Flag Etiquette Question

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Hoofsmit

StuM

But can it be untied under load with one hand ?


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

Looks like ABOK#1212/1214. If so, the answer is yes

SWL - it would be easier to do so if it had "pseudo Franciscan"s on the ends to give a better grip. Check out the knot at ABOK#2004

[Blue Crab]

Would this be called a private signal worn t port?

Originally Posted by markpierce

[markpierce]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

Would this be called a private signal worn t port?

No, it's an historic flag as well as a political statement. In domestic USofA waters, there shouldn't be any confusion. It is only secondary to the national ensign flown at the stern.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

Would this be called a private signal worn t port?

It's. A piece of " bunting " and has no place on the starboard cross trees

Dave

[Ex-Calif]

Originally Posted by Hoofsmit

Ok...... I like the thread drift........ Might have start to a new one ......... Re: poll on seaworthy's swimming attire

Vote : yes
With pictured brief briefs
Vote: yes
El natural
Vote : yes
any picture of seaworthy in skimpy attire is a bonus
Vote: no
I want to talk about flags and really must get a real life away from CF


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

Uhhh... You'll notice that "flag" wasn't hoisted leading one to wonder what exactly SWL was wearing (not wearing) while swimming...

Originally Posted by carstenb

I'm not sure what british law says, but Danish law requires you to fly your national flag unless you are racing - so if this were in Denmark, the skipper would be in violation of the law (add another couple of dozen lashes).

Furthermore, flying two national flags at the stern where confuses the issue, because no one can tell if he is french or some degenerated brit. (add a couple of dozen more).

So how's that whole "EU" thang working out for ya'll?

Reading this thread just makes me say, "Thank God for Betsy Ross."

When we invade territory all we gotta do is squeeze in another star...

The Brits may have been too kind in their "empire building" with all these county options for flags - LOL...

Now the US states can futz around with flags they can fly at state capitols and schools but that's just for fun - LOL...

Well of course we did have a disagreement with the south at one point...

[carstenb]

Originally Posted by Ex-Calif

Uhhh... You'll notice that "flag" wasn't hoisted leading one to wonder what exactly SWL was wearing (not wearing) while swimming...





Reading this thread just makes me say, "Thank God for Betsy Ross."

When we invade territory all we gotta do is squeeze in another star...

The US has had its share of flags (I won't bother to post them all due to limited gigabytes on this forum). Suffice to say that when ole' Betsy was sewing away, it was 1 star and 1 stripe for each state. I forget the year, but someone finally woke up and realized that a flag with lots of stripes was going to get rather large. Therefore, by act of congress, the flag has 13 stripes in alternating colors, representing the original 13 colonies/states and 1 star for each state.

Now - when you'all get around to making Puerto Rico a state, you'll have 51 stars which will be a b*tch to arrange symetrically LOL

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

He had no idea .

OK Carsten. One for you. Who is responsible for flying the correct flag of registration? The owner or the skipper?

(The owner was not on board, the boat was on charter)

I was in Nymhamn a few days ago, next to a gorgeous motor-sailer, wearing a Swedish flag and a U.S. (!!??) courtesy flag. When I asked the skipper why, he replied that it is because his wife is American. So I guess plenty of people make up their own flag etiquette.

[carstenb]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I was in Nymhamn a few days ago, next to a gorgeous motor-sailer, wearing a Swedish flag and a U.S. (!!??) courtesy flag. When I asked the skipper why, he replied that it is because his wife is American. So I guess plenty of people make up their own flag etiquette.

No this actually correct etiquette. If you are sailing in your home waters and have a foreign guest on board that you wish to honor, you can fly their country's flag under the starboard spreader.

If you sail to a third country, then you move the honor flag from the starboard spreader to the port spreader, the starboard spreader being reserved for the courtesy flag of the country you are visiting.

We have american neighbors and when I take them sailing, we fly the stars and stripes from under starboard spreader.

Come sailing with me and I'll be happy to fly the US flag from under the starboard spreader

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I was in Nymhamn a few days ago, next to a gorgeous motor-sailer, wearing a Swedish flag and a U.S. (!!??) courtesy flag. When I asked the skipper why, he replied that it is because his wife is American. So I guess plenty of people make up their own flag etiquette.

Originally Posted by carstenb

No this actually correct etiquette. If you are sailing in your home waters and have a foreign guest on board that you wish to honor, you can fly their country's flag under the starboard spreader.

I take it the American wife was back home at the time?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by carstenb

No this actually correct etiquette. If you are sailing in your home waters and have a foreign guest on board that you wish to honor, you can fly their country's flag under the starboard spreader.

If you sail to a third country, then you move the honor flag from the starboard spreader to the port spreader, the starboard spreader being reserved for the courtesy flag of the country you are visiting.

We have american neighbors and when I take them sailing, we fly the stars and stripes from under starboard spreader.

Come sailing with me and I'll be happy to fly the US flag from under the starboard spreader

Learn something new every day!

[goboatingnow]

No this actually correct etiquette. If you are sailing in your home waters and have a foreign guest on board that you wish to honor, you can fly their country's flag under the starboard spreader.

If you sail to a third country, then you move the honor flag from the starboard spreader to the port spreader, the starboard spreader being reserved for the courtesy flag of the country you are visiting.

We have american neighbors and when I take them sailing, we fly the stars and stripes from under starboard spreader.

Come sailing with me and I'll be happy to fly the US flag from under the starboard spreader

I'm sorry, the starboard cross trees is the "superior" side and hence should never be used for "house flags , which have the status of "bunting " anyway. Your house flag should always be flown from the Port flag halyard

The primary position on the starboard flag halyard is the courtesy flag, it also carries the signal flags if used

The topmast is not a position of seniority so house and other bunting may be flown there ( typically including club burgees, flown in conduction with a defaced ensign )

personally I like this signal flag

https://www.dropbox.com/s/63dhe60j64...25.26.png?dl=0


Dave

[goboatingnow]

So how's that whole "EU" thang working out for ya'll?

Good - Thanks , took the US about 80 years to "settle down", so at about 45 years , we've a bit to go yet !!!

Reading this thread just makes me say, "Thank God for Betsy Ross."

When you have a 1000 year or more nautical history, come back to us, OK?

When we invade territory all we gotta do is squeeze in another star...

I could make a whole series of nasty modern comments, but hey Im a gentleman.

The Brits may have been too kind in their "empire building" with all these county options for flags - LOL...

Choice and variety is the spice of life !!!

Now the US states can futz around with flags they can fly at state capitols and schools but that's just for fun - LOL...

I would portend that the overt displays of nationality can be carried too far and get one into trouble

Well of course we did have a disagreement with the south at one point...

One that on my recent travels is still reasonably unresolved in places

dave

[carstenb]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

I'm sorry, the starboard cross trees is the "superior" side and hence should never be used for "house flags , which have the status of "bunting " anyway. Your house flag should always be flown from the Port flag halyard

The primary position on the starboard flag halyard is the courtesy flag, it also carries the signal flags if used

The topmast is not a position of seniority so house and other bunting may be flown there ( typically including club burgees, flown in conduction with a defaced ensign )

personally I like this signal flag

https://www.dropbox.com/s/63dhe60j64...25.26.png?dl=0


Dave

I have to disagree with you here Dave. The Danish book of flag etiquette notes that an honor flag (for a foreign passenger) is correctly flown under the starboard spreader, unless you are sailing in a third country. There it is moved to the port spreader.

It also notes that (I did not say this) that if there are other flags that are to be flown on the starboard side(in your case signal flags), then the honor flag is moved to the port side.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by carstenb

I have to disagree with you here Dave. The Danish book of flag etiquette notes that an honor flag (for a foreign passenger) is correctly flown under the starboard spreader, unless you are sailing in a third country. There it is moved to the port spreader.

It also notes that (I did not say this) that if there are other flags that are to be flown on the starboard side(in your case signal flags), then the honor flag is moved to the port side.

I cannot agree to your contention, I personally never fly VIP flags etc from the starboard trees , Wars in Europe , have been started over less

to me , flags representing the nationalities of those on board are clearly "house " flags and the RYA is clear to to where these are always flown.


For reference, what would you fly if a UK citizen was onboard as a house flag ? ( or for that matter an Italian citizen )


dave

[carstenb]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

I cannot agree to your contention, I personally never fly VIP flags etc from the starboard trees , Wars in Europe , have been started over less

to me , flags representing the nationalities of those on board are clearly "house " flags and the RYA is clear to to where these are always flown.


For reference, what would you fly if a UK citizen was onboard as a house flag ? ( or for that matter an Italian citizen )


dave

I'd fly whatever their national flag is (I do realize that with all the various UK flags around, I'd almost certainly end up flying an incorrect one).

You might want to check back with the RYA - I think you'll find they agree with me

Here's Wiki's take on this

The priority of hoisting locations depends on the rig of the vessel. With sloops, ketches and schooners the starboard yardarm or spreader of the highest or main mast is the second most honoured position. (That is, after the ensign at the stern.) Next after the starboard spreader is the port spreader. House flags (those defining the owner) are usually flown from the mainmast truck. When a club burgee is flown, it will normally be hoisted to the truck of the most forward mast. On a sloop, then, not having a foremast, the house flag could be moved to the port spreader if the starboard spreader was in use, and a burgee was being flown. On a ketch, the house flag would be moved to the mizzen.

You'll note that they say fly the house flag under the starboard spreader, moving it ot the port spreader if the starboard spreader needs to be used.

We don't need wars, but I've beaten to quarters, cleared for action, had the starboard gun battery loaded and run out. Should you want to strike your colors - I accept the surrender May I have your sword sir!