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Old 29-08-2016, 00:19   #76
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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A lake is not an ocean.. and what happened to all these 'Save the Oceans' CF'rs........
So you have never had a #9 Vindaloo and then dumped it in the ocean after internal processing?
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Old 29-08-2016, 07:52   #77
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

IMHO Heaving to in any serious seas (waves big and breaking) is extremely dangerous for small boats. I think the critical factor is the height of the waves and the probability of any of them breaking.

The bigger and heavier the boat the longer it can stay hove to before an alternative storm survival method has to get deployed.

It is a good technique at the beginning of the storm, before the waves begin to break. It is also a great technique to pit stop in the trade winds.

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Old 29-08-2016, 08:21   #78
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

But won't it make it more difficult to switch to an alternative storm tactic? Heaving-to in an expected light storm might be fine, but if you are expecting something heavy it might be best to bypass that approach and go with something else.

Both other approaches though put extreme loads on the rudder or structure: running with drogue/warps; sea anchor. Lying ahull, I would not want to do in big situations, even with some sort of side line warp or anchor.
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Old 29-08-2016, 11:55   #79
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pirate Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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So you have never had a #9 Vindaloo and then dumped it in the ocean after internal processing?
But of course.. and the fish love it.. theres usually half a dozen at least swim just aft of my rudder as I travel.

As for laying ahull.. if its that lethal how come so many boats that are abandoned are spotted a year or more later still afloat.
I've lain ahull for nearly 6 days on the way from NC to the Azores.. not pleasant watching green water sweep over the deck hatches but at the end I was able to continue when the storm passed with no damage..
And that was on a Hunter..
If you aint done it.. don't knock it..
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Old 29-08-2016, 12:09   #80
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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As for laying ahull.. if its that lethal how come so many boats that are abandoned are spotted a year or more later still afloat.
I've lain ahull for nearly 6 days on the way from NC to the Azores.. not pleasant watching green water sweep over the deck hatches but at the end I was able to continue when the storm passed with no damage..
And that was on a Hunter..
If you aint done it.. don't knock it..
I have an aversion to roll-overs and overs. I am loosening my aversion to hunters though
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Old 29-08-2016, 12:13   #81
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pirate Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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I have an aversion to roll-overs and overs. I am loosening my aversion to hunters though
Never came close to being rolled.. did get picked up and tossed a few times though..
PS; It was the crème de la crème of Hunter.. a Cherubini 37c..
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Old 29-08-2016, 12:26   #82
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

I found a free ebook about this oil on the seas and sailing. Fascinating, really. https://books.google.com/books?id=hV...%20sea&f=false
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Old 29-08-2016, 12:28   #83
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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PS; It was the crème de la crème of Hunter.. a Cherubini 37c..
Ahhhh.....nice boat
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Old 29-08-2016, 12:41   #84
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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But won't it make it more difficult to switch to an alternative storm tactic? Heaving-to in an expected light storm might be fine, but if you are expecting something heavy it might be best to bypass that approach and go with something else.

Both other approaches though put extreme loads on the rudder or structure: running with drogue/warps; sea anchor. Lying ahull, I would not want to do in big situations, even with some sort of side line warp or anchor.
Hmmm I haven't done it yet but I am pretty sure I'd rather hook up a para anchor while hove-to than lying ahull. Deploying it though the boat will have to be moving, just not allowed to fall back on its rudder.
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Old 29-08-2016, 12:58   #85
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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But won't it make it more difficult to switch to an alternative storm tactic? Heaving-to in an expected light storm might be fine, but if you are expecting something heavy it might be best to bypass that approach and go with something else.

(...)
If you "expect" it you might by-pass heaving to. I would.

The point is that possibly more often you do not expect things. "Nobody expects Spanish Inquisition!" ;-) And so you heave to and 12 hours later you discover it is not safe anylonger and so you go for your plan B.

BTW Running with a drogue or hanging on to a parachute do not exhaust your repertoire. E.g. you can run before (esp. in a modern flat fast boat) or else you can fore-reach under a storm blade (only if you have one though).

Lying ahull is probably even worse than heaving too: many boats lay ahull beam on to the wind/waves. Suicidal.

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Old 29-08-2016, 14:22   #86
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

It is our experience that at the stage things get really bad it is nigh on impossible to do anything constructive. However with improved weather forecasting we can anticipate the conditions we are likely to have to put up and that gives us the opportunity to prepare earlier.
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Old 11-09-2016, 21:14   #87
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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This oil on the water is blowin my mind. Maybe bring a gallon along, just in case.
lol...i'm thinking the same thing. i think next day sail i'm bringing the olive oil and heaving to to try this out.
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Old 11-09-2016, 21:44   #88
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

Wouldn't you think that your oil drip bucket would be better off up wind of you a couple hundred yards to do the most good ? I can't see it doing a whole lot if its dripping by your boat and spreading down wind of you. I guess if your boat is drifting faster than your oil slick eventually you'll be passing it heading down wind. Nothing better than a live demonstration , right ?
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Old 11-09-2016, 22:08   #89
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

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Wouldn't you think that your oil drip bucket would be better off up wind of you a couple hundred yards to do the most good ? I can't see it doing a whole lot if its dripping by your boat and spreading down wind of you. I guess if your boat is drifting faster than your oil slick eventually you'll be passing it heading down wind. Nothing better than a live demonstration , right ?
The point is that if you are hove to properly, you will be drifting downwind and the oil slick will stay just upwind of you.
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Old 12-09-2016, 01:59   #90
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Re: Heave /Hove to -what are the limits?

There is a great book called south seas vagabond. Jonny Wray used to swear by heaving too, with whale oil. Worked well for him for years until he git caught in a cyclone and rolled while hove too. After rolling he ran off towing his his spars, mainsail and anythibg else while he baled out the water and repaired the old wooden boat. After that he said running off towing everything was the ultimate storm technique. Eventually either while hove to the sails will shred or you will end up nearer beam on during the bigger seas, unless you combine it with a drag device like the pardeys to help hold the bow up.

There is another weird way to heave too, just back the headsail and drop the main, keep the helm up. Its like heaving too by the stern. It kind of works, certainly damps the roll and makes a nice slick. But the bow ends up downwind. I can see this being useful with a series drogue off the stern quarter, but I havent tried it this way, but if it didnt work it would be easy enough to roll away the headsail and centre the rudder.

Video of us sitting this way in a mild southern ocean frontal passage here.

https://youtu.be/CJMIBbt2svo

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