they have taken to avoid making a Mayday?

Screenplay notes--Snore clear's his throat for dramatic effect

The Answer to your question was contained in my post.

Originally Posted by Snore

My mindset is to instruct folks to training on reefing, how to change a fuel filter, what to do if..... and also developing a disaster management mindset. Stop, analyze, discuss, do and then analyze if the solution is working.

There is no magic 'one action for any emergency' action. There is only one way to deal with an emergency- STOP, analyze (breaking it down into elements), discuss, do and then analyze. It applies to sailing, or anything else.

Does the video depict a boat that should be abandoned? Not that I can see, she is not listing, has a turbine to feed the batteries, is 60 miles from shore and the way she is behaving- the rudder appears to be attached.

The better question here is what would YOU do? What would YOUR first actions be? What systems MUST be functional to avoid abandoning? What systems would make it better?

[5BTM]

Imagine what will happen to the cost and availability of insurance when the generation that calls 911 to complain about the quality of drive through service, can' t open the hood of their car and need their GPS to find the corner store decides to take up sailing.

[boatman61]

Short of total rudder failure there's no excuse for the abandonment.. even then its debatable.
Sorry, no sympathy.

[Na Mara]

Those conditions are normal West Coast Scotland conditions. I can’t count how many times I have been out in the like. Even in a lee shore situation a boat should be able to make to windward in those conditions. Unless they were taking on serious water or lost their rudder on a lee shore, there was no need to abandon ship.

[Be Free]

It can be hard to judge wave heights from a video, particularly when its shot through a fisheye lens, but judging from the motion of the boats it did not look all that bad.



I just got back from solo-sailing a smaller boat through similar conditions almost 400 miles up and down the west coast of Florida. I won't say it was always enjoyable, but the idea of calling the coast guard to be taken off never entered my mind. Come to think of it, I spoke to them a couple of times during that trip and reported that all was well.



I think what we have here is an example of the adage that most boats can handle more than the people who sail them. I don't think that boat was anywhere near ready to give up on the crew.


That said, I wasn't on that boat; I was on mine. I've been sailing this one for a little over 13 years and I know and trust it; their boat was new to them. I can't say if it was bad judgment for them to start the trip or for them to end it, but I suspect one or the other was true.

[carstenb]

As Snore noted - they obviously did not have a plan B- not even a plan A. Hauling out the staysail would have given the boat a much more comfortable motion and allowed the skipper and crew to figure the next step

Aside from that - if both the crew and skipper were able to step over the railing to jump to the rescue boat -- why were they unable to go to the mast and set a hook that would allow them to set the mainsail in a first or second reef?

They really should not have been 60m miles offshore - probably not even 6 miles offshore

[senormechanico]

We saw waves that big (and even steeper) just coming North out of Dodd Narrows into a Norther on the Georgia Strait side.

[Statistical]

Originally Posted by carstenb

As Snore noted - they obviously did not have a plan B- not even a plan A. Hauling out the staysail would have given the boat a much more comfortable motion and allowed the skipper and crew to figure the next step

Aside from that - if both the crew and skipper were able to step over the railing to jump to the rescue boat -- why were they unable to go to the mast and set a hook that would allow them to set the mainsail in a first or second reef?

They really should not have been 60m miles offshore - probably not even 6 miles offshore

Yeah the fact that they have no sails out not even damaged torn sales makes me think litterally nobody on the boat had any clue how any of the sails work. Looking at the video I don't think they tried to sail her and failed I think they never even tried at all.

They bought a boat, nobody had any experience, no problem it has a diesel engine we will just motor down the coast. Then the engine failed so they called the coast guard and abanonded a perfectly usable sailing vessel.

I do hope someone ends up salvaging that boat she deserves better than to end up smashed on rocks because the owners are idiots.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Short of total rudder failure there's no excuse for the abandonment.. even then its debatable.
Sorry, no sympathy.

Illness, injury...?
There's no context in the video. Hard to be judgmental without knowing the story.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

Illness, injury...?
There's no context in the video. Hard to be judgmental without knowing the story.

Well they seemed pretty nimble jumping off the boat.. if seasick they should have known their limitations and stayed inshore or taken appropriate meds and learnt how to work through the affliction like many have in the past.. action is a wonderful remedy.. much better than wallowing in self pity..

[sjrider]

Does anyone know why they needed rescued? Please don't tell me it was because the diesel engine died! The conditions did not look that bad at all. Why did they not raise a sail, get some steerage and stabilize the boat out? Or heave to for a while?

[lestersails]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

Illness, injury...?
There's no context in the video. Hard to be judgmental without knowing the story.

Idle speculation would be roaring bad seasickness from the significant yawing, rolling, and hobby horsing of the boat. I could imagine, especially for noobs, them thinking engine was safer than sails (silly, but not inconceivable), it dying, then that incredible motion which could make them sicker than dogs and unable to think clearly and panicking "get me off this ****ing boat!"

[JBsurfin]

Originally Posted by shrspeedblade

The youtube video is rather self explanatory, but so unbelievable that they would get pulled off the boat.

Evidently they ran out of fuel- a very good reason to abandon ship!

(The boat appears to be a Bob Perry designed Islander Freeport 36, an excellent offshore sailboat. It's like watching a squirrel try to drive a Formula 1 car!)

I guess they forgot they were in a SAIL boat?

[jalmberg]

My usual complaint is that these USCG reports never give enough background info on a rescue to learn anything from it. But in this case, the reason seems clear enough: they ran out of fuel. No mention of taking on water, and the boat looks like it's fine and easily up to the conditions.

BTW, if you call the CG for a rescue, they are going to take you off the boat. Period. Too bad if you change your mind. So be careful!

<Begin speculation>

One logical scenario is that they were delivering a boat from somewhere to Galveston and neither one knew how to sail the boat. Maybe one of the dreamers you often hear from on this website. The dude buys more boat than he knows how to handle, and with all the confidence he's gained from reading books and online posts for years, he sets off.

On the way, they run out of fuel (total rookie error) and the wife puts down her foot. She's been supportive, but she's not about to die for her husband's dreams. I don't blame her.

Obviously, with a competent skipper, she wouldn't die or even be stressed out. Lots of ways to handle the above (stupid) mistake.

Lesson: if you are a newbie dreamer, don't buy a 36' boat for your first boat! Try a 15-footer and learn the ropes! Work your way up the competence ladder. Pay your dues!

Ah well. No one listens.

<end speculation>

[lestersails]

Originally Posted by Snore

(redacted)

Finally, everyone who says "Just GO you will figure it out!" should watch this video.

Could not agree more. This forum is awesome, but it's strength and its weakness is that a good number of people seem to be incredibly knowledgeable and capable skippers*. They often pooh-pooh courses and instruction. I think some of these folks have lost sight of how incredible their talents actually are and the chasm between their knowledge and experience vs a noob.

I recall during my Coastal Cruising course the instructor going over a question about serpentine belt failure on a diesel. It wasn't just that they got it wrong on the test - it was that after he explained it they had completely blank looks on their faces and did not understand a word he was saying. I don't think they even understood the concept of fuel igniting in a cylinder and pushing a piston. The practical illiteracy out there is stupefying. I am a big fan of course work. But I suspect the pass rate is 100% and it should not be. There are a goodly number of people who just shouldn't be at the helm. Ever.
Does RYA fail people?

*FWIW, I do not count myself among them.