Hostages Taken off Somalia

[JiffyLube]

Originally Posted by MarkJ

Q ships? Armed merchant ships?

You allow one country you will be allowing them all.

So that would then allow Iranian flagged armed merchant ships to berth in your local port.

I don't think the Iranians would join in if they had to abide by a UN ruling of cooperation, and have to be under the command of a western nation...the only ones that could make it work.

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by JiffyLube

I don't think the Iranians would join in if they had to abide by a UN ruling of cooperation, and have to be under the command of a western nation...the only ones that could make it work.

They have a navy ship patrolling the gulf now as part of the UN force.

[Tom and Maje]

Originally Posted by swagman

Hold on Jiffy.
Were you aware the Somali pirates were active around the Seychelle Islands because I sure wasn't.
JOHN

There was an alert on Noonsite a few days before the media got a hold of the story because the emergency signal was activated. The couple was warned by both employees at the marina and by other sailers not to go where they wanted to go.

Maje

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by MarkJ

They [sic: Iranians] have a navy ship patrolling the gulf now as part of the UN force.

Iran has (6 ?) warships on anti-piracy patrol in the Gulf of Aden.

➥ Iran saves oil tanker from Somali pirates

➥ Iran deploys fresh warships to Gulf of Aden

➥ Iran sends warship to Gulf of Aden

➥ Ä°slâmi Davet – English News*|*Tag Archive*|*Gulf of Aden

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by JiffyLube

I don't think the Iranians would join in if they had to abide by a UN ruling of cooperation, and have to be under the command of a western nation...the only ones that could make it work.

Although the Iranians are not quite the complete loonies of make beleive (certainly not in comparison to their more sand based neighbours - of whatever religion )..........as a Somali Pirate I would be more concerned about meeting an Iranian warship than a British one.

[s/v Jedi]

Come on guys... I think you will find that Iranians are just like you and me: normal and nice people. It's governments, criminals and extremists that are in your mind and they are all bad, and in every country.

People are the same everywhere.

cheers,
Nick.

[bobfnbw]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Come on guys... I think you will find that Iranians are just like you and me: normal and nice people. It's governments, criminals and extremists that are in your mind and they are all bad, and in every country.

People are the same everywhere.

cheers,
Nick.

I agree.

Frankly I wouldn't care if it was a Iranian ship, a Yemen ship, or a ghost ship, If I was in trouble with the pirates of the Caribbean, I would take their help...


I think the Iranian people are pretty cool, personally. But their government, thats another story...

Seems when ever people great crazy, religion is somewhere in there.
But thats another thread

[JiffyLube]

Originally Posted by MarkJ

They have a navy ship patrolling the gulf now as part of the UN force.

That I didn't know...I'm impressed

[swagman]

Originally Posted by Eleven

Well, in Good Queen Victoria's day a frigate would be sent.
If that didn't work a Squadron would be sent.
If that didn't work we'd send an army, occupy, put new rulers in place, and tax them into poverty.
Such is progress.

One could be mistaken for thinking that is exactly what Mr Bush did to the UK a few years back.

But keeping our feet on the ground, it is a tricky situation as the Somalis do not have an effective government to even consider controlling either the Islamic extremists on the one side, or the warlord type pirates on the other.

I understood similar past hostages in Somalia have been well treated and only ever risked being hurt when 'rescue' operations are conducted using force - so despite it feeling very Rambo like and nice - methinks diplomatic chats elsewhere might get a better and safer result.

Like maybe seeing these guys bundled into some deal when the Chinese pay to get one of their ships and crews back and presented as a 'gift' to the west............

And then of course we can begin to use a coalition force to protect and escort convoys wishing to transit the coastline ........... who can blow away any pirates who venture out to take them on.

JOHN

[SabreKai]

I say go with the Qship idea, but give them legal authourity to wipe the pirates out to a man. Half the problem with the response the west is presenting now is the legal mess. Canada has grabbed a few but had to release them sans weapons because the legal situation is so screwed up. No one wants to be the one to say Enough, and start blowing them and their boats out of the water. I'm sure that if we started doing that, then after a while the Somalis would get the message. Attack a ship or yacht and vanish. Bad business. Maybe we should go back to smuggling quat.

As for myself, I would do my best to avoid the area. Honestly, I can't think of a reason to go there in the first place. I don't think I'll be able to see all the places I want to see before I get too old or sick to do this anymore. There are lots of places to see that don't involve tall skinny quat chewing idiots stuffing AK-47s up your nose and wrecking everything you've worked a life time for just so they can get some money the easy way.

If by chance I did run across them, well then, its time for the berserker side of my personality to come out. They will most likely win, but my honor guard in hell will be sizeable.

Sabre

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by SabreKai

I say go with the Qship idea, but give them legal authourity to wipe the pirates out to a man. Half the problem with the response the west is presenting now is the legal mess. Canada has grabbed a few but had to release them sans weapons because the legal situation is so screwed up. No one wants to be the one to say Enough, and start blowing them and their boats out of the water. I'm sure that if we started doing that ...

If we started doing that ... we'd be pirates - just bigger, badder punks than they.

A sort of Q-Ship, an attack on which, scenario should solve the problem of probable cause, likely constituting prima facie evidence of piracy.

[James S]

I met two Dutch guys in the Riyan airport 3 days ago.
They were $650 a day escorts that board their companies clients ships (at sea) along with a member of the Yemeni Coast Guard (who provides the weapons) and accompany them through the troubled waters.

[goboatingnow]

But keeping our feet on the ground, it is a tricky situation as the Somalis do not have an effective government to even consider controlling either the Islamic extremists on the one side, or the warlord type pirates on the other

This isnt the case. There is no effective government in Somalis after the cicivl war the country has divided up along clan/tribal and religious lines. Fundementally Somalia is a Muslim country and has also blamed the West and teh US for promoting conflict.

Anyways the pirates are part of a bigger political and ecomonic problem. It simply isnt a matter of Navy Seals going in and shooting a few people, Are you prepared to wipe out the whole PuntLand province. This problem is bigger then a few yachts.

Intervening in an armed fashion against pirates can be very dangerous, ie see french experience. equally it doesnt tend to deter people who have grown up with violence. When will you realise that armies dont frighten people who have nothing to loose.

A full invasion of somalia, that might work, however currently the US seem a bit busy.

[David M]

Invading the country or killing people is not the solution. Making them ineffective is the solution. We become the criminals if we commit criminal acts in stopping them and two wrongs never makes it right.

[bobsadler]

it's perhaps worth remembering what george washington said about the barbary pirates in a letter he wrote to the marquis de lafayette 1786: “would to heaven we had a navy to reform those enemies to mankind, or crush them into non-existence.”