Removing Yanmar Fuel Injection Pump

[steve77]

I have a 4JH3-HTE that is having severe issues. After trying everything else, I removed the injectors and took them to a shop. I was told all four nozzles are bad and must be replaced.

When I got back to the boat, I thought I will check and make sure I am getting fuel from all four pipes. Remember, the injectors are removed and still at the shop. I put little containers under the pipes and cranked the engine for about 5 seconds. I got a small amount of fuel from #3 and #4, but nothing at all from #1 and #2. I double checked to make sure that there is no air in the system and there was not.

I want to remove the injector pump and take it to the shop for diagnosis. My manual makes no mention of bringing the engine to TDC before removal of the fuel injection pump. There are marks on the case that align with a bracket, but that's all. The three mounting bolts fit into slotted holes so the pump can be rotated a small amount each direction. These alignment marks show where the pump should be fitted along that slot.

A local diesel mechanic said that the Yanmar pumps can only be installed one way and it was impossible to put it back on wrong. Can anyone either confirm this or correct me? Thanks!

Steve

[hpeer]

4JH4TE. YES, they can be out back wrong.

Apparently in most diesels the pump is turned off the the main shat through a 2:1 reduction gear. Usually this gear, which must be pulled to remove the injector, has white index marks. Align these and all goes together fine.

HOWEVER, Yanmars a different, they have an addition gear so that the total reductionction between all gears is 2:1. If you loose the regestratiin between the marks it’s not so simple to realign the white marks, you also need to pull off the front gear cover and align those marks as well. PITA. There is an alternative way to restablish timing but it’s also a PITA, but you don’t need new gaskets.

You can do this but you need to be VERY CAREFUL to first align the white marks and the not even budge, not one tiny bit, the crankshaft until you put the injector back.

Guess how I know all this!

Good luck.

Oh, Yanmars factory service assistance was clueless.

[Allied39]

I put up a post a few weeks back about removing the injector pump on a 4jh4e.
It's a big job, well it's supposed to be but does not have to be.
I cant say that the 4jh4e is the same as what you are working on.....a 4jh3te?

BUT....be very carefull. Injector pump timing is not to be gotten wrong.
If directly in front of your injector pump (on the timing cover) there is a square plate bolted on with 4 M8x125 threaded bolts, remove the plate, do you see a gear held on a shaft with a nut and spring washer? Is there also two threaded holes in that gear?

DO NOT UNBOLT THAT GEAR!!! If you unblolt that gear without holding the gear in place it will turn into a big job. IE; remove the timing cover.
Anyhow, check if what I asked is the case. If so, I can help you.....if not...move forward with caution.
You can likely find my post posted on 10/25/2018

[steve77]

Originally Posted by hpeer

4JH4TE. YES, they can be out back wrong.

Apparently in most diesels the pump is turned off the the main shat through a 2:1 reduction gear. Usually this gear, which must be pulled to remove the injector, has white index marks. Align these and all goes together fine.

HOWEVER, Yanmars a different, they have an addition gear so that the total reductionction between all gears is 2:1. If you loose the regestratiin between the marks it’s not so simple to realign the white marks, you also need to pull off the front gear cover and align those marks as well. PITA. There is an alternative way to restablish timing but it’s also a PITA, but you don’t need new gaskets.

You can do this but you need to be VERY CAREFUL to first align the white marks and the not even budge, not one tiny bit, the crankshaft until you put the injector back.

Guess how I know all this!

Good luck.

Oh, Yanmars factory service assistance was clueless.

Thanks. I'm hoping I don't need to remove it, but I appreciate the info. Cheers!

Steve

[steve77]

Originally Posted by Allied39

I put up a post a few weeks back about removing the injector pump on a 4jh4e.
It's a big job, well it's supposed to be but does not have to be.
I cant say that the 4jh4e is the same as what you are working on.....a 4jh3te?

BUT....be very carefull. Injector pump timing is not to be gotten wrong.
If directly in front of your injector pump (on the timing cover) there is a square plate bolted on with 4 M8x125 threaded bolts, remove the plate, do you see a gear held on a shaft with a nut and spring washer? Is there also two threaded holes in that gear?

DO NOT UNBOLT THAT GEAR!!! If you unblolt that gear without holding the gear in place it will turn into a big job. IE; remove the timing cover.
Anyhow, check if what I asked is the case. If so, I can help you.....if not...move forward with caution.
You can likely find my post posted on 10/25/2018

Thanks. I did a search before posting my question, but must've missed your post. I'll take a look.

Cheers!

Steve

[hpeer]

I think Allied and Inare talking about the same thing.

[Allied39]

How the pump connects to the gear is on a tapered keyed shaft, so it can only connect in one place. I made a puller that bolts to the engine, bolts the gear in place meshing with the other gears and pops the shaft out of the gear
.
The only concern is that you might drop the key, but I lined up the gear so the key was on top to make that less likely.

After putting the puller in place it took about an hour to get the pump out. A bit of a pain, especially the bolts that hold the pump on, but I have most definately dealt with worse.

I REALLY did not want to remove (what I call) the timing cover. That would have taken several hours at best, a major pain.

Replacement was easy, no issue at all.

[steve77]

Originally Posted by Allied39

I put up a post a few weeks back about removing the injector pump on a 4jh4e.
It's a big job, well it's supposed to be but does not have to be.
I cant say that the 4jh4e is the same as what you are working on.....a 4jh3te?

BUT....be very carefull. Injector pump timing is not to be gotten wrong.
If directly in front of your injector pump (on the timing cover) there is a square plate bolted on with 4 M8x125 threaded bolts, remove the plate, do you see a gear held on a shaft with a nut and spring washer? Is there also two threaded holes in that gear?

DO NOT UNBOLT THAT GEAR!!! If you unblolt that gear without holding the gear in place it will turn into a big job. IE; remove the timing cover.
Anyhow, check if what I asked is the case. If so, I can help you.....if not...move forward with caution.
You can likely find my post posted on 10/25/2018

Hi, Allied.

My injection pump installation looks identical to yours. I removed the square cover plate and I have the same gear arrangement with two threaded holes.

I looked at your other post and I see the puller (pusher?) that you fabricated. I understand that it will hold the gear in place while you push the injection pump out of the gear.

But, you do need to remove the nut and spring washer before pulling, right? Your post above leads me to believe you have to hold the gear in place while removing the nut, but I think I am mis-reading you.

You remove the square cover plate, remove the nut and spring washer on the shaft, affix the pusher to hold the gear in place, and then push the injection pump out right? With the three bolts removed that hold the pump to the housing removed first, of course.

Appreciate your help!

Steve

[Allied39]

Yes, thats pretty much it. I said do not remove nut during inspection. (sorry, unclear)
It's all pretty much as you say, but first thing to do is manually rotate engine to bring the key to the top.
Of the whole procedure my main worry was dropping the key.
Basically , like you said, it's just a matter of holding the gear in place.
When I had it all prepped, key on top, puller in place bolted to the timing case and gear,nut and washer off and pump fully disconnected of all lines, wires and securing bolts it was time.
I had a friend tighten the centre bolt, which aligns with the shaft, a medium amount of pressure, I was holding the pump itself.... and "POP"........IT"S A GIRL!!!!
Sorry, thats what I screamed at the time.

It took a couple of hours to knock up the puller, no great feat. If you are going to make one be sure to get the key on top before marking out the holes for the gear.

Hope it's clear,
Ralph

[steve77]

Originally Posted by Allied39

Yes, thats pretty much it. I said do not remove nut during inspection. (sorry, unclear)
It's all pretty much as you say, but first thing to do is manually rotate engine to bring the key to the top.
Of the whole procedure my main worry was dropping the key.
Basically , like you said, it's just a matter of holding the gear in place.
When I had it all prepped, key on top, puller in place bolted to the timing case and gear,nut and washer off and pump fully disconnected of all lines, wires and securing bolts it was time.
I had a friend tighten the centre bolt, which aligns with the shaft, a medium amount of pressure, I was holding the pump itself.... and "POP"........IT"S A GIRL!!!!
Sorry, thats what I screamed at the time.

It took a couple of hours to knock up the puller, no great feat. If you are going to make one be sure to get the key on top before marking out the holes for the gear.

Hope it's clear,
Ralph

Got it!

This is a project for the weekend. Hoping to take the pump to a service facility Monday morning. I cannot thank you enough!

Cheers!

Steve

[Allied39]

Hope it all goes well, It should. It's a bit of a pain but believe me, better than removing the timing cover.

Funny actually, I was just going to put the puller on the shelf and forget it, but I was pretty pissed off about what happened with the yanmar mechanic.

When I first looked at taking the pump out I called the folks that did the install down in Key Largo. Mastro marine or some such. They put their sticker on the motor ( which reminds me, thats gotta go)

Anyhow, I was informed that the mechanic will not converse with an unskilled person. Ha, I am to stupid for him to talk to huh?
So after doing the whole job without the yamnar mehanic's superior intellect I thought, hey, why not put this out there?

So his superiority complex (undeserved) will hopefully help a lot of folks out there to not have to deal with being talked down to.
If there's any question you have before or during, dont hesitate to reach out.
Ralph

[steve77]

Originally Posted by Allied39

Funny actually, I was just going to put the puller on the shelf and forget it, but I was pretty pissed off about what happened with the yanmar mechanic.

When I first looked at taking the pump out I called the folks that did the install down in Key Largo. Mastro marine or some such. They put their sticker on the motor ( which reminds me, thats gotta go)

Anyhow, I was informed that the mechanic will not converse with an unskilled person. Ha, I am to stupid for him to talk to huh?
So after doing the whole job without the yamnar mehanic's superior intellect I thought, hey, why not put this out there?

So his superiority complex (undeserved) will hopefully help a lot of folks out there to not have to deal with being talked down to.
If there's any question you have before or during, dont hesitate to reach out.
Ralph

He won't speak to an unskilled person??? What arrogance!

I am making good progress with the removal, but it's time for a shower since I promised my wife dinner and a movie. We are in Gibraltar where they have movies in English, so this is a treat.

One question - how did you prevent the engine from rotating as you loosened that nut on the end of the tapered shaft? I only tried for a few minutes, but the whole engine rotated rather than the nut backing out. I already replaced the injectors thinking just the compression would provide enough resistance. Thanks!

Steve

[Allied39]

I didn't have a problem.
You will likely have to manually turn the engine to bring the key to the top, a socket on the harmonic balancer (big pulley on the crank) works good. Maybe hold the engine from turning with that.

Don't take this wrong, some might.
About 12 years back I sold my marine repair business in NY to a big muscly guy. He worked with me for weeks, learning the boats and gaining more knowledge.
Anyhow, one day we had to take a kanzaki transmission off a yanmar in a yacht club launch. He was trying to undo the bolts, had a breaker bar on it and all his strength.....couldn't do it.
I grabbed a hold and popped them right off. It was not good. He couldn't understand how I did it and he couldn't.
I explained that when undoing tight bolts you take up the tension so everything is firm and seated and give them a ....I dont know how to explain it. You give it a shove? Maybe a surge? A heave?
You bring your effort to maybe 40% and then a burst of 80%. It's like with smaller bolts when you apply pressure to the spanner with your left and hit the spanner with the palm of your right.
Anyhow, 9 out of 10 times it does the trick. Actually I would probably say more like 19 out of 20.
I was surprised how many folks hadn't learnt that. I think I learned that at 10, but thats me,
So I am not trying to be an ass (yes, gifted, not even trying) but are you doing that?
Hope you and the missus enjoyed your movie.
Good to keep missus happy.....especially a missus that will live aboard.
My missus went to sleep once with dried puke in her hair after a real hard two days....definitely a keeper.
Ralph

[steve77]

Originally Posted by Allied39

I didn't have a problem.
You will likely have to manually turn the engine to bring the key to the top, a socket on the harmonic balancer (big pulley on the crank) works good. Maybe hold the engine from turning with that.

Don't take this wrong, some might.
About 12 years back I sold my marine repair business in NY to a big muscly guy. He worked with me for weeks, learning the boats and gaining more knowledge.
Anyhow, one day we had to take a kanzaki transmission off a yanmar in a yacht club launch. He was trying to undo the bolts, had a breaker bar on it and all his strength.....couldn't do it.
I grabbed a hold and popped them right off. It was not good. He couldn't understand how I did it and he couldn't.
I explained that when undoing tight bolts you take up the tension so everything is firm and seated and give them a ....I dont know how to explain it. You give it a shove? Maybe a surge? A heave?
You bring your effort to maybe 40% and then a burst of 80%. It's like with smaller bolts when you apply pressure to the spanner with your left and hit the spanner with the palm of your right.
Anyhow, 9 out of 10 times it does the trick. Actually I would probably say more like 19 out of 20.
I was surprised how many folks hadn't learnt that. I think I learned that at 10, but thats me,
So I am not trying to be an ass (yes, gifted, not even trying) but are you doing that?
Hope you and the missus enjoyed your movie.
Good to keep missus happy.....especially a missus that will live aboard.
My missus went to sleep once with dried puke in her hair after a real hard two days....definitely a keeper.
Ralph

Well, the injection pump is off and I took it to the service facility this morning. We hope to have an answer tomorrow as to what the prognosis is. I'll post the results when I get them.

Thanks so much for the help in getting the pump off. Could NOT have done this without your help. Cheers!

Steve

[steve77]

I told you my engine was having "severe issues". I picked up the injection pump from the service facility in Algeciras, Spain (next to Gibraltar) and there were two broken springs inside. My two springs came out in five pieces.

We already had made plans for a one week holiday, leaving tomorrow, so I will not be able to reassemble the engine until I return. However, this looks like the smoking gun I was looking for.

I am blaming this on fuel I purchased in Monastir, Tunisia. I don't think it had the lubricity that was required. Because of fluky winds in the Med, I have burned about 130 gallons of this fuel before the engine damage occurred. For what it's worth, the engine has 2300 hours on it.

Looking forward to reinstalling the pump and injectors in about a week when we return. Cheers!

Steve