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Old 10-05-2014, 05:06   #1
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Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

I am looking for a newer Lagoon 440 for pleasure sailing around the Gulf of Thailand.

1) Why would this boat be so much cheaper than the others?

Sailing yacht LAGOON LAGOON 440 [year: 2009] used - Sailing yacht for sale - EYB

2) When looking for a Captain to sail a Lagoon 440 from America / Europe to Thailand, do you pay a daily wage + expenses? What is a fair rate? I would accompany him as well. If I had to leave, what would the cost be to hire a second in command for him?

3) Why the wide range in prices for newer Lagoon 440s, presuming similar options? Is it just owner's judgement or can there be a real difference in value between late model Lagoon 440s?

4) My experience is all aviation based, but is there any type of simulated synthetic vision that shows below the waterline on a moving digital map? We used Garmin's SVT for flying and fog, night, etc. we had a very good situational awareness of all obstructions and position.

5) Is there any advantage to purchasing a Lagoon 440 from America as opposed to Europe other than sailing time? I calculate 50 days from Europe and 90 days from America to Thailand.

Sorry for all the questions but I'm new at this and just trying to not make any mistakes.
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Old 10-05-2014, 05:44   #2
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Re: Can someone help me with some general questions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeWM View Post
I am looking for a newer Lagoon 440 for pleasure sailing around the Gulf of Thailand.

1) Why would this boat be so much cheaper than the others?

Sailing yacht LAGOON LAGOON 440 [year: 2009] used - Sailing yacht for sale - EYB

2) When looking for a Captain to sail a Lagoon 440 from America / Europe to Thailand, do you pay a daily wage + expenses? What is a fair rate? I would accompany him as well. If I had to leave, what would the cost be to hire a second in command for him?

3) Why the wide range in prices for newer Lagoon 440s, presuming similar options? Is it just owner's judgement or can there be a real difference in value between late model Lagoon 440s?

4) My experience is all aviation based, but is there any type of simulated synthetic vision that shows below the waterline on a moving digital map? We used Garmin's SVT for flying and fog, night, etc. we had a very good situational awareness of all obstructions and position.

5) Is there any advantage to purchasing a Lagoon 440 from America as opposed to Europe other than sailing time? I calculate 50 days from Europe and 90 days from America to Thailand.

Sorry for all the questions but I'm new at this and just trying to not make any mistakes.
Get a quote from several skippers. boatman61 on here has an excellent track record and is reasonably modest in his pricing. HIs last delivery was a lagoon.
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Old 10-05-2014, 06:12   #3
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

The ad is short on verbiage so it is hard to say why the price is so low (hull damage? Lightning strike? Did it sink?). Boats in the Caribbean are often lower priced than boats on the mainland of the US or Europe because there are so many well used boats coming out of charter service (lots of competition) as well as the boats that get sailed there from Europe whose owners then decide they don't want to sail them back. Even for a post charter boat this is a very low price.
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Old 10-05-2014, 06:16   #4
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

I was only asking because another one I was looking in Spain was priced at 330,000 Euros for a 2009 with low hours. How much wear and tear can a charter boat have in just 3 years?

Thanks for your insight....
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Old 10-05-2014, 06:43   #5
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pirate Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeWM View Post
I am looking for a newer Lagoon 440 for pleasure sailing around the Gulf of Thailand.

1) Why would this boat be so much cheaper than the others?

Sailing yacht LAGOON LAGOON 440 [year: 2009] used - Sailing yacht for sale - EYB
There could be a variety of reasons why a boat goes for a knock down price out of charter.. my Bene was because a lady had bought it for her new BF to play on and when paid off live the dream.. when she caught him playing around she just wanted rid of it as fast as possible..
Or.. it could be cosmetically trashed.. only a survey/inspection can verify the reason
2) When looking for a Captain to sail a Lagoon 440 from America / Europe to Thailand, do you pay a daily wage + expenses? What is a fair rate? I would accompany him as well. If I had to leave, what would the cost be to hire a second in command for him?
Some skippers work on a day rate.. others on a mileage rate.. second in commands are not the norm.. just skipper and crew.
3) Why the wide range in prices for newer Lagoon 440s, presuming similar options? Is it just owner's judgement or can there be a real difference in value between late model Lagoon 440s?
Location, Location, Location... or.. personal situations..

4) My experience is all aviation based, but is there any type of simulated synthetic vision that shows below the waterline on a moving digital map? We used Garmin's SVT for flying and fog, night, etc. we had a very good situational awareness of all obstructions and position.
No... folk waffle on about forward looking sonar but when your medium is solid air... its not that effective... all that close range false info would do your head in..

5) Is there any advantage to purchasing a Lagoon 440 from America as opposed to Europe other than sailing time? I calculate 50 days from Europe and 90 days from America to Thailand.
Don't make the mistake of working on hull speeds and theoretical daily runs.. my trip US-Spain was going great.. then problems with the boat dropped my speed to 9 days to cover 700 odd miles... I'd done around 2000+ in the previous 10 days..
Oh.. and US/Carib is cheaper.. no VAT.. unless its a charter sell off in Greece or somewhere
Sorry for all the questions but I'm new at this and just trying to not make any mistakes.
Don't worry about it.. if no one asked questions we'd be bored shitless..
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Old 10-05-2014, 07:10   #6
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

Thanks again for the insight. So essentially for a forward looking technology, boaters are relying on charts and visual for reefs, logs, sand bars, other boats and so on?

Aviation is so advanced now that I have a simulated display of everything you would normally see outside your cockpit window regardless of visibility. When an obstruction or another aircraft is in range, a voice prompts you and the cost is very minimal for this technology.

Boatman, do you have an email I could contact you for ferry costs?

Thank you....
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Old 10-05-2014, 07:20   #7
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

> I have a simulated display of everything you would normally see outside your cockpit window

It's a lot easier to map the land above sea level in detail than it is to map what's below the water. And I suspect that you don't see too many floating containers, logs etc at x,000 ft AGL.
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Old 10-05-2014, 07:22   #8
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

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> I have a simulated display of everything you would normally see outside your cockpit window

It's a lot easier to map the land above sea level in detail than it is to map what's below the water. And I suspect that you don't see too many floating containers, logs etc at x,000 ft AGL.
true.... except for one time in..............
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Old 10-05-2014, 07:35   #9
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

Thanks for the replies. I'm just new at this but willing to learn. My only experience with sailing is in float aircraft..a little different. But we still had to have a good understanding of weather, currents and water conditions.

I'm essentially just looking to get the boat over to Thailand for easy sailing in the Gulf around the islands here. The prices here in Thailand are just completely unreasonable for the Lagoon 440 boats. That's why I'm looking overseas.
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Old 10-05-2014, 08:39   #10
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

Agree with most of what has been posted here.

Here are a few random thoughts.

Used boats always vary in advertised price and some sell for a lot less, some are worth the advertised price. I have seen posts from folks claiming there are deals in the Far East in general, you just have to find them.

Also not sure why you are only considering the L44. Nothing wrong with that boat but there are lots of 40-50 feet condomarans for sale that can get you on the water sooner if you are more flexible.

Don't act too quickly. There are plenty of boats for sale.
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Old 10-05-2014, 08:55   #11
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pirate Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomfl View Post
Agree with most of what has been posted here.

Here are a few random thoughts.

Used boats always vary in advertised price and some sell for a lot less, some are worth the advertised price. I have seen posts from folks claiming there are deals in the Far East in general, you just have to find them.

Also not sure why you are only considering the L44. Nothing wrong with that boat but there are lots of 40-50 feet condomarans for sale that can get you on the water sooner if you are more flexible.

Don't act too quickly. There are plenty of boats for sale.
Personally I think the L380 is a better boat.. handling, sheltered con and the space is not all that different.. just one less crapper
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Old 12-05-2014, 07:32   #12
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

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1) Why would this boat be so much cheaper than the others?

Sailing yacht LAGOON LAGOON 440 [year: 2009] used - Sailing yacht for sale - EYB
One of the reasons it's cheaper is because it's a 4 cabin charter version, instead of the 3 cabin owner's version. The owner's versions, which dedicate one side of the boat to an owner's suite, tend to be rarer and therefore more expensive on the resale market. And of course there's the general impression that charter boats generally have fewer options and more wear and tear than boats that were used by individual owners.
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Old 12-05-2014, 07:33   #13
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

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Personally I think the L380 is a better boat.. handling, sheltered con and the space is not all that different.. just one less crapper
Except the 380 has a VERY tiny galley, the only real weakness of an otherwise good boat.
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Old 12-05-2014, 09:35   #14
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Re: Can Someone Help me with some General Questions?

Boatman

As to Sonar, we have found one very good use for it based on our cruising waters which include ICW and rivers and various harbors and ports and areas full of pilings, rocks, and shoals and other obstructions. It has served us well in locating underwater items shown on charts or mentioned on cruise sites. It has also served us well in examining shoaling to get a good feel for how far out it has come and how shallow.

In open waters, we've really found little use. I know one of the points occasionally used to sell it is sunken containers. Well, we don't go slow enough that it would likely help us in that regard. At speed, by the time you read, figure out what you read, digest it, you're on or past the object. But at idle speeds in close waters, it can help you locate problems.

An occasion we recently used it was a narrow channel with a very large commercial vessel coming through and determined to take all the channel. These were waters we weren't familiar with. We were able to check just outside the channel and determine that we had additional width we could use to give him clearance. We also used it approaching a marina where the charts had clearly labeled pilings but the docks had recently been moved around and changed completely so that determining where they were was difficult. We were able to determine they were now a non issue as they were right under the center of the dock, covered by deck completely.

Not suggesting everyone run out and buy it, just saying it can have it's uses.
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Old 23-06-2014, 03:03   #15
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Because he has done his homework... or sailed a L440

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Also not sure why you are only considering the L44. Nothing wrong with that boat but there are lots of 40-50 feet condomarans for sale that can get you on the water sooner if you are more flexible.
Because he has done his homework... or sailed one. What other "condomaran" could sail 231 NM per 24h, and cover the 3000 NM between the Galapagos and Marquises in just over 16 days, overloaded, without gennaker, spinnaker or folding props? While easily outperforming every other cat under 46 ft (except the L450) "on the hook", where you will spend more than 95% of the time. With some ex-charter units now available for less than $300000. A no-brainer, really.
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