In Escrow on Lavezzi 40and about to cancel. HELP!!

[S/V Alchemy]

Get on a rocket. You still can't get away fast enough. The boat market is saturated with better deals.

[smj]

As a real estate investor you should know that the broker, just like a real estate agent, has no reason to lower their commission just because they are the only broker-real estate agent involved. They now have the responsibility of dealing with both buyer and seller so their duty is not cut in half. Having said that, I'm guessing the broker could have dropped a couple of points of his commission to see the deal go through if he thought it was worth it.


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[jrbogie]

Originally Posted by spinnerbug

I'm inclined to walk. .[/U]

when i'm inclined to walk i always do.

[spinnerbug]

Originally Posted by smj

As a real estate investor you should know that the broker, just like a real estate agent, has no reason to lower their commission just because they are the only broker-real estate agent involved. They now have the responsibility of dealing with both buyer and seller so their duty is not cut in half. Having said that, I'm guessing the broker could have dropped a couple of points of his commission to see the deal go through if he thought it was worth it.


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I guess I would argue that getting the sail done and taking care of his client would be a pretty good reason. Also, I'm not sure if you've worked in a situation like this, but we were on our own. That broker did nothing to help us other than fill in the contract template and setup the marina for haul out. I've done lots of deals in my life and I know when someone is bringing value. He did not bring $16k worth of value and he did nothing to hold the deal together... obviously because it fell apart.

So while he has no obligation to help save the deal, a smart broker would have... IMO.

[spinnerbug]

Originally Posted by S/V Alchemy

Get on a rocket. You still can't get away fast enough. The boat market is saturated with better deals.

Thanks @alchemy. I wish that were the case. We've been searching for a while and even spent some time looking at boats in Thailand. Finding catamarans that have been looked after reasonably well for under $200k has been a daunting task for us. There aren't as many out there as it seems at first blush. We like the layout of the Lavezzi Maestro so now it becomes even more difficult.

With that said, if you've got a lead on a seller, we'd love to talk to them.

[akprb]

Price seems good, is it compared to others you looked at? Most of the items mentioned were fairly small and predictable for a boat of that vintage. Our SD20s always were milky, freaked out before crossings Pacific but after much counsel from Yanmar guys on both sides just lived with it and serviced regularly.

Life goes by fast. Are you ready to go? Ready to dig into these things. Perhaps push the "I believe" button and move forward.

Just an uninformed thought :-)

[spinnerbug]

Originally Posted by akprb

Price seems good, is it compared to others you looked at? Most of the items mentioned were fairly small and predictable for a boat of that vintage. Our SD20s always were milky, freaked out before crossings Pacific but after much counsel from Yanmar guys on both sides just lived with it and serviced regularly.

Life goes by fast. Are you ready to go? Ready to dig into these things. Perhaps push the "I believe" button and move forward.

Just an uninformed thought :-)

@akprb- we kind of felt the same way. Turns out, these drives have been leaking for 4 years now. The composition of the oil was so bad, the test came back as not readable. The surveyor said he'd not seen that in 30 years of surveying. The price would have been okay if it was just the drives, or just the electrical, or just the bottom paint, or just the engine leaks, or just the rudders falling off, or just the faded cushions, or just the leaking hatches. You get my point. I'd still like to buy the boat and deal with the stuff, all I wanted was a flush, seal, and check of the sail drives and to kick in something for the rest of the neglect.

Don't get me wrong, your point is taken and we now don't have a boat that we otherwise could have if we wanted to just pay for it the stuff. I'm thinking I'll spend 180k instead and then just eliminate the time... Maybe...

[smj]

Originally Posted by spinnerbug

I guess I would argue that getting the sail done and taking care of his client would be a pretty good reason. Also, I'm not sure if you've worked in a situation like this, but we were on our own. That broker did nothing to help us other than fill in the contract template and setup the marina for haul out. I've done lots of deals in my life and I know when someone is bringing value. He did not bring $16k worth of value and he did nothing to hold the deal together... obviously because it fell apart.



So while he has no obligation to help save the deal, a smart broker would have... IMO.

We have purchased 10 catamarans and sold 9 and I also build spec homes for a living so we are pretty familiar with the process. We purchased 4 of the catamarans through a broker and sold all our cats by owner. We have had mixed results with brokers, some good and some terrible. In my opinion the broker was an idiot to let this deal fall through if he had to give up a few points. But then again, both he and the buyer may have another customer lined up if the deal did fall through.


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[spinnerbug]

Originally Posted by smj

We have purchased 10 catamarans and sold 9 and I also build spec homes for a living so we are pretty familiar with the process. We purchased 4 of the catamarans through a broker and sold all our cats by owner. We have had mixed results with brokers, some good and some terrible. In my opinion the broker was an idiot to let this deal fall through if he had to give up a few points. But then again, both he and the buyer may have another customer lined up if the deal did fall through.


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@smj- wow, how do you have time to go sailing 8^). We're on the same page. He was just greedy and thinks he's going to sell to someone who doesn't care about the sail drives and electrical issues and hog the whole deal again. Doesn't seem likely to me but he may very well have someone lined up. Time will tell.

Thanks for taking the time to weigh in on this one.

[akprb]

Originally Posted by spinnerbug

@akprb- we kind of felt the same way. Turns out, these drives have been leaking for 4 years now. The composition of the oil was so bad, the test came back as not readable. The surveyor said he'd not seen that in 30 years of surveying. The price would have been okay if it was just the drives, or just the electrical, or just the bottom paint, or just the engine leaks, or just the rudders falling off, or just the faded cushions, or just the leaking hatches. You get my point. I'd still like to buy the boat and deal with the stuff, all I wanted was a flush, seal, and check of the sail drives and to kick in something for the rest of the neglect.

Don't get me wrong, your point is taken and we now don't have a boat that we otherwise could have if we wanted to just pay for it the stuff. I'm thinking I'll spend 180k instead and then just eliminate the time... Maybe...

Good points and you have the first hand info for sure. Inadvertently you have put yourself in a very good position with respect to this vessel. I'd write a nice letter saying "if things change we would still be interested in purchasing" then line out the costs you expect, sail drive replacement being the biggest, leave your low yet reasonable offer on the table then move on. I've bought a lot of real estate this way ;-)

[spinnerbug]

Originally Posted by akprb

Good points and you have the first hand info for sure. Inadvertently you have put yourself in a very good position with respect to this vessel. I'd write a nice letter saying "if things change we would still be interested in purchasing" then line out the costs you expect, sail drive replacement being the biggest, leave your low yet reasonable offer on the table then move on. I've bought a lot of real estate this way ;-)

Let's hope that works. In our acceptance of vessel letter I told the broker just that. Really, I think he's not much of a broker and wouldn't take the time to come back to us. I suppose he's correct and there's a line of people waiting to buy it as is. Only time will tell.

[Moontide]

I think Dinradcliff was pretty right on The potential buggies are the cracked bulkhead and the doors if it means structural items moved.

Water in sail drives MAT be no big deal. Friend had that problem for 5 tears, then pulled and mic'd them in his machine shop. All within tolerance. Apparently Yanmar uses soft steel for the output shafts and it scores easily. Other side is if shot will probably be 3k or more apiece.

One thing left out. What have actual sales prices been for this boat model. Re you at top of price range or 50K ynder. If 50 under your still getting a good deal. If at the top maybe not.

As one added pressure point you can send a certified letter and cc of survey to broker and owner. If then then fail to disclose it could open them to a civil fraud claim from final buyer.

[smj]

Moontide brings up a good point. Did the broker ever send you the soldboats.com comps for the boat?


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[spinnerbug]

Originally Posted by Moontide

I think Dinradcliff was pretty right on The potential buggies are the cracked bulkhead and the doors if it means structural items moved.

Water in sail drives MAT be no big deal. Friend had that problem for 5 tears, then pulled and mic'd them in his machine shop. All within tolerance. Apparently Yanmar uses soft steel for the output shafts and it scores easily. Other side is if shot will probably be 3k or more apiece.

One thing left out. What have actual sales prices been for this boat model. Re you at top of price range or 50K ynder. If 50 under your still getting a good deal. If at the top maybe not.

As one added pressure point you can send a certified letter and cc of survey to broker and owner. If then then fail to disclose it could open them to a civil fraud claim from final buyer.

Originally Posted by smj

Moontide brings up a good point. Did the broker ever send you the soldboats.com comps for the boat?


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@moontide- great idea about putting them on notice about the defects and disclosure. I'm sure they're trying to hid it right now.

@smj- the broker did basically nothing for us. We represented ourselves. However, I did a little digging and found boats closing for around $170k which were setup similarly. Problem is, we don't know their actual condition. This boat has some "extras" but they don't work and have to be replaced or restored. We were basically paying exactly market value of the boat without the sail drive issue. I think.

[Newportyachty]

Crappy Broker if he is aware and hiding ****!