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Old 16-06-2019, 18:45   #1
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Colregs Research and Understanding

Hi,

At the moment I am studying the colregs for an exam in a few weeks. I have a couple of questions I need to be answered.

1, I learned the mnemonic, "OverNight Rooms For Sale Plus Supper", which gives the pecking order:

Overtaken vessel,
Not under command,
Restricted in her ability to manoeuvre
Vessell engaged in fishing
Sailing vessel, which is not also propelled by machinery.
Power driven vessel
Seaplane

Where does vessel constrained by her draught fit into this pecking order?

Quote:
Rule 18 (d)(i) Any vessel other than a vessel not under command or a vessel restricted in her ability to manoeuvre shall, if the circumstances of the case admit, avoid impeding the safe passage of a vessel constrained by her draught, exhibiting the signals in rule 28.
2. Rule 35 (a), (b) and (k) states:

Quote:
(a) A power-driven vessel making way through the water shall sound at intervals of not more than 2 minutes one prolonged blast.

(b) A power-driven vessel underway but stopped and making no way through the water shall sound at intervals of not more than 2 minutes two prolonged blasts in succession with an interval of about 2 seconds between them.

(k) A pilot vessel, when engaged on pilotage duty, may in addition to the signals prescribed in paragraphs (a), (b) or (g) of this Rule sound an identity signal consisting of four short blasts.
Does this mean four short blasts, 1 prolonged blast and four short blasts, and 2 prolonged blasts and four short blasts, are all signals that a pilot vessel when engaged on pilotage duty?
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Old 16-06-2019, 19:28   #2
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

I learned it "new reals catch fish so purchase some" Not under command, restricted maneuverability, constrained by draft, fishing, sailing, power, seaplane. There is no "constrained by draft" inland rules.
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Old 16-06-2019, 19:43   #3
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Welcome aboard, Ziggyfish


Q1: Constrained by draft = Restricted in her ability to maneuver


Q2: I am less sure of this, but I read it that the pilot vessel can use any of those signals, but that does not imply they are intended to be combined.
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Old 17-06-2019, 07:34   #4
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Constrained by draft is not the same as Restricted in her ability to maneuver. Both vessels not under command and those restricted in her ability to maneuver have priority over vessels constrained by draft.

Rule 18
(d) (i) Any vessel other than a vessel not under command or a vessel restricted in her ability to manoeuvre shall, if the circumstances of the case admit, avoid impeding the safe passage of a vessel constrained by her draught, exhibiting the signals in Rule 28.
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Old 17-06-2019, 12:26   #5
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

I have wondered for years what the definition of "constrained by her draft" is.



After all, aren't all vessels constrained by their drafts?



When I'm in a fin-keel sailboat, am I constrained by my draft if all of the other vessels in sight are powerboats with obviously shallower drafts?
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Old 17-06-2019, 12:52   #6
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

"Restricted in her ability to maneuver" can be construed as the same thing as a "vessel constrained by her draught." There was just no way to put in that little jingle which helps you to remember.

Also "fishing" means a commercial fishing vessel with gear in the water, not a sports fishing boat trolling, which is considered as any other power driven vessel.
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Old 17-06-2019, 15:51   #7
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank999 View Post
I have wondered for years what the definition of "constrained by her draft" is.



After all, aren't all vessels constrained by their drafts?



When I'm in a fin-keel sailboat, am I constrained by my draft if all of the other vessels in sight are powerboats with obviously shallower drafts?
I supposed you could be, with a couple of caveats. First, you must have the day shape or light signal displayed to claim any enhanced status. For Constrained by Draft that would be a black cylinder or three red lights in a vertical line.
Second, C by D only exists under the International Rules, so you would have to be out on the ocean beyond the Line of Demarcation, and in shallow enough water for draft to be an issue. Good luck finding a powerboater running in five feet of water who knows what the shape or lights mean.
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Old 17-06-2019, 16:01   #8
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschmidt View Post
"Restricted in her ability to maneuver" can be construed as the same thing as a "vessel constrained by her draught." There was just no way to put in that little jingle which helps you to remember.

Also "fishing" means a commercial fishing vessel with gear in the water, not a sports fishing boat trolling, which is considered as any other power driven vessel.
Not quite. If you're in a pleasure boat, sailing or motoring, the difference is moot. But the original question was regarding a Rules exam, I would assume as part of the Licensing exams. There, the assumption is that you are on one of those large vessels, so you must know the exact wording of the Rules and where you fit in.
But right on fishing. If the fish you catch don't end up in grocery stores or restaurants, you're not a fishing vessel. A lot of yo-yos out there think that as soon as they pick up their Zebco, that 1000 foot freighter bearing down on them has to keep clear. Chlorine in the gene pool, but there's a lot of them out there.
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Old 17-06-2019, 16:09   #9
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by capt jgw View Post
I supposed you could be, with a couple of caveats. First, you must have the day shape or light signal displayed to claim any enhanced status. For Constrained by Draft that would be a black cylinder or three red lights in a vertical line.
Second, C by D only exists under the International Rules, so you would have to be out on the ocean beyond the Line of Demarcation, and in shallow enough water for draft to be an issue. Good luck finding a powerboater running in five feet of water who knows what the shape or lights mean.

Rule 3(h):



"The term 'vessel constrained by her draught' means a power-driven vessel which, because of her draught in relation to the available depth and width of navigable water, is severely restricted in her ability to deviate from the course she is following."


So it doesn't apply to a vessel under sail at all.


Second, it doesn't apply just in any case where "draft is an issue". Only if, because of your draft in relation to the channel you're in, you can't practically deviate from your course.


Third, it applies only when you're showing the appropriate lights/shapes.


Note well that being CBD does not, unlike the situation with NUC and RAM, mean that other vessels give way to you. The Rule says that they are not to impede you -- a different process, like in Rules 9 & 10 for crossing with vessels navigating in a narrow channel or using TSS's.


This is why CBD does not appear in most Rule 18 mnemonics -- it is not part of the normal heirarchy.
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Old 17-06-2019, 16:40   #10
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

CBD:
Dockhead as usual identifies the salient point.
"shall not impede" and "avoid impeding" does not mean "is give way vessel".
Not impeding needs to come well before risk of collision and hence before stand on/give way becomes the issue. (Specifically see Rule 8 (e) (iii))



Pilot Vessels
May sound four short blasts in addition to their required signals as power vessels.


So when engaged in pilot duty;


If making way: either one long or one long and four short at the skipper's discretion
If not making way: either two long or two long and four short at the skipper's discretion


Four short blasts on their own is not correct.
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Old 17-06-2019, 16:54   #11
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschmidt View Post
"Restricted in her ability to maneuver" can be construed as the same thing as a "vessel constrained by her draught." There was just no way to put in that little jingle which helps you to remember.

Also "fishing" means a commercial fishing vessel with gear in the water, not a sports fishing boat trolling, which is considered as any other power driven vessel.
Note: nowhere in the COLREGS is the use category (commercial vs recreational) of the vessel specified. This includes fishing.

The COLREGS do read as if they had commercial fishing in mind, but it is never in fact specified.
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Old 17-06-2019, 17:14   #12
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by belizesailor View Post
Note: nowhere in the COLREGS is the use category (commercial vs recreational) of the vessel specified. This includes fishing.

The COLREGS do read as if they had commercial fishing in mind, but it is never in fact specified.
Agree.


Specifically:


"The term “vessel engaged in fishing” means any vessel fishing with nets, lines, trawls or other fishing apparatus which restrict manoeuvrability, but does not include a vessel fishing with trolling lines or other fishing apparatus which do not restrict manoeuvrability. "
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Old 17-06-2019, 23:54   #13
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

ziggyfish,

See this:

Handbook of the Nautical Rules of the Road by Llana & Wisneskey
(Handbook of the Nautical Rules of the Road)

Cheers
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Old 19-07-2019, 04:31   #14
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggyfish View Post
Hi,

At the moment I am studying the colregs for an exam in a few weeks. I have a couple of questions I need to be answered.

1, I learned the mnemonic, "OverNight Rooms For Sale Plus Supper", which gives the pecking order:

Overtaken vessel,
Not under command,
Restricted in her ability to manoeuvre
Vessell engaged in fishing
Sailing vessel, which is not also propelled by machinery.
Power driven vessel
Seaplane

Where does vessel constrained by her draught fit into this pecking order?



2. Rule 35 (a), (b) and (k) states:



Does this mean four short blasts, 1 prolonged blast and four short blasts, and 2 prolonged blasts and four short blasts, are all signals that a pilot vessel when engaged on pilotage duty?
Hi Ziggy.

A PDV (Power Driven Vessel) shall give way to: NUC, RAM, Fish, Sail.

The key here is to remember that a PDV Constrained By her Draft is just that, a power driven vessel. (PDVs are: PDV, PDV tow, and PDV CBD). Therefore a CBD fits in before NUC (if I were to agree with this list.)

I'm unsure about the list above, it's not particularly conducive to the rules nor does it really make sense. As an overtaken vessel you are the stand on vessel as per Rule 17 and are therefore required to maintain your course and speed, however if a vessel restricted in her ability to manoeuvre is in a risk of collision with you (as a PDV) you must oblige by Rule 18 and become the give way vessel and act accordingly, altering course to either port or starboard using good seamanship (which would not put you in another close quarters situation with the overtaking vessel.)

Also, a seaplane is considered a PDV so really has no place on this list.

Also, please DO NOT for the sake of your license/exam, EVER say RAM and CBD are the same in ANY WAY. They are absolutely not. There are rules that make a CBD the give way vessel to a PDV (as the CBD is in fact also a PDV) but there are no rules that make a RAM the give way vessel to a PDV.

With regards to a pilot vessel, the rules are ambiguous. They are currently accepted as PDVs, their sound signal is four short, however a pilot vessel making way would sound one long. A pilot vessel making way towards a vessel to engage in pilotage duties would sound four short.

Edit: Dockhead's reply is fantastic. He said stuff I left out. In particular, these rules only apply in full if you display relevant shapes.
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Old 15-09-2019, 11:45   #15
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Re: Colregs Research and Understanding

Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggyfish View Post
Hi,

At the moment I am studying the colregs for an exam in a few weeks. I have a couple of questions I need to be answered.

1, I learned the mnemonic, "OverNight Rooms For Sale Plus Supper", which gives the pecking order:

Overtaken vessel,
Not under command,
Restricted in her ability to manoeuvre
Vessell engaged in fishing
Sailing vessel, which is not also propelled by machinery.
Power driven vessel
Seaplane

Where does vessel constrained by her draught fit into this pecking order?



2. Rule 35 (a), (b) and (k) states:



Does this mean four short blasts, 1 prolonged blast and four short blasts, and 2 prolonged blasts and four short blasts, are all signals that a pilot vessel when engaged on pilotage duty?

Just wondering did you pass the test?

One issue many do not understand about the Colregs is that there are 4 separate sets of rules.

1. Open inland waters when different types of ships are near each other
This is where you use the pecking order.
2. Channels and fairways - used a different set of rules.
3. Western Rivers, Great Lakes - used a different set of rules.
4. International waters (high seas) - almost all the rules are the same as inland waters except there is a section about "Vessels Constrained be their Draft" rule 28

So for example a sailboat in open water has right of way over a power boat.
But in a western river the down bound power boat has the right of way over a sailboat.

So when taking the test first think which one of the 4 situations is the question asking about and then use that set of rules to answer the question.
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