Question about battery power

[kish]

Originally Posted by Drek4

Awesome, that is very good to know that there is viable alternatives, I was mostly thinking of using as a plan B, when sun is not available.
Have you had this for several years or is this a recent purchase?

I have had an Air X unit since 2001 to date and have some 30K miles plus with it, including two Atlantic crossings
No problems except to replace broken blade damaged by a runaway halliard

I checked out their website as below and am glad to see that, unlike other boat kit providers, they are still producing the same series some 20 years later

Made in the USA by:
Southwest Windpower, Inc.
2131 N. First Street
Flagstaff, Arizona 86004
Toll Free Phone: (866) 805-9463
Phone: (928) 779-9463
Fax: (928) 779-1485
E-mail: info@windenergy.com
Web: www.windenergy.com
AIR, AIR 403, AIR-X and AIR Wind Module are trademarks of Southwest Windpower
 2002 Southwest Windpower, Inc.

[contrail]

Originally Posted by kish

I have had an Air X unit since 2001 to date and have some 30K miles plus with it, including two Atlantic crossings
No problems except to replace broken blade damaged by a runaway halliard

I checked out their website as below and am glad to see that, unlike other boat kit providers, they are still producing the same series some 20 years later

Made in the USA by:
Southwest Windpower, Inc.
2131 N. First Street
Flagstaff, Arizona 86004
Toll Free Phone: (866) 805-9463
Phone: (928) 779-9463
Fax: (928) 779-1485
E-mail: info@windenergy.com
Web: www.windenergy.com
AIR, AIR 403, AIR-X and AIR Wind Module are trademarks of Southwest Windpower
 2002 Southwest Windpower, Inc.

And they now offer blades that are pretty quiet, too!

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by carstenb

30 knots apparent is a lot of wind - noone sees this unless sailing uphill and even then it still is a lot of wind (gale force)

Seeing 30 knots at anchor would not be nice.

Wind generators are not appreciated i close anchorages by other boats. We've had these humming all day and all night near us - and we have moved.
The noise can be quite irritating

Your input is appreciated, I do agree that wind generators can be annoying, but if cloudy days persist, this is a viable alternative to using the engine or gas generator.

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by kish

I have had an Air X unit since 2001 to date and have some 30K miles plus with it, including two Atlantic crossings
No problems except to replace broken blade damaged by a runaway halliard

I checked out their website as below and am glad to see that, unlike other boat kit providers, they are still producing the same series some 20 years later

Made in the USA by:
Southwest Windpower, Inc.
2131 N. First Street
Flagstaff, Arizona 86004
Toll Free Phone: (866) 805-9463
Phone: (928) 779-9463
Fax: (928) 779-1485
E-mail: info@windenergy.com
Web: www.windenergy.com
AIR, AIR 403, AIR-X and AIR Wind Module are trademarks of Southwest Windpower
 2002 Southwest Windpower, Inc.

That is awesome to know, because most people I talk to that have wind generators in their hunting/leisure camps/cottages complain about premature wear and poor performance on their wind generators.

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by contrail

And they now offer blades that are pretty quiet, too!

The website doesn't seem to be active anymore, do you know of the new website link?

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by carstenb

30 knots apparent is a lot of wind - noone sees this unless sailing uphill and even then it still is a lot of wind (gale force)

Seeing 30 knots at anchor would not be nice.

Wind generators are not appreciated i close anchorages by other boats. We've had these humming all day and all night near us - and we have moved.
The noise can be quite irritating

Well thank your for that information, that confirms what many have complained about, but I guess if cloudy for a day or so, it saves from using engine/generator.

[mjgill1]

Originally Posted by Drek4

Your input is appreciated, I do agree that wind generators can be annoying, but if cloudy days persist, this is a viable alternative to using the engine or gas generator.

IMHO this chart says everything I need to know about wind generators and is why I don't have any interest in one. To each their own and more power (pun intended) to those that choose them.

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by mjgill1

IMHO this chart says everything I need to know about wind generators and is why I don't have any interest in one. To each their own and more power (pun intended) to those that choose them.

That chart is very much appreciated, I guess the wind generator will not be on the priority to buy list.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by Drek4

That chart is very much appreciated, I guess the wind generator will not be on the priority to buy list.

good decision!

[AKA-None]

Originally Posted by motion30

My take on this is different. I don't think doing an energy budget helps you very much as you can not control the intensity or the degree of the sun . My experience tells me fit as much solar on your boat as you have room for . no one has ever said I regret having too Much electrical energy available

That’s not what an energy budget is all about
It’s not so much how much you produce but for a start how much you consume then you know how much you need to produce
Eg even if you completely covered the boat in solar if you don’t know what you need then you may still not have enough
Start by determining what you consume then you’ll know what you need to produce

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

That’s not what an energy budget is all about
It’s not so much how much you produce but for a start how much you consume then you know how much you need to produce
Eg even if you completely covered the boat in solar if you don’t know what you need then you may still not have enough
Start by determining what you consume then you’ll know what you need to produce

It is logical to know what your consumption is to adequately budget for your production needs, in my case I know for a fact that I will not have enough, so I might as well equip as much as I can, within reason and within my budget.

[MikeHoncho]

I just completed the most power useage trip with my new system of a single 8D with 255 ah. 30 ft hunter with refrigeration drawing about 3 amps on average. Motoring about 50% average. Balmar 90 amp alter with ext regulation. 2 125 watt panels with programmable controller.
Saturday night running the Wallas diesel cabin heater/cooktop running almost continuously, inverter on powering two CPAP machines (one with humidifier on) and the battery got down to 74% by the time we were done with breakfast and ready to leave anchorage. Solar never really did anything beyond 1 or 2 amps due to over cast.

I know I will be motoring at some point in the day and with the 90 amp alt it will usually get the battery to absorption then the panels (if sunny) will finish it off when under sail. I think with my set up the 8D AGM at 200 ah is right in the sweet spot for higher power usage over night and the combination of alternator and panel sizes recover very well. I have redone all of my primary 12 volt wiring with large gauge wires, terminals and blocks. This has helped with efficiency also. It seems I read more negative info on wind than I do positive unless your doing long, continuous passages. I'd rather not hear it spinning.

[Drek4]

Originally Posted by MikeHoncho

I just completed the most power useage trip with my new system of a single 8D with 255 ah. 30 ft hunter with refrigeration drawing about 3 amps on average. Motoring about 50% average. Balmar 90 amp alter with ext regulation. 2 125 watt panels with programmable controller.
Saturday night running the Wallas diesel cabin heater/cooktop running almost continuously, inverter on powering two CPAP machines (one with humidifier on) and the battery got down to 74% by the time we were done with breakfast and ready to leave anchorage. Solar never really did anything beyond 1 or 2 amps due to over cast.

I know I will be motoring at some point in the day and with the 90 amp alt it will usually get the battery to absorption then the panels (if sunny) will finish it off when under sail. I think with my set up the 8D AGM at 200 ah is right in the sweet spot for higher power usage over night and the combination of alternator and panel sizes recover very well. I have redone all of my primary 12 volt wiring with large gauge wires, terminals and blocks. This has helped with efficiency also. It seems I read more negative info on wind than I do positive unless your doing long, continuous passages. I'd rather not hear it spinning.

That is an awesome power grid you got there. How many panels do you got for this total of 2 125?

Thank you very much for sharing.

[Na Mara]

I’m in the process of upgrading my electrical system at the moment (if I can get the yard started on the job…). I am going the really big battery route (4x200Ah LFP from Victron. The idea is that with such a big battery I will have between one and two weeks of charge to play with before needing to charge off the 100A alternator, shore power, or a wind generator.

The thing about wind generators is that they produce whopping amounts of power on a windy day (350W at 25knots for most of them) but very little on average wind days (maybe 35W at 10 knots). In a region with 10 knot average wind speeds a superwind 350 produces about 800Wh of energy a day averaged over the year. That’s about the same as a 150W solar panel in a region with about 5kWh/m2 insolation (tropics). For a frugal cruiser who occasionally plugs in and runs their engine it’s more than enough.

Where people go wrong is they expect that 800Wh everyday from a wind turbine but wind, more than solar, doesn’t work like that. Where and when most people sail it’s sunny and bright most days so on most days the panels recharge the batteries to full. The odd day where that doesn’t happen is either bridged by a small reserve of battery charge or by running the engine. Wind, on the other hand, is more intermittent. You can have many days, even weeks, of no wind at all and then a good windy day or two. During those windy days your wind gen will pour power into your system at the rate of a kWh every 3-4 hours. If you have a standard battery set up with about 200Ah of usable charging capacity then the wind generator will start dumping power or braking after about 8 hours assuming you were nearly empty on charge to start with. After that point you are failing to absorb or make use of the energy that the wind gen is providing. I don’t know how much energy from wind gens is wasted like this but my guess is typically about half the energy they produce is lost this way on most boats fitted with them.

So if you really want to get the most out of a stand alone wind gen you need a really big battery that can smooth out the intermittency of wind generation and maximize the energy absorption from them. As I am going that way anyway wind seemed a natural choice, particularly as solar at 50-60 degrees north isn’t that great a resource in the winter at that’s my stomping latitude.

Basically, don’t believe the hype about wind. By all means go solar if you have the space for it, you sail where the sun regularly shines and the wind does not blow, and you don’t want to invest in serious battery capacity. If, on the other hand, you sail where there is wind, you prefer a larger battery capacity and you sometimes sail where and when the sun doesn’t shine so bright, then seriously consider a good wind generator. You want be sorry.

[sailorboy1]

There is really no need to do an energy "audit" and reinvert the wheel.

A cruising boat with a frig and freezer, that uses "normal" amounts of power for lights, streaming video and few hours/day, pressure water etc. is going use around 120-150 Ah/day, If you have something extra like you are a heavy computer gamers, what to run watermaker, heat shower water, etc. you need to add for those.