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Old 03-10-2006, 11:20   #16
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Marc, OK I'm embarrased as hell! I'd been trying to find out what type of boat it was and I'd assumed that it was a larger cruising cat being out in those conditions with 5 people on board. I hadn't seen it had been righted by its owner! I think my sole point would be using John Shuttleworths static wind capsize formula our boat would start to lift her hull in 24.2 knots of wind beam to. Take from that whatever you will.
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Old 03-10-2006, 13:13   #17
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Sinking Cats...

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Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat
Cats can sink? Well the materials for mine UNASSEMBLED occupied 4.5m3, and weighed 2.5 tonnes. Including 44 gallon drums of epoxy and pallets. So even as just a pile of building material it was bouyant, it's hard to see how building it into a boat would make it any LESS bouyant.
Well I am sure that bouancy varies with the design. But consider the weight of the engine, rigging, hardware and all of the spares we like to load on. Some cats certainly can sink. See...

http://www.getjealous.com/getjealous...084&go=keylara

as one example. Your design may be fine, but I think it is a mistake to assume that if you are on a cruising cat you will be able to use your boat as a liferaft, unless you have some means of additional floatation in the boat. Of course a fire would negate even positive floatation.
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Old 03-10-2006, 23:06   #18
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Interesting link that. Just sitting on the beach drinking pinacolada's while the tide comes in to engulf their boat! And then making sure it gets towed out to deep water before it sinks!

I'm guessing that kind of peace of mind comes from being adequately insured.

I have to admit though that older, solid glass cats would sink if damaged badly enough, but doubt if new foam or balsa cored boats would sink entirely no matter how badly smashed up.
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Old 04-10-2006, 04:17   #19
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I'm glad you wrote that, CruisingCat. I had the same thought. I was wondering why they didnt get something to use as rollers and pull the cat UP the beach to drain and dry out. Hell, cut the seatbelts out of 16 Avis rental cars and use THOSE to pull it up, if thats what it took... After their incident with the pump not being able to keep up with the incoming water while beached, why would they tow the boat anywhere near deeper water? I dont understand that decision. They stated that they had no insurance.
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Old 04-10-2006, 06:17   #20
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Wasn't the boat they lost a Dean 365 with balsa core? I was confused looking at their website, they went looking for a prout, but I think were persuaded to get a dean. Either way, yes, in retrospect, the damage was done, they should have just taken their time and got a salvager to put float bags in the hulls and then tow it to a travel lift.
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Old 04-10-2006, 06:19   #21
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in any case, it pretty much settles the myth of the unsinkable fiberglass catamaran that isnt broken to bits, at least in my mind. Live and learn.

Of course hindsight, Monday morning quarterback, and all that applies. It would be very interesting to read what they wished they had done differently, now that they can look back at the whole process and know all the elements that led them to those decisions.
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Old 04-10-2006, 08:10   #22
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agree, that they obviously took a decision in haste and repent at leisure.
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Old 04-10-2006, 14:49   #23
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one advantage of catamarans is the ability to seperate out different areas into water tight compartments. In the hulls, usually it is the forward sail locker, the main living compartment and then the aft transom. However, there are transboat bulkheads seperating the forward cabins and aft cabins as well, many of which have round doors. Potentially, one could put reinforcements in the doors to make them water tight (gaskets on the inner seal, perhaps a simple sleeves for bracing bars which would sit on either side of the door on the bulkhead), thus making the 3 normal water tight compartments 4 or 5 larger water tight compartments with much greater reserve bouyancy. Anyone have any better ideas for how it could work?
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Old 04-10-2006, 19:08   #24
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I guess I don't have great faith in simply floating upside down. If you can't attract help the situation becomes as untenable as sinking.
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Old 04-10-2006, 19:14   #25
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Yeah Joli, except your floating.

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Old 04-10-2006, 19:17   #26
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Yea, but selling the fact as safety is still a false sense of secuity if you are not found.

http://www.sailinganarchy.com/forums...994&hl=capsize
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Old 04-10-2006, 19:19   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joli
I guess I don't have great faith in simply floating upside down. If you can't attract help the situation becomes as untenable as sinking.
That's your opinion I guess. I would rather be stuck in an upside-down 44 foot cat than a 6 foot inflatable liferaft, or a lifejacket! I would also suggest a 406 EPIRB would be a good thing to have along, and at least if your boat is still afloat (even upside down) you have every chance to use that EPIRB - which might be difficult if the EPIRB were on the bottom along with the boat.
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Old 04-10-2006, 19:26   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joli
Yea, but selling the fact as safety is still a false sense of secuity if you are not found.

http://www.sailinganarchy.com/forums...994&hl=capsize
The boat in that link was barely afloat. Most multihulls will float higher than that. I know of one racing cat which capsized (too much sail for the conditions) and it floated so high in the water it's diesel engines stayed dry. (Only one of them needed a new alternator afterward)
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Old 04-10-2006, 21:25   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joli
selling the fact as safety is still a false sense of secuity if you are not found.
This statement could be applied to liferafts as well.

If you're not found, how long do you figure your survival in a liferaft? An inverted cat at least offers the potential of food stores and other supplies.

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Old 05-10-2006, 02:53   #30
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survival in a liferaft or on an upturned boat has much more to do with attitude than equipment. Read any of the stories of the people who have survived astonishingly long periods in a raft to understand this point.

I have often thought about having a couple of dwarf bulkheads made up for my cat. I had intended using a drill and through bolting if needed
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