First timers.

[kath&john]

Hi every-one,
This is my first time online here in this forum, and my husband and I are just in the process of looking into live aboard motor cruisers, Still don't know much about it yet. Other than, that we would love to sell our home and take off, when the kids are living out of home!
Could some one start me in the right direction? How much can you live on? We where thinking of moving around the WhitSunday's, as our base.
There would be two of us, but would like room for stop overs with the kids? So what size would be best?
Would love some thing like a 34 or 40 clipper, that sort of thing keeps catching our eye.
Any way, would love some feed back, Thanks for taking the time to read this...
Kath

[Ex-Calif]

Hi Kath! Welcome aboard. This is a pretty world wide group and there is lot's of advice available. Maybe you could tell us a bit more about yourselves, like where you are, where you want to cruise and what's important in terms of your future home on the water.

It sounds like you might be interested in Motorsailers or pure powerboats but I'm not sure. There are people cruising in all kinds of boats.

[jack7382]

Hi Kath,

welcome aboard.


Jack

[spencer53]

Check out Yachtworld.com
Take a look at as many boats as you feel willing and compare. Many have enough photos to give you a "virtual tour" so you can get a feel for different layouts. I recommend staying away from wood hulls and from gas engines. Wood hulls are becoming more difficult to insure and gas engines are expensive to run (aside from the safety issues involved). Be realistic in what it costs to live aboard. Don't forget the costs of insurance, slip fees, live aboard fees, property taxes, etc... Work out the "numbers" and know that IT CAN BE DONE! Good luck to you both. It has been a great lifestyle for my wife and I and the kids LOVE IT when they come and stay.

[rebel heart]

It's a pretty broad question you're asking. My only advice in regards to "what to buy" is that you're probably going to have a different opinion a year after you've lived on the boat. Moving from land to a boat tends to make people get bigger boats with lots of doo-dads on them. Sometimes that's the way they keep it, but a lot of people don't really get to figuring out the exact type of vessel they want until they've been doing it for a few years. Even then, you tend to change your opinion over time.

Get some sea time if at all possible. Get on other people's boats, and try to do more than just some harbor cruises. Have dinner on people's boats, crew on some race boats if you can (great sailing experience), or maybe crew on some tall ships at a local maritime museum if possible.

The more you know about boats before you buy one the better.

[SkiprJohn]

Aloha Kath and John,
Welcome aboard!! Good to have you here and you'll always get many opinions as to what you should get. Remember, they are all opinions and some with a lot of experience behind them. My preference is sail not longer than 36 feet on deck.
Right now I'm not certain if you want a powerboat or sailboat so if you could narrow it down a bit I can at least give you some more of my opinions.
Kind Regards,
JohnL

[kath&john]

Hi..kath, of kath&john here. Thanks so much for the many reply's. Yes a motorcruiser is some thing we want, just to keep to Australia shores for the time being, but one day who knows? We are living in Melbourne, Australia. Will take to the road and go up to the warmer climate, say out from Airlie Beach? Been there, took a week out on a Tall Ship, so beautiful going through all the Islands, just there for the eye to feast on. Any way, hope I've answered some of the questions comming my way, Keep them comming, I'm all ears. Thanks again.

[cat man do]

Hi Kath (& John)

I am building a Power cat and here is a site that helped in my decision making.

Cruising Under Power Southeast Asia in a Converted Fishing Boat

Here are some links from the same site to other powered cruisers in Asian waters, I will be joining the list up there soon enough.

Other Australian Cruising Motorboats

I guarantee you there are nicer and much more affordable places to cruise than the Whitsundays.


These guys are also well respected and have stepped away from sail and now have gone efficient (relatively) power. Plenty of good information.
SetSail.com - the serious cruising sailor's website

Here is the log of another low powered vessel that travelled the world.
The Boat

Dave

[kath&john]

Thanks there great- have kept those sites.... Like where? we've only been around that area so far. I'm sure there are more affordable places but we haven't got that far yet, any recommendations? We have time, thats one thing we have got, I've just turned the big "40" & husband "41". Kids dont think they would like living out on the water, "no friends", "nothing to do", so looks like we have 4 or 5 years to get the cruiser of our dreams ready, fitted out to out hearts content, though reading some of your stuff written here most think- people get boats to big and take to much junk?

[cat man do]

I prefer the stretch fron Cape Capricorn up to the bottom of the Whitsundays myself, as most people just blow through on their rush to rip off central.

The stretch North of Cairns is great as well for similar reasons which are basically serious cruisers with no time constraints are in these areas and there are no bare boat charterers.

One can sit in these places for weeks at time and not see anyone.

When our boat goes in (18 mths) we will head slowly for Malaysia to join the ever increasing Oz cruiser circuit escaping from the rules and regulations imposed on cruisers here.

Costs incurred by a cruising couple there now are on the link below

Untitled Document

And I was there a few months back checking it out and came up with a budget that is similar.

For some reason I can't link to my original post so I have to cut and paste here.

As a rough example, rough cost's in Penang/Langkawi area for us in a 50 ft powercat and living for 2 based on a recent 3 week stay there.

Most of this is a Maximum, fuel oil etc I doubt we would use that most months.



Diesel @ .70c/l x 600/mth = $420 (I doubt we'd use that every month)

Unleaded 4 Dinghy & Genny @.70c/l x 100/mth = $70

Engine maintenance [ filters and oil ] = $40

Bottom clean and antifoul through Thai Yard = $35/mth

Eating out for every meal, every day for 2
including 12 cans of Tiger beer a day = $500

Incidental groceries and mixers for spirit's = $100

Weekly half hour massage at $5 each = $10

Laundry, washed and folded = $20

Taxi's and transport = $80

Incidental money wasting on DVD's etc = $50

TOTAL = 1325/mth

Extra niceties

Car hire and fuel for 2 day's per mth = $50

Marina berth for 4 day's per mth = $ 50

*** hotel accom for 4 days per mth = $ 130

A really flash banquet at the best Hotel in Penang
inc bottomless beer and wine = $ 60


An extra $290


So living well, should cost around $330 AUD/week [ $285 USD/week ]

NOTE* as of today,
Friday, December 14, 2007
330 Australian Dollar = 290.367 US Dollar



going up a peg with the extra niceties every month
will cost about $403 Aud/week [ $347 USD/week]

Also note that this is without us catching and cooking, and infact not really getting our hand's dirty at all, so we actually can do it a lot cheaper than that I would think.

Dave

[kath&john]

Thank you for the well thought out answer, I really app you taking the time,
another question if I may: when you have a 40 and up, do you to have some kind of special license-to skipper it? What about having some courses under our belt? any good ones that we maybe should do?

[cat man do]

Hi again, the law says that you have to have a boat license for anything powered by greater than a 6hp outboard be it sail or power.

Recreational marine driver licence

the ridiculous part about this law is at the moment, this same license (test done for me in a 12 ft tinny) allows me to command a private vessel up to (I think) 22 metres, after all, all boats handle the same dont they?

It's an easy book test and consultation amongst students was advised.

Some of the questions and answers in the book are also incorrect, but it does not matter, as no one fails.

We were even told not to worry about certain marks, "they arent on the test and you won't see them around here" was the reasoning when questioned.

Therefore in my opinion, it is no more than revenue raising and name collecting.

I have heard that a new reg for licensing and insurance is about to come in for 15 metre (50 ft) and up (with masssive fines for non-compliance), so I am not doing the step extension to 53 ft that I was planning.

The only other qualifications I beleive you can get are coxwain, or master 5 which is arguably worth doing for a newbie IMHO, but not required by law unless operating in a commercial situation.

Dave

[yachtrodney]

Excellent info 'cat man do' - and what a great site that Cruising Under Power link is:

It got me really thinking - about just how much actual sailing - and motoring - I did aboard 'Duke' a 55' ferro sloop yacht - when I travelled about before. And to be honest I reckon I probably DID motor for about half of everywhere I went.

There were times when I did a couple of big ocean passages - like 2300 miles across from Guam to Hong Kong - where I had the sails up and surfing on the Tradewinds for about 2 weeks. But then there were others like the 1000 miles I did from the Solomon Islands across the Equator (where the posted photo was taken) to Micronesia - and there was not a skerrick of wind the whole time and I motored continuously for about 5 days - across a flat glass sea.

And that story I've told in the thread on guns - also happened when I was motor-sailing with almost no wind for days on end - and had just come out of an engineless dead calm for a week. I motored more than a thousand miles on that trip from Hong Kong to Bangkok for sure.

And not to mention - all the short handed - day trips I did here and there - through islands. lagoons, and on the East Coast of Australia - where it was too much trouble to set sail alone for a few hours - except to run out the furling genoa ( it was the getting that huge main back down and folded across the boom on your own - that could turn into an afternoon event - thank God there was an autopilot).

I suppose the biggest advantage though - is having the insurance of BOTH sails AND a good motor - because as I always joked - 'when the mechanics let you down - the sailor will get your home' - which has proved to be true - too many times.

So my point is simply - that with or without a mast - provided I don't suddenly get the urge to sail 'around the world' - which I've never had before - then the fact that this big yacht is without a mast - but adequately powered with a reliable Gardner & a generator - means we should be able to cruise and travel almost anywhere that the diesel budget allows - and live quite comfortably with all the facilities we have on board. Much the same as I did before.

So Kath & John - sailing - on any size yacht - is a fair amount of work - but if you want to do the BIG ocean miles - then that's really the only way to go. But if you want to live the life a bit easier - doing day and overnight trips - but still capable of some longer ocean runs - then that Clipper 40 Motor Cruiser you seem attracted to - should do you just fine.

The size of your vessel and the level of luxury will always be determined by what you can afford. I don't think anyone would choose to live a spartan existence without hot showers, refrigeration & electricity on board - if they didn't have to.

As for Penny and I - frankly - we could spend years going around Australia - motoring as need be - and be perfectly happy Cruisers. After all this yacht is a big spacious home - that we've lived on OK for the last few years anyway.

Maybe we could just become Pirates too.

Rodney Penny

[kath&john]

O.K dave, thanks- that means the licence john has already for his fishing boat will do. john says he'll prob do that coxwain/master 5 course just to be sure we have the right start. Have taken all your answers to heart thanks for the reply's. And you said you hadn't taken the fresh fish and so on, into account, john loves that thought- hangin a line and catchin dinner...Yum.

By the way...any thought's guy's on the :1989 40' Ranger Aft Cabin?
We came across it & really like the layout.

[cat man do]

Yeah, I did the coxwains course as I wanted master5 and certainly had the documented hours/miles for it, but it was the legislation that turned me right off.

Paperwork, paperwork and more paperwork, and then there were the fines, litigation and possible jail time if something went wrong, and some of it seemingly minor stuff (someone cuts a finger on fishing boat, may get sued, no thanks)

I could make a hell of a lot more money in my previous job, without any of that drama.

So all the "Theory" is done, just not the magic bit of paper needed to operate a charter boat in OZ.

Fishing, always do plenty on passage and anchor. Have a look at some of these from my last Vanuatu trip

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...hlight=vanuatu

And a bit of shark action on a Seamount we fished about 500NM out from oz on the same trip

YouTube - seamount

The bottom is clearly visable in about 100ft of water and about 500 feet away over the edge dropped to about 11,000 ft.


1989 40' Ranger Aft Cabin Got a link?

Found one, nice looking (comfortable) boat
Ranger Aft Cabin for Sale Ensign Ship Brokers
Those twin 120's would keep me in the poorhouse though.

I liked this old girl though
Fred Fleming for Sale Ensign Ship Brokers

(seems expensive for her though)

Just my personal thoughts if I chose to have a mono

Dave