Whats it like in an upturned catamaran ?

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Buzzman

Some of the above points would also help mono sailors survive, for example, 180 or 360 knockdowns.


For example, closing companionway doors might have prevented the 'washing machine' effect that wrecked the boat mentioned above. Seems simple, but reality is most people don't put all their washboards in place, so companionways on a mono are never watertight, and with a sliding deck roof, probably can't be made so.

One of the major recommendations of the Fastnet '79 Enquiry. Previous owner added door bolts to the inside to secure both the hatch boards and the sliding hatch to our yacht. They are still there and will remain so whilst I own her.

Pete

[dcstrng]

Originally Posted by Dave Howell

Recommend book by Tony Bullimore of his capsize in the Southern Ocean a long, long way offshore. This book is of a real life experience. Many comments in this thread are opinions only - though often thought provoking

One of the earliest of this genre (if you can call it that), was "Lost" by Thompson (many errors made -- one of the families of the tragedy are boyhood friends of mine and we still communicate regularly -- yes, we're old...)

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Pete7

One of the major recommendations of the Fastnet '79 Enquiry. Previous owner added door bolts to the inside to secure both the hatch boards and the sliding hatch to our yacht. They are still there and will remain so whilst I own her.

Pete

A good addition, and not just for capsizes..

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Pete7

One of the major recommendations of the Fastnet '79 Enquiry. Previous owner added door bolts to the inside to secure both the hatch boards and the sliding hatch to our yacht. They are still there and will remain so whilst I own her.



Pete

I got to looking at my boat, a weak link to it and I assume many is the Lazarette, if it’s not secured and the boat rolled, it could take on hundreds of gallons of water nearly instantaneously, and of course it’s connected to the bilge.
So if weather gets bad, I lock the lid to the Lazarette.

Securing our hatch with a bolt also locks the boards in place as the hatch overlaps the boards.
I get a little concerned seeing many especially newer boats with not so strong doors as opposed to hatch boards.

[FlyingScot]

I believe CE certification requires the hatch for catamarans 12m and above. Our cat doesn't have one and is just under 12m in length. I don't miss them (yet). They have pluses and minuses. They can leak or fail. They can be left open and ingest a lot of water underway. They occupy valuable room where a locker could fit. They do have a nice view and could come in handy or could even save your life under the right circumstance. Our cat, like many was built with sealed compartment in the lower forward hulls. The builder claims the boat won't sink. Of course almost anything will sink if broken into small enough bits. But realistically, I believe it will float bows up, stern down.

Pantaenius USA never asked about a life raft. We don't have one.

[Buzzman]

Have a look at some of the modern 'condomarans' and their double-glass sliding "patio-style" doors.
Little or no bridgedeck or coaming to prevent water ingress from waves boarding from astern, which could in turn take out the entire door.
I remember thinking that the single width, round-cornered, high coaming, solid wood companionway entrance on a mate's seventies Crowther Spindrift was a PITA until he explained why the high coaming was necessary. And yes, it had latches inside and out.

[mikedefieslife]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

I believe CE certification requires the hatch for catamarans 12m and above. Our cat doesn't have one and is just under 12m in length. I don't miss them (yet). They have pluses and minuses. They can leak or fail. They can be left open and ingest a lot of water underway. They occupy valuable room where a locker could fit. They do have a nice view and could come in handy or could even save your life under the right circumstance. Our cat, like many was built with sealed compartment in the lower forward hulls. The builder claims the boat won't sink. Of course almost anything will sink if broken into small enough bits. But realistically, I believe it will float bows up, stern down.



Pantaenius USA never asked about a life raft. We don't have one.

Small manufacturers can apply for exemptions too.

I remember reading somewhere that the makers of my cat said you’d be better off with a good axe. Lol.

Personally i like a hatch. Nice view, good air, and since they are often in the heads, you can open them and you have a urinal.

[MartinR]

Originally Posted by conchaway

Why aren't there escape hatches in a monohull (just curious)?

There are escape hatches in some extreme racing boats that do not self right. But the average yacht does not stay upside down for long, so there is no need.

I think there is no need in cats either. Just a CE gimmick that adds more risk.

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by MartinR

There are escape hatches in some extreme racing boats that do not self right. But the average yacht does not stay upside down for long, so there is no need.



I think there is no need in cats either. Just a CE gimmick that adds more risk.

‘Gimmick’????

No, potentially life saving with very small risk of contributing or causing an emergency (via lens falling out or other failure).

If there is a person inside a hull when the boat inverts their only reasonable hope of getting outside is via an escape hatch - the interior route via stairs, salon and cockpit has multiple traps.

If there is a person outside, the escape (access) hatch is for the same reasons as above the only reasonable way to get into the hulls. Inside is better than outside, though I have heard of people living in life rafts or dinghies lashed between the hulls.

Sure, some boats have weaker structures in a designated area that can be more easily cut or hacked. But that assumes tools are stored near that area on both sides of the hull and that that area of the hull is not structurally significant.

In non-emergency situations the hatches are wonderful for ventilation and to surreptitiously pee.

[boatman61]

You must either be very short or only pee sitting down.

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by boatman61

You must either be very short or only pee sitting down.

Nope, knees supported by the bottom edge of the hatch. Interior floor is well below the waterline.

My wife dared a female guest into peeing out a hatch once - that was pretty funny and fortunately the hull below the hatch gets rinsed as soon as we’re moving.

[smj]

Why don’t cats come with solid fiberglass/cored hatches rather than the standard acrylic hatch that has a record of loosing its lens?

[Buzzman]

The only reliable report I've read by someone who has actually done it, is DON'T moor the dinghy/liferaft over the bridgedeck on an upturned cat.
The feller who did had a crew who lived comfortably in the forrard survival compartment while he spent a thoroughly miserable (bordering on terrifying) night in the dinghy/liferaft lashed to the upturned bridgedeck.
Can't remember the boat or skipper's name, but it's been widely reported.
Boats without a built in escape hatch should have lifeline attachment points built into the underside of the hull/wingdeck area.
Probabaly makes sense to have a small, discrete hatch there as well, containing said lifelines, space blankets, bottled water and energy dense food bars.
If, as Murphy's Law dictates, the boat turtles at night in a storm, you won't be able to do much more than simply hang on, at least till daylight, and that means surviving the night, continuously washed over by waves.
A push-pull Japanese wood saw would also be useful, to effect re-entry to the hull(s).
Cats without CE hatches should probably have a marked out area (both inside and out) to show you where to cut. Perhaps a length of 4mm tubing could be tacked to the original hull mould so as to leave a small depression in the gelcoat surface to help guide the saw.
Inside the hull it could simply be marked on the hull as part of the final layup.
Of course, you'd have to check the underwing compartments before every offshore passage - in case of light-fingered Loueys making off with the lifesaving kit...

[Mr B]

My Motor cycle takes 3 x CO 2 cannisters to inflate my flat tyre to about 22 PSI, enough to ride on,
They take about 3 seconds to be totally empty, A big box of cannisters can easily be stowed any where on a boat, $20-00 for twenty cannistors, Delivered,

They dont need power to use, Just screw them onto the valves on the tube and thats it,
It Can be done in total darkness, If you can find the canisters, Hahahahaha, Possibly in a float Container permanently tied to the tubes,
The tubes work either inverted or just with a hole in my boat,

I dont know how many it would take to pump up big tractor tubes, which can be stored flat under the mattresses in the bedrooms,

I need four big tractor tubes to cover what I am missing in permanent Bouancy in my floatation chambers to keep my Cat on the surface,
Yes I have calculated it out, The tractor tubes need to float one ton only, One cubic metre of air,
My sinks, Thru hulls, Black tank, are all either under or above the waterline,
Inverted, would make no difference to water ingress into the hulls, They all have Valves and can be tuned off any way,
I have two skins for my hulls, Cutting my way out is not an option,

Never been inverted, But I have had both hulls full of water, Sunk on the beach
The crap that is floating in the water is horrendous, Its full of knives and forks, and every thing else thats sharp and wants to stab your bare feet,

Every thing that was stored away nice and neat, Is now just a soggy slushy sludge floating in the water, Including the draws and doors and Cupboards they were stored in,

Bedding, Clothes, Coats, Safety gear, Your Auto life vests have all gone pop and inflated, Canned food, Vegies Toiletries from the Dunny, tools, Fishing gear and Hooks,
Every thing is floating in this sludgie soup, All the cupboards have emptied and is floating or lurking on the floor waiting to stab your feet,
Inverted and every thing on the roof,
All my ropes float and I only have one rope in the cockpit, So it would be easy to get out thru the cockpit,
The ropes in the boom are all tied down as I dont use the mainsail at all, The boom is also tied off and cant move either,
My dinghy is lashed down titely under the davits when Im travelling, So it would be now supporting the transom from sinking,
Now I know I cant sink, Im not worried about it,
Four big tubes and a box of CO2 cannistors, Cheap insurance,

Cheers, Brian,

[Chotu]

There have been a lot of comments here saying anything will sink if it is broken into bits. That isn’t exactly accurate. All materials in the water follow Archimedes principle.

If the material your catamaran is made out of is lighter than the amount of water it displaces, it’s not going to sink. That is, unless you loaded it up with a lot of heavy junk.

My boat was carefully constructed to be unsinkable. You can cut it into small 6 inch pieces with a chainsaw and it will still float. It’s a real struggle to keep the dagger boards and rudders down in the water. They pop right back up.

So, it really depends on what boat you are talking about. Foam core boats to do exceptionally well in this area. Especially 1 inch thick core like mine.

The same principles can hold true for any catamaran, depending on how much weight they put in it versus what material the hull is made out of. Nevermind any watertight bulkheads.