Yanmar Filter Recommendations

[rabend]

I have aYanmar 4JH3 engine and I believe the engine final filter is 2 microns. What filter should I use in my primary Racor 500MA filter . . . . . 2, 10, 20, 30 microns?? Thanks for any advice and I would also appreciate rationale for the recommendations.

Bob

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by rabend

I have aYanmar 4JH3 engine and I believe the engine final filter is 2 microns. What filter should I use in my primary Racor 500MA filter . . . . . 2, 10, 20, 30 microns?? Thanks for any advice and I would also appreciate rationale for the recommendations.

Bob

30 microns in the primary. If you always sail in the same area in 1st world, check the element during first change (change both at same time). If the prefilter is much cleaner than the engine filter, you can switch prefilter to 10 microns.

You want both filters to share the burden as equally as possible. For boats with fuel polishing systems with pumps and filters, it's different.

ciao!
Nick.

[Ziggy]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

You want both filters to share the burden as equally as possible.

Why? The primary filter usually has a much larger surface area and it is often easier to change.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Ziggy

Why? The primary filter usually has a much larger surface area and it is often easier to change.

Because it is their job to provide as much clean fuel to the engine as possible. When you put 2 micon in the prefilter, you lose all capacity of the engine filter because it doesn't get used. Ideally, both should clog at he same time, in which case the maximum amount of fuel was cleaned. Real big particles fall down in the bowl of the racor.

This will never happen when you don't expect it because you keep an eye on the vacuum meter on the Racor (buy one if yours doesn't have it, it replaces the knob on top in that case).

Maybe you read my post differently... if your racor prefilter has more media surface area... you look at how dirty the surface is compared to the engine filter. The prefilter might have caught much more dirt because the element is bigger. Normally, a 30 micron prefilter catches around 75% of the dirt, leaving 25% or less for the engine filter.

ciao!
Nick.

[rabend]

Nick,

Thanks for the rundown! I was wondering what changes with fuel polishing/

Thanks,

Bob

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by rabend

Thanks for the rundown! I was wondering what changes with fuel polishing

see A new fuel system for Jedi (English) - s/v Jedi

ciao!
Nick.

[Ziggy]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Because it is their job to provide as much clean fuel to the engine as possible. When you put 2 micon in the prefilter, you lose all capacity of the engine filter because it doesn't get used. Ideally, both should clog at he same time, in which case the maximum amount of fuel was cleaned. Real big particles fall down in the bowl of the racor.

This will never happen when you don't expect it because you keep an eye on the vacuum meter on the Racor (buy one if yours doesn't have it, it replaces the knob on top in that case).

Maybe you read my post differently... if your racor prefilter has more media surface area... you look at how dirty the surface is compared to the engine filter. The prefilter might have caught much more dirt because the element is bigger. Normally, a 30 micron prefilter catches around 75% of the dirt, leaving 25% or less for the engine filter.

ciao!
Nick.

One of the large turbine series Racor filters has much larger capacity than the puny Yanmar secondary filters (I'd guess at least a factor of 10) and the secondary does not provide much additional capacity. A 30 micron Racor element filters out only about 90% of 30 micron or larger particles. This means that the secondary needs to catch the remaining 30 micron particles and everything smaller than that. I suppose there is nothing really wrong with the approach you suggest, but in practice, trying to tune the primary filter rating to get both filters to fail simultaneously is not practical, since the Racor elements only come in 2, 10, and 30 micron sizes. For what it's worth, here's the advice from Parker-Racor:

Racor’s two micron filter medium should only be used in final or secondary filters where the fuel is first filtered by a primary filter. The primary filter for a two micron final filter should use a 10 micron medium. The exception in using two micron filter in a primary filter is to obtain high-efficiency water separation, and is usually used in marine applications where the fuel supply may be cleaner but also many contain water more often. If the installation can allow the use of a filter large enough, then a two micron filter can serve in a system at the only filter in that system.

I don't think there's any harm in using a small micron rating primary filter, provided it does not significantly restrict the fuel flow.

[sabray]

With no technical detail I decided big is good. I put a 1000lf racor and use 2 micron cartridge. The tiny engine filter could catch some crap but nothing like that big bowl big surface filter. Advantage of the engine filter is its right in front of the pump.Worked for a few years now. Have a vacuum gauge that makes checking easy. Never seen it read near red line. Change both filters at the same time annually its cheap and easy. Cant think of anything wrong with this approach.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Ziggy

One of the large turbine series Racor filters has much larger capacity than the puny Yanmar secondary filters (I'd guess at least a factor of 10) and the secondary does not provide much additional capacity. A 30 micron Racor element filters out only about 90% of 30 micron or larger particles. This means that the secondary needs to catch the remaining 30 micron particles and everything smaller than that. I suppose there is nothing really wrong with the approach you suggest, but in practice, trying to tune the primary filter rating to get both filters to fail simultaneously is not practical, since the Racor elements only come in 2, 10, and 30 micron sizes. For what it's worth, here's the advice from Parker-Racor:

I don't think there's any harm in using a small micron rating primary filter, provided it does not significantly restrict the fuel flow.

Like I wrote before: in 1st world countries there's a good chance that 10 micron will work well. If you go cruising to the typical tropical cruising grounds, the fuel quality changes and you better adapt your filters to it or get into a lot of trouble. I've seen hundreds of boats with the problem.. many even have 2 micron primary elements and wonder why the engine quits.

Racor specifies the 30 micron element as primary filter, the 10 micron as secondary filter and the 2 micron as final (on-engine) filter. You can find those specs here: http://www.racor-filters.com/images/...bineSeries.pdf

If you buy genuine Racor elements, they filter all the particles of the -nominal- rating of the element. In reality, a 30 micron element will also filter out many 10 and 20 micron particles but will also pass some 30 micron particles. So yes, some 30 micron particles will pass to the final filter (but Racor does not specify how much and I doubt 10%) but the 30 micron element will also block many smaller particles. All elements block 99% of water.

So the simple answer stays 30 micron primary and 2 micron final stage. Only when your tank is really clean and you only get really clean fuel you can be better off with a 10 micron primary. I have never met boats that got into trouble because of using 30 micron primary filters and I met hundreds who got into trouble for using 2 microns as primary. With 10 microns halfway, 30 micron primary filter elements seem the safe option.

ciao!
Nick.

[sy_gilana]

Jedi....

Known from somewhere meeting before you are...

Heel mooi your filter system is...

Have a look at the DAVCO filter, very clever design...

Regards.

[Ziggy]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

If you buy genuine Racor elements, they filter all the particles of the -nominal- rating of the element. In reality, a 30 micron element will also filter out many 10 and 20 micron particles but will also pass some 30 micron particles. So yes, some 30 micron particles will pass to the final filter (but Racor does not specify how much and I doubt 10%) but the 30 micron element will also block many smaller particles. All elements block 99% of water.

According to Racor (http://www.parker.com/literature/Racor/7550_Rev_-_Fuel_Filtration_History.pdf):

Racor makes filters with various filtration efficiencies, but its standards for non-OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) are 2, 10, and 30 micron filter elements. The actual efficiency ratings for these are 98%, 95%, 90%, respectively.

90% efficiency at 30 microns means that the filter will retain 90% of all 30 micron and larger particles.

[sabray]

does not explain why not use a large 1000 series 2 micron filter up front. Racor can recommend the extra filters but why?. The engine filter is a suspender and the primary 1000 has enough surface area to manage a large usage. There is less hose less fitting. Doesnt look as cool but otherwise see no sense in multiple pre filters and then an engine filter. My thought was get the crap right now in as simple a way. If something gets buy the big 2 micron the cummins filter catches that. Big 2 micron filter water separator then engine separator. If you didnt have room for a 1000 series then two 500s make sense. Otherwise I see no down side . Except no one seems to like the idea.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Ziggy

According to Racor (http://www.parker.com/literature/Rac...on_History.pdf
90% efficiency at 30 microns means that the filter will retain 90% of all 30 micron and larger particles.

Cool, thanks for the PDF link. There was a small typo in the link, which I fixed in the quote in this post.

The document also describes how using a filter too long leads to lower efficiency figures. The message is to keep an eye on the pressure gauge and change when indicated.

ciao!
Nick.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by sabray

does not explain why not use a large 1000 series 2 micron filter up front. Racor can recommend the extra filters but why?. The engine filter is a suspender and the primary 1000 has enough surface area to manage a large usage. There is less hose less fitting. Doesnt look as cool but otherwise see no sense in multiple pre filters and then an engine filter. My thought was get the crap right now in as simple a way. If something gets buy the big 2 micron the cummins filter catches that. Big 2 micron filter water separator then engine separator. If you didnt have room for a 1000 series then two 500s make sense. Otherwise I see no down side . Except no one seems to like the idea.

I did not check out the specs but think your thought has a flaw in that the Racor 1000 filter is designed for much higher flow rates. When your engine does not meet the minimum flow rate, the whole turbine section of the filter fails to operate.

A filter must be matched to the engine fuel flowrate.

ciao!
Nick.

[sabray]

No I'm within flow rate but good point. That should be checked so add a downside.
Point is that these filter systems have a flow rate and you need to be within spec. This has to do with turbine models. The filtration is still micron rating but the water seperation and turbine effect declines. I think.