Electrical Surcharge in Marinas

[ADMPRTR]

I noticed something that appears to be a new trend (at least for me).

Marinas charging extra for shore power hookup. One marina was $9/night. I am pretty sure I used nothing near that to recharge my batteries so I guess it is to compensate for the people who run their 60AMP air conditioners all day when they aren't on the boat.

Is this a new trend or was it just the marinas I happened to visit?

[zeehag]

marinas have to pay foir their electricity as well as do homes and other businesses. for many years electricity was reasonable in price.
that stopped.
if the,marina had to pay for all the electricity it used there would be no maintenance or some other goody ye like so much./ granted many marinas hit ye for premium in rates for electricity, but some arent so greedy.
we have electricity charges here-- is first 20,000 kilowattts free. after that is xxcents per kw .......
i had to pay 85 dollars in redondo beach in 1991 for electricity when my home use was less than 17 dollars with air conditioning just a few months prior.

[Vasco]

Unusual in US marinas but very common in the Bahamas. Actually in the Bahamas all marinas charge for power.

[Chief Engineer]

People who run those ceramic heaters on their boats in the winter here in Baltimore....get a real hefty bill.

1500 watt heater times two=3000 watts x 24 x 7 = 904,000 watt 904KWhrs

Some boats have higher bills than their homes.......Some Marinas mark up the price...even tho' it is illegal to do so.

[mbianka]

Originally Posted by ADMPRTR

I noticed something that appears to be a new trend (at least for me).

Marinas charging extra for shore power hookup. One marina was $9/night. I am pretty sure I used nothing near that to recharge my batteries so I guess it is to compensate for the people who run their 60AMP air conditioners all day when they aren't on the boat.

Is this a new trend or was it just the marinas I happened to visit?

It seems to be happening more and more. I'd be glad to pay $9 per night for electric. I've been in some marinas where they hit you for $20. I don't go to marinas often but, I usually do get electric if only to charge up my electric propulsion bank. But, I could do that in a couple of hours using my Honda generator and use much less than a gallon of gas to do it. Of course I won't do that in a marina. Those of us with just a 15 amp extension cord get to pay the same rate as the 50 foot Sea Ray with 50+ amp power cords running the air conditioning day and night.
Pirates did not die out some of them now operate marinas.

[O.C.Diver]

Originally Posted by Chief Engineer

People who run those ceramic heaters on their boats in the winter here in Baltimore....get a real hefty bill.

1500 watt heater times two=3000 watts x 24 x 7 = 904,000 watt 904KWhrs

Some boats have higher bills than their homes.......Some Marinas mark up the price...even tho' it is illegal to do so.

Marinas are allowed to mark up electricity but there is a legal limit to how much they can mark it up (in MD anyway). Infrastructure to deliver electricity from the street to the boat costs money. Only fair to allow a reasonable mark up.

Some marinas choose to not use individusl meters as they are limited to how much money they can make based on the legal mark up limit. By not having meters they can charge you whatever they want for "access" to electricity. Generally this access fee is agreed to in the lease.

Ted

[ADMPRTR]

In the situation I was speaking of it was a flat fee for transient dockage electricity.

I am not opposed to marinas making money (as long as they don't make it ALL off of me). In fact I want them to be profitable (at least moderately so) so they will stay around and keep the repairs up to date.

But regarding this fee, I would prefer that it be included in the transient fee, which is already high enough, generally. But I guess there are boats that are totally self sufficient who would wonder why they have to pay too when the don't plug in at all.

[John A]

At Grand Marina, Alamada California we had meters at the dockbox and were charged for individually use. More the one boatowner was kicked out of the marinia for running an exstension cord to a different dockbox.
It also identified illegal liveaboards, as the marina was allowed 10% liveaboard slips.

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by John A

At Grand Marina, Alamada California we had meters at the dockbox and were charged for individually use. More the one boatowner was kicked out of the marinia for running an exstension cord to a different dockbox.
It also identified illegal liveaboards, as the marina was allowed 10% liveaboard slips.

Um, the marina is 'allowed' as many liveaboard as they like. But in California if there are more than 10% then the tenant's get tenant's rights and can't be evicted for no reason.

[cal40john]

Most places I've been in the PNW run about $3 per night for transient moorage. I'm one of those that don't use it.

John

[sarafina]

Originally Posted by xymotic

Um, the marina is 'allowed' as many liveaboard as they like. But in California if there are more than 10% then the tenant's get tenant's rights and can't be evicted for no reason.

No, In the San Francisco Bay there is a Regional Water Quality Control Board and the Conservation and Development Commission.

Marinas are mandated by law to allow no more than 10% of their slips to be designated liveaboard. There are a host of regulation in place, but not consistently enforced, for liveaboard boats.

More than that and they must be proven to be required for the safe management of the marina or there may be substantial fines.


In the non liveaboard lease agreement it states that tenants are allowed to occupy their boat 3 nights a week. Sneakaboards are rampant, but not legal.

Renters rights do not apply to marina slips. The boat is the residence, not the slip.

[John A]

Originally Posted by xymotic

Um, the marina is 'allowed' as many liveaboard as they like. But in California if there are more than 10% then the tenant's get tenant's rights and can't be evicted for no reason.

In the San Francisco Bay there is the Bay Conservation and Development Commision ( BCDC ). Though the court system boats in marinas are declared bayfill and are under the control of the BCDC, and there is a 10% limit on the number of liveaboards that are allowed in a marina, or the marina will lose their permit to operate per the BCDC. All boats/liveaboards may keep their boats in a marina at the discretion of the owners.

Just as Government (police, CG, military, etc) can board/confiscate a boat without due processs, so to can a marina kick your sorry a** out of their marina on a whim.

This is based on my observation as a legal liveaboard in the San Francisco Bay for 15 years.

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by John A

In the San Francisco Bay there is the Bay Conservation and Development Commision ( BCDC ). Though the court system boats in marinas are declared bayfill and are under the control of the BCDC, and there is a 10% limit on the number of liveaboards that are allowed in a marina, or the marina will lose their permit to operate per the BCDC. All boats/liveaboards may keep their boats in a marina at the discretion of the owners.

Just as Government (police, CG, military, etc) can board/confiscate a boat without due processs, so to can a marina kick your sorry a** out of their marina on a whim.

This is based on my observation as a legal liveaboard in the San Francisco Bay for 15 years.

This may well be true but if it is it's isolated to the bay area. In the rest of the state there is no limit, HOWEVER very nearly every marina I've ever been to in CA does limit liveaboard to 10% and I have been told on numerous occasions that it's 'the law' when in reality it's the marina trying to be a$$holes.

This is the applicable law:

California Code - Chapter 2.7: Floating Home Residency Law [800. - 800.306.]

""Floating home marina" means an area where five or more floating home berths are rented, or held out for rent, to accommodate floating homes, but does not include a marina where 10 percent or fewer of the berths are leased or held out to lease to floating homes nor a marina or harbor (a) which is managed by a nonprofit organization, the property, assets, and profits of which may not inure to any individual or group of individuals, but only to another nonprofit organization; (b) the rules and regulations of which are set by majority vote of the berthholders thereof; and (c) which contains berths for fewer than 25 floating homes."

The result of this law is that every single marina in the state that could avoid being caught up in it, did. NONE of the marina management companies want to deal with restrictions on how and when they can evict.

SF may indeed have other regulations, however I have a feeling that these agencies are more likely named as the 'boogey man' when a dockmaster wants to deflect. FWIW, I can't find any 10% "law" but I see 10% bandied about by LOTS of people with various positions in 'officialdom'

I will say that I worked for one of the largest marina companies in the world, and when I was fired and then evicted after filing a sexual harassment complaint, rest assured that we delved into these issues VERY DEEPLY

[xymotic]

Originally Posted by sarafina

Renters rights do not apply to marina slips. The boat is the residence, not the slip.

This is not true in all cases, notably a few marinas in Sausalito tenants do have rights and CANNOT be evicted without cause, and those causes are codified into law:

(a)The Legislature finds and declares that, because of the high cost of moving floating homes, the potential for damage resulting therefrom, the requirements relating to the installation of floating homes, and current government policy limiting the availability of floating home berths, it is necessary that the owners of floating homes within floating home marinas be provided with the unique protection from actual or constructive eviction afforded by the provisions of this chapter.

(b)The management shall not terminate or refuse to renew a tenancy, except for a reason specified in this article and upon the giving of written notice to the homeowner in the manner prescribed by Section 1162 of the Code of Civil Procedure, to remove the floating home from the floating home marina within a period of not less than 60 days, which period shall be specified in the notice. A copy of this notice shall be sent to the legal owner, as defined in Section 18005.8 of the Health and Safety Code, each junior lienholder, as defined in Section 18005.3 of the Health and Safety Code, and the registered owner of the floating home, if other than the homeowner, by United States mail within 10 days after notice to the homeowner, addressed to the legal owner, each junior lienholder, and the registered owner at their addresses, as set forth in the registration card specified in Section 18091.5 of the Health and Safety Code.


When you are the victim of a constructive eviction, you learn all kinds of neat things like what is "constructive eviction"

[svBeBe]

In our travels we have found it to be extremely rare that a marina does not charge extra for shore power. Sometimes it is just a flat surcharge for shore power with a higher surcharge if air-conditioning or heaters are used. The vast majority of the time each berth is individually metered. As this is a business rather than a residence, boats are charged commercial rates for the electrical usage rather than the less expensive residential rates in the areas where these rates are separated.

In the Med many marinas have pedestals on the docks for electricity and water. You purchase a card and prepay whatever denomination you wish, and that amount is loaded into the plastic card. Insert the card into the pedestal to activate electricity and water. When departing, insert the card once again to remove your card account from the pedestal. When you return, even if to another slip, simply insert your card into the nearest pedestal and you continue to use the remaining amount that you have prepaid. When used up, take the card to the marina office and re-load with whatever denomination desired. This system works extremely well and takes the marina staff out of the loop -- no more staff hours wasted reading electrical meters. Only drawback is that each marina uses a different card, so one must purchase a new card at each new marina -- usually 5 Euro.

We are 3/4 way around now, having started in the Caribbean. The most expensive electricity we have paid for to date was in St. Thomas, USVI -- where operating our air-conditioning for 15 hours cost almost $80 during one 20-hour stay at a marina in December 2006. Although here in Cyprus the rate is .35 Euro per kwh, plus VAT. Not looking forward to the first electricity bill at this marina.

Judy
S/V BeBe