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Old 18-02-2010, 22:15   #31
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Originally Posted by tackdriver View Post
Nope, and you don't go to windward either.


JMB
I go to windward just fine, but thanks for asking... now if I can just figure out how to keep from tipping over......

Remind me to head over to the mono area and explain all about keel bolts on a mono...
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Old 19-02-2010, 05:25   #32
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hmmm....since all the hard pointy objects just as rocks and reefs and coastlines and semi-submerged wrecks are in coastal waters, wouldn't it make more sense for "coastal" cruisers to be the ones with the thicker hulls?

Offshore water is much softer than coastal water. Thats where the thin hulled boats should safely be...

Oh wait, I forgot about icebergs. Thicker hulls repel icebergs..right?
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Old 19-02-2010, 07:23   #33
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Canibul, "Offshore water is much softer than coastal water"???????? Wow, that's news. I think the point is that those who are sailing offshore have less of a chance of avoiding huge seas/breaking waves than those who sail near shore (and who can avoid going out, or can tuck into port at the first sign of bad weather).

Furthermore, apart from the Flying Dutchman, I thought that offshore sailors eventually had to return to port and hence face the same 'hard stuff around the edges" - often with less of an opportunity to pick an ideal weather window.

And icebergs? Did anyone say that even more solidly-built cats can 'repel' icebergs? I must have missed that post, Canibul. But thanks for the insight. I'm sure it will help the original poster in ascertaining which cat under 100K he should purchase.

Brad
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Old 19-02-2010, 10:18   #34
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Lighten up, Francis.
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Old 19-02-2010, 11:52   #35
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hmmm....since all the hard pointy objects just as rocks and reefs and coastlines and semi-submerged wrecks are in coastal waters, wouldn't it make more sense for "coastal" cruisers to be the ones with the thicker hulls?
Makes sense to me. You ought to point this out to Performance Cruising.

You seem to be on a one man crusade to 'prove' to all of us guys who know that boat (even the guys who have owned one) that we are all wrong.

How about this for being fair....I'll invite you to an afternoon at my marina here and now...

Walk on my British Cat and then a couple of newer Geminis. On the condition that you then come back to this thread and do a mea culpa.
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Old 19-02-2010, 12:55   #36
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Is the $100K your total budget for the boat, or do you have additional money set aside for fixing and upgrading the boat? Often people spend another 20-30% of the purchase price of the boat getting it ready.
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Old 19-02-2010, 13:39   #37
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The less I spend on a boat the longer I can cruise without needing to work, so my budget is the best boat with the most equipment for the least amount of money. If I spend 50K on a boat I can easily cruise for 4 years without concern, If I spend 100k I can cruise for a year or so without any cash input. I'm trying to maximize the sailing part and minimize the working part so I'm willing to cruise something older & less shiny to the same great places as I would if I had, say, a nice new Privilege, for instance.
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Old 19-02-2010, 15:43   #38
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Makes sense to me. You ought to point this out to Performance Cruising.

You seem to be on a one man crusade to 'prove' to all of us guys who know that boat (even the guys who have owned one) that we are all wrong.

How about this for being fair....I'll invite you to an afternoon at my marina here and now...

Walk on my British Cat and then a couple of newer Geminis. On the condition that you then come back to this thread and do a mea culpa.
Heck I'll do it right now. I admit your boat has thicker hulls than a Gemini, and was designed for North Sea Conditions.



As for whether a Gemini is any good...well....a thousand boats out there kinda puts that one to bed. Gemini are still in business. Is Catalac? Besides, I can't find another boat that meets the specs that are important to me, at ANY price...

You seem to be the one man crusade to attack a boat you don't own and never intend to buy. Not sure why you want to prevent people from buying Gemini's. Gemini's are lighter than Catalacs, they're faster than Catalacs, and they are repeatedly crossing the exact same oceans as Catalacs.

What was the question again?



There, feel better?
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Old 19-02-2010, 16:44   #39
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LOL... yeah, I do. Is that a self portrait?

We all have posted what we have because this is a cruising forum, and Gemini's were designed as a weekend sailor.
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Old 20-02-2010, 04:51   #40
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Did you tell that to Slapdash? Those silly idiots think they could sail one around the world. And the boat is now in SE Asia...having crossed the Pacific.

A weekend sailor can go as far as you want if you keep stacking your weekends end to end and don't turn around.

Define cruising. Define "we all have posted". When there are over a thousand of you alls....you'll be even with the opposition. Assuming you all have owned and sailed on Geminis before making your judgements.

Since we won't be cruisers by your definition, once we own a Gemini, what should we call the three week period while we sail from Florida through the Bahamas and further south? A long weekender?
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Old 20-02-2010, 05:32   #41
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The statements in my previous post were made from our experience with the 3200 not the 105. From what I hear the 105 is a definite upgrade to the other models. The reason we sold was the bridgedeck pounding, not as much while sailing but while at anchor. I don't know if the 105 has improved this. The picture I've attached is a photo I took yesterday of a Gemini in the Fl Keys doing some work on their rudder cages. Only in a Gemini!
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Old 20-02-2010, 06:54   #42
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Make up YOUR mind and buy what YOU think suits YOUR needs.

If you look up all gemini threads on CF it's always the same two or three people that own british tanks and know better than anybody else about the weakness and softness of Geminis. Stress cracks at stanchions are just that: Stress cracks at stanchions. Yes those decks flex when I jump up and down. Wow what a test.
No one has ever pointed out any event at sea that was caused by structural failure of Gemini hulls. Period.

So just stop listening to the Gemini bashers out there. Go to FL and have a look at what is available. 100K should buy you a decent Gemini.

I have recently seen a nice example at Yachtworld:
2000 or 2001 model, Good looking, First owner, lift kept, 700hrs on the engine, everything in original shape and in working order. 99900 USD
Was listed for 2 or 3 days, was sold for 95000 USD

Looks like a bargain (at least from a distance). Mid to Late 1990s Geminis are typically listed around 70 or 80 K


For the notes: I own a gemini and have had my feet on british cats a couple of times. I do like both but happened to buy a Gemini. I haven't crossed oceans in british cats nor Geminis and most likely never will (I'd rather fly). Most people out there talking about these boats and their ocean crossing abilities also haven't done so and never will.
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Old 20-02-2010, 09:06   #43
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We all fall in love with what we have...

...and that is a wonderful thing. My marriage is the better for it.

I would like to repeat the PDQ 32 recommendation. They are generally just over $100K, but that is in part because most are less than 15 years old and need very little work. They were built to a very high standard and most have been maintained to a high standard. PDQ reorganized and now only makes the PDQ power cat and the PDQ/Antaries 44, which is wonderful for live aboard cruising, but way out of my range. I guess 44 is the new 30-some, just as houses have grown.

The link to my blog is below (signature block), and there are links to PDQ information and other PDQ blogs on the side bar.

The PDQ 32 has 2 queen size state rooms, which makes it great for a family of 3. The bridge deck won't pound; it is quite high. When sailing, they are just about inseparable if sailed well; I can walk away from a Gemini if they are sloppy, but if they are motivated, we might as well be tied together, up wind and down. I do a little better if it is rough (no pounding), but they have less draft. I have much beter helm visibility, they have a little more living space. They have a diesel, I have 2 outboards in inboard wells. I have better dependability and repairability, IMHO.

Dimensions:
PDQ 32 Altair
LOA, 31.2 LWL 31, 16 beam, 7200 pounds

Gemini 105mc
LOA, 33.5 LWL 31.75, 14 beam, 8000 pounds
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Old 20-02-2010, 14:57   #44
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I would like to repeat the PDQ 32 recommendation. [...]
Agreed, nice boat! Feels like bit better quality than the Gemini and looks better, too.
We have 2 small kids so the 2 cabin layout of the PDQ32 did not really fit. The three cabin PDQ36 is more expensive. not really out of range but the difference between the Gemini and the PDQ36 pays for two or three years cruising.
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Old 20-02-2010, 15:08   #45
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Agreed, the PDQ 32 is best with 1 child.

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Agreed, nice boat! Feels like bit better quality than the Gemini and looks better, too.
We have 2 small kids so the 2 cabin layout of the PDQ32 did not really fit. The three cabin PDQ36 is more expensive. not really out of range but the difference between the Gemini and the PDQ36 pays for two or three years cruising.
They get a very nice cabin, but there are only 2 cabins.

There is always resale value; with any good cat you will get the money back.
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