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Sand crab · 20-09-2014, 16:26

Isn't Morecambe Bay mostly sand and/or mud? This is what beachable cats are made for. I'll bet that Lagoon would have been fine there.

**weavis** · 20-09-2014, 16:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sand crab

Isn't Morecambe Bay mostly sand and/or mud? This is what beachable cats are made for.

Not from a 25-35 foot drop.........one second your on top and the next your banging the bottom.

smj · 20-09-2014, 16:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by weavis

Guys, whilst the semantics are going on, the fact remains that the evidence shows a fairly poor below waterline layup.

Now, I like Lagoons and for that reason, its a bit of a shock to see production models not be what they oughtta be!

I dont care how many cross oceans safely.......... it only took one leak in Concorde to end an illustrious safety record that screamed of more luck than good design.

This is not good, and certain circumstances NOT SAFE. This is the reality. I dont care if you all want to argue what Minaret actually meant, it doesnt change the fact that its not a strong or adequate hull.

I have crossed them off my list. I have grounded very hard in my time, and Im concerned that if I had been in this vessel, it would have been a poor outcome.

Try the Morcambe Bay in England for grounding. Tide will pull water out from under you and hit the bottom very hard......several times.

It's a shame that you would allow some pictures and a bunch of bickering on a forum to rule out a boat. Lagoons aren't on the top of my list, but it's not because of the basic construction. I've always thought they were generally laid up well, but I could be wrong.

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**weavis** · 20-09-2014, 16:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by smj

It's a shame that you would allow some pictures and a bunch of bickering on a forum to rule out a boat. Lagoons aren't on the top of my list, but it's not because of the basic construction. I've always thought they were generally laid up well, but I could be wrong.

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I dont like to "think", I like to be sure. The bickering has nothing to do with it. The pictures tell the story. Its not a strong composition at a critical point.
The sad thing is that its quite likely a lot of well known production boats have the same build technique.
Only a repair shop would know that and Im sure a lot of them are not permitted to discuss it.

Fiveslide · 20-09-2014, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by smj

It's a shame that you would allow some pictures and a bunch of bickering on a forum to rule out a boat. Lagoons aren't on the top of my list, but it's not because of the basic construction. I've always thought they were generally laid up well, but I could be wrong.

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Pictures of a boat's laminate schedule below the waterline, exposed through other's mishaps, seems a perfectly good reason to rule out a boat, if that boat isn't laid up in a way that the buyer thinks is proper.

Indeed, internet bickering is not a good reason to rule one out.

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socaldmax · 20-09-2014, 17:15

I don't like bickering either, but when pictures or videos show up as proof, it helps me decide who was right, if common sense or logic hasn't already made the decision. It's sad to see such cost saving measures, especially when these things cost so much.

smj · 20-09-2014, 17:18

I see the pictures but all I see is a boat that was destroyed on a reef. I've done numerous fiberglass projects and worked for a multihull builder for awhile but I'm not able to decipher what would constitute a bad fiberglass job. Could someone walk me through the picture and tell me what is wrong?

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Fiveslide · 20-09-2014, 17:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by smj

I see the pictures but all I see is a boat that was destroyed on a reef. I've done numerous fiberglass projects and worked for a multihull builder for awhile but I'm not able to decipher what would constitute a bad fiberglass job. Could someone walk me through the picture and tell me what is wrong?

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I never said it was a bad job. I said if the buyer thought it was a bad lay up, then the pictures of it are good enough reason to rule it out. It's relative to what the buyer wants or expects.

Edit: for the record, I just think the lay up is thin.

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**neilpride** · 20-09-2014, 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by smj

I see the pictures but all I see is a boat that was destroyed on a reef. I've done numerous fiberglass projects and worked for a multihull builder for awhile but I'm not able to decipher what would constitute a bad fiberglass job. Could someone walk me through the picture and tell me what is wrong?

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Check again the picture from the lagoon destroyed and try to figúrate the lamination thicknes, my 2 cents no more than 6 mm.
Someone mention Catana, well they are cored to the bones and with a ridiculous thin exterior skin, someone mention twaron and kevlar, Catanas are very fragile against groundings or collisions, i know that because each year one or two get wrecked by chárter partys here in St Marteen , i see one with a starboard bow almost gone due a dock collision.

Kevlar? this remind me the history of a full kevlar hull 45 racing yacht sunked some time agoo due a broken mooring , boat reach the rocks and get holed , sunk in shallow wáter , the owner decide to recover the boat and bring it to the boatyard , almost any fiberglass resin epoxy expert in the island refuse to make a try with the kevlar, no idea why ,maybe Minaret know better about this, one of the experts say its imposible to postcure repair Kevlar in any way , result?? we tow the boat 15 miles offshore and sunk it.. Owner decisión.

Most yacht builders have hull samples from trhuhulls installations , i have the layup Schedule from my boat, hull and deck, keel ballast, Wood used in the construction , bulkheads , etc... or you can walk in any boatyard ,with some luck you can found the boat of your dreams with some open hole in the hull ready for a new trhu hull, now ask yourself if this enough or not..

smj · 20-09-2014, 19:28

Not sure if I could determine the exact hull thickness from the photo as there's really nothing to dimensionally compare the thickness with. Maybe it's a production boat thing but I remember an Island Packet, probably mid to upper thirty foot range that was brand new and it ran into a sunken steel monohull. I was really surprised when I saw the boat on the hard as the hull thickness below the waterline was probably 6mm or about 1/4". Really surprised me as I thought they were built like tanks.

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socaldmax · 20-09-2014, 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by smj

I see the pictures but all I see is a boat that was destroyed on a reef. I've done numerous fiberglass projects and worked for a multihull builder for awhile but I'm not able to decipher what would constitute a bad fiberglass job. Could someone walk me through the picture and tell me what is wrong?

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This is the pic I'm referring to. Almost like a snapshot of the other one, halfway through the hull pounding process. Do you feel this is a strong hull?

smj · 20-09-2014, 19:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by socaldmax

This is the pic I'm referring to. Almost like a snapshot of the other one, halfway through the hull pounding process. Do you feel this is a strong hull?

Honestly it's kind of hard to tell when we don't know exactly what type of pounding it took right?

**neilpride** · 20-09-2014, 19:53

Lagoon hull hole before installing thru hull, hummmmm!!

socaldmax · 20-09-2014, 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by smj

Honestly it's kind of hard to tell when we don't know exactly what type of pounding it took right?

You can't look at what's left of the hull and make a determination if it's thick enough and/or the right layup schedule for that size of boat?

Maybe that pic isn't good enough detail, but if you could see it in person, I'm sure you'd form an opinion as to quality of construction based on what's there, regardless of how much pounding it took. A larger vessel would obviously require a thicker, stronger hull than a smaller vessel.

Isn't it possible to look at the thickness and type of hull construction and get a good idea if it's extremely rugged, or just about right, or too weak for that particular vessel? Or how it compares to other brands in terms of durability.