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Old 03-12-2013, 19:15   #1
KLT
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Tayana 48 vs 58?

Hey All,

Been a lurker on the forums for quite awhile but finally had a question the search button could not solve for my own situation.

That is how much of a difference does a 48 compare to a 58? The main reason im asking is because of cost and having other guests. I've read around that as soon as you get past that 50 mark costs, maintenance, and difficulty of controlling goes up by a lot.

What the boat will be used for:

1. Circumnavigating for a year or 2 with a group of 4 to 6 still undecided with the last 2 so lets just assume 6!

2. Extended trips about a month there and back from the destination not including the time at the destination. Main destination is the bahamas. Maybe Hawaii? With a group of at least 6 probably more and we all have known each other for awhile if that matters. Theres also a possibility of kids going along but the main 3 cabins will be used by the adult couples.

The core crew consist of me and a friend since were the only ones with experience. I've got minimal experience sailing but my friend has 10+ years so he will be the main captain as I try and get used to the upgrade in size. Got a a small 19 for myself so it will be a bit of a jump!

Both these boats are within my price range as well so no worries there. I thought about the 64 and thought to myself that it might be a bit much for 4-6 people and thats when things start to actually get pricy! But feel free to recommend other blue water boats within the price range of a newer Tayana 58!

Another side thought have any of you dealt with bringing a full on computer with you on the ship I trade for a living and so I was hoping to still trade while circumnavigating via satellite internet. I'd have to have enough energy to support 6 monitors and a top end custom built desktop. The system pulls almost 850 watts when in usage!

Thanks!

-KL

P.S I'm leaning towards the 48 since maintenance is something I like to personally do but maintaining an extra 10 feet seems like that could be a lot of extra work though I guess this is miniscule to making sure others are comfortable!
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Old 03-12-2013, 19:31   #2
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

hmmm. we have the 45/48, 3 staterooms. its plenty. but then again, we would have the 55/58 if it was offered to us. the bigger the better in our minds. as for maintenance... once you pass the 40 mark things get pricey. then again after 65ish. so 48, 58 about the same. the 58 will burn more fuel, cost more to dock, cost more to cool... harder to dock, very hard to sail solo. docking solo would be a nightmare.

as for a big PC, we started this trip with one, but i downgraded to my ultra laptop. its an asus ROG unit. could do 3 monitors if i needed them. frankly i am a day trader, and do not need more then two, and can use one just as well.
a second is nice for the live stream, but never found a use for number 3...
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Old 03-12-2013, 19:51   #3
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

The 58 is an awesome boat, we came very close to buying two different Tayana 58s before purchasing our Oyster. The 58 is twice as large as the 48, just look at the displacement numbers. Docking the 58 using a bow thruster would be easy, but can also be done without one without trouble. I sail and dock our Oyster 53 alone all the time, no problem; the same displacement as the Tayana 58. Larger, heavier boats don't get pushed around by wind as much as lighter boats.

If you can afford the Tayana 64, then you should also be considering an Oyster 53, 54 or 56. If you're looking at new boats... Look at the Oyster 575.
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Old 03-12-2013, 19:53   #4
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

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Originally Posted by scoobert View Post
hmmm. we have the 45/48, 3 staterooms. its plenty. but then again, we would have the 55/58 if it was offered to us. the bigger the better in our minds. as for maintenance... once you pass the 40 mark things get pricey. then again after 65ish. so 48, 58 about the same. the 58 will burn more fuel, cost more to dock, cost more to cool... harder to dock, very hard to sail solo. docking solo would be a nightmare.

as for a big PC, we started this trip with one, but i downgraded to my ultra laptop. its an asus ROG unit. could do 3 monitors if i needed them. frankly i am a day trader, and do not need more then two, and can use one just as well.
a second is nice for the live stream, but never found a use for number 3...
Scoobert,

At the very least were going to have 2 people on the boat at all times! But from what I got from your post you would put a vote out for the 58?

Trading question though...

Hows it like trading on a boat? I'm a day / swing trader and actually down graded from 10 to 6 monitors so im not sure about downgrading again! I absolutely love my set up and would really hate to see it gather dust for 2 years. And how were you getting the electricity to power everything? I don't mind getting a generator but would perfer to keep it as low profile as possible as I'm not the best handy man around and I don't want it just quit out on me in the middle of the ocean and not be repairable!

-KL
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Old 03-12-2013, 22:26   #5
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

Klt,

For this crew I would go for the bigger boat. We had five people on an Irwin 54' and it could get crowded at times. Any smaller would have been a problem.

My bigger concern is your internet connection. Sattelite internet is spotty, slow, and very expensive. It can be done but is far from what you are used too. I would spend a good bit of time worrying about this before worrying about the generator. Most boats this size will have at least a 7kw generator, which is more than enough to power your rig.
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Old 03-12-2013, 22:53   #6
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

Some time ago I was looking at three boats...a Tayana 58, an Oyster 56 and a Hinkley 59. All three were quite a lot larger than the boat that I was use to sailing single handed...a Tayana 37. However if rigged properly the larger boat too can be sailed single handed and would even be easier than my smaller boat. I was going with in boom furling and hydralic systems and a bow thruster to aid in docking. Even got to help motor the new Tayana 58 from the Annapolis sailboat show when the show was over. Also a diesel generator was part of the options that I was going to add, however it was never meant to be since the stock market was unkind and everything vanished almost as fast as it came with the tech stock bubble. I'm still sailing the smaller boat and ever so slowly getting back into the market so wish you well both in the stock trading and the boat pruchase.
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Old 03-12-2013, 23:40   #7
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

I have sailed a Norseman 535 from Canada to Fort Lauderdale and am heading out to the Bahamas and eventually St. Martin and possibly Trinidad by May. Nothing smaller would fit a crew of 4 or more in my view. Cost to maintain? Do the work yourself? In my experience, these are not really wise questions to ask. Good luck!
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Old 04-12-2013, 02:06   #8
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

Hey everyone,

Thanks for the feedback! Seems like the 58 is the way to go. But does anyone have any experience with a cats? I never really considered it till now after a lot of thinking. It seem's like cats are a lot more spacious for larger groups. Thoughts?

-KL
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Old 04-12-2013, 03:27   #9
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Old 04-12-2013, 04:21   #10
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KLT View Post
Scoobert,

At the very least were going to have 2 people on the boat at all times! But from what I got from your post you would put a vote out for the 58?

Trading question though...

Hows it like trading on a boat? I'm a day / swing trader and actually down graded from 10 to 6 monitors so im not sure about downgrading again! I absolutely love my set up and would really hate to see it gather dust for 2 years. And how were you getting the electricity to power everything? I don't mind getting a generator but would perfer to keep it as low profile as possible as I'm not the best handy man around and I don't want it just quit out on me in the middle of the ocean and not be repairable!

-KL
with the laptop it not hard.
200 watts for the laptop, 20 for the monitor.
can be done easily on a good quality 400 watt inverter.
i can see your a long long way from buying a boat, but these questions are a good start. you may find two monitors more appealing if one is a 4K monitor. it has 4 times the screen pixels of a normal HD monitor, so you can put more info on it.
do you really need that many streaming screens?

for internet you can buy anything, but that will cost some big cash. if a cruise ship can have T3 speeds, so can you, i have seen some high end systems for $50,000 plus, then you have to pay for the internet. a cellular internet card works good if your in 3G/4G zones. otherwise your down to wifi. do not expect instant trades, but less then 20 seconds is easy, from the time you click trade. i have missed a few on bad wi-fi.....

sounds like you have the cash to buy whatever. forget the sailboat, get a trawler, 70' range.
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Old 04-12-2013, 04:22   #11
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

If you want 3 cabins for 6 adults then that means something in the 53 - 60 foot bracket. A 48 won't cut it. Given the computer requirement you will also be needing a genset of at least 5kw capacity and batteries of at least 1000 ah total plus a battery charger capable of at least 3000w. Then there will be a watermaker of at least 20 gph plus a minimum 100 gallon water tank and 200 gallon diesel tank. Then there will be the power drain caused by fridge plus freezer.

The planned computer system will probably require at least 2 mbps which means a commercial grade unit costing around $20/minute or $5000/month on a package. The hardware will be 10k+ up to 30k.

Marinas worldwide have an unofficial price cutoff at 50ft. Say they want $1/foot for a 49 footer, a 58 footer might cost $1.25/foot. After a while these charges add up.

The boat you want will be in the 55 - 60 foot bracket but before buying make sure you have done the math on the operating costs. Expect big buck$.
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Old 04-12-2013, 04:23   #12
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
The 58 is an awesome boat, we came very close to buying two different Tayana 58s before purchasing our Oyster. The 58 is twice as large as the 48, just look at the displacement numbers. Docking the 58 using a bow thruster would be easy, but can also be done without one without trouble. I sail and dock our Oyster 53 alone all the time, no problem; the same displacement as the Tayana 58. Larger, heavier boats don't get pushed around by wind as much as lighter boats.

If you can afford the Tayana 64, then you should also be considering an Oyster 53, 54 or 56. If you're looking at new boats... Look at the Oyster 575.
yes, its much larger. not sure about it being twice as large, displacement or not, 10' in length, and 2' in width, it only a % bigger.

i agree. bow and stern thrusters would be great!
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Old 04-12-2013, 05:28   #13
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

We have sailed 35,000 nm on our Tayana 55 and the 58 is a 55 with a longer transom and a larger aft garage. It is easily handled by two but we usually take crew for legs over 1200 nm. Our kids and grand kids visit for 2 weeks a year and the boat easily accommodates them.

Any well equipped 58 will have a large gen set and over 1000 amp hours of batteries for a 2000 to 3000 watt inverter. We can run 2 computers, a coffee maker and a toaster off the batteries.

If you are going to have 4-6 people and kids with all the toys, we have snow ski(sailing to New Zealand to ski), golf and scuba equipment, 2 bikes, a Hobie sailing tri and a mess of fishing rods.

You will be very cramped on a 48. Get the 58!

A cat verses a mono hull is a different question. The trend is for families to go to the cats and I can understand that when we see the massive space they have. However, in a strong gale and 25+ ft seas I really appreciate the 8 tons of lead we have in the keel.
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Old 04-12-2013, 05:53   #14
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

For what you plan to do, you definitely will need the larger boat, 48' won't do.

But I'm having a VERY hard time visualizing 6 adults living in that close proximity for anything close to the length of time it takes to sail around the world, with you attempting to stay involved in a very competitive business where the difference between winning big and losing equally big can hinge on a missing bit of information or on a moment in time, with an inferior internet connection. It seems to me, with that many people, and with you committed to an entirely different set of priorities other than just operating the boat and seeing the world, there's bound to be constant friction. Imagine that many people living in your house without the responsibilities of watchkeeping or all the things required of sailing and living aboard a boat that just won't wait until you make one more trade at the perfect time, and if you aren't wishing they'd go home after a week, you're an extraordinary individual. Even with just a couple aboard a long term cruise, you both have to make compromises because you think about things slightly differently or you have different priorities or see things differently, but I can't even imagine trying to do it with 6 people aboard for any length of time. Good luck to you, but if I understand correctly what you're trying to do, I'm doubtful that it'll turn out very successfully. I'd buy the perfect boat for yourself and your partner, and then invite the other people to come visit occasionally.
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Old 04-12-2013, 17:37   #15
KLT
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Re: Tayana 48 vs 58?

Hey everyone,

Thank you for the most excellent feed back so to condense my thoughts into one post here's the jist.

1. Yes we are a bit a ways away from purchasing. We are going to see all the boats in person before making a final decision.

2. These boats are more than likely going to be brand new, unless somehow we find the boat with my exact customizations in mind.

3. The 48 is now out of the question... Though I still want to get it for just me and the wife, we shall see!

4. I am now thinking between the 58 and a lagoon Cat 450 up to 560. I personally would perfer the 58 but the group is up in debate as they would really appreciate the space of the Cat so as of right now it looks like things may go that way... But I shall fight for the Tayana!!!

5. As for the trading I'm planning to purely swing trade as I don't think I could take the amount of stress trying to day trade off of a sat link! So generally entry's can stand to be a little off from the mark.

6. Does anyone have any recommendations on Cats besides lagoon?

Thanks!

-KL
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