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Old 24-12-2013, 20:43   #16
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
You should to look for the beamiest boat with conservative SA/D ratio or highest ballast. The wide beam will give you good initial stability and conservative sail management can keep it that way. An older style narrow boat, even those with 50% ballast ratios will heel quickly, get in the groove and stay there... good sailors... but exactly what you dont want!
Many of the more modern boats you mention will meet that description... so look at the sail area and draft/ballast details.
+1.

Flat, wide bottom. Lots of ballast down low. Don't get a shoal draft model.
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Old 24-12-2013, 21:11   #17
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A roller furling main a fractional jib and a fat assed boat. You can furl main to keep boat fast and flat that is the way a lot of newer boats want to sail. It is also a lot less fatiguing than sailing on your ears.
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Old 25-12-2013, 02:22   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
FWIW, the fear that the heeling boat is about to sink is quite a common one. Women handle it differently, depending on their motivation, partly; some are actually quite brave and continue to confront the fear until it goes away. Or they become sensitized. Ann
I am not keen to tell anyone about their own partner but Ann is absolutely right for our case. Sally suddenly became totally comfortable with the boat a month ago. She is not really sure what changed but she thinks she just became desensitised to it. (I just double checked this with her). It took less than a year of our current heavy old monohull. So you might both be pleasantly surprised.

Matt
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Old 25-12-2013, 02:46   #19
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

neither of us like a lot of heel -- we sail a Jeanneau DS40 shoal draft - she is beamy and comfortable - we unfortunately have sailed a lot to windward - but we never rush it and wait for weather windows -
one thing about our boat is that if she gets over say a 15 deg heel she really bulks - she really does well on say a 10 deg heel and we actually reef to keep her there as it appears to be her best speed and sailing -

OH and She is heavy boat - take a look at an older 40'+ Jeanneau - and after a while both of you will kinda get use to a bit of heel if you want a mono hull
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Old 25-12-2013, 06:28   #20
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

my boat doesnt heel a lot in sailing conditions.
bu ti still recommend sailing lessons. will help a lot and she wont be as scared.
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Old 25-12-2013, 07:56   #21
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Get a twin keel monohull.

While I lived aboard my boat on the Chesapeake I met a couple orginally from New Zealand who sailed their twin keel boat across the Pacific. One day I took Alex out for a day sail in my Tayana in about 20 knots of wind and his statement to me was that he was glad Kay was not with us because she did not like a boat that heeled. The Tayanna while it is a very heavy displacement boat has a very tender initial stability, but once heeled it's like sailing on rails.
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Old 25-12-2013, 08:27   #22
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

I'm with Bill definitely. Take a small trip with a seasoned skipper. He will teach you many things and build the confidence in both you and your wife. Boats heel and that's the fact. Once your used to that and understand the aspect of sailboats and what they can do you will feel good and enjoy the experience. My wife had similar issues and initially we went out and just played around I guess you'd call it. Basically touring along in light winds with the main sail out, not really moving along very fast. As time went on pulled the jib out but kept sails almost in a luft. I let her run the helm. She got used to the way the boat moved along and the slight heel angle, then it was slowly sped up and she actually got excited about the speed we could go and the control she had. I gave her instruction on what the boat was doing etc. Now it's go out and crank on steam to a point. 10 - 15 degrees she loves, 20 plus she gets a little anxious. But boats are inefficient above 15-18 degrees so why go there. Enjoy the happiness you'll see in your partner. I can't believe the difference in my wife over time. She fell in love with sailing having never grown up near water and not being able to swim.
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Old 25-12-2013, 08:31   #23
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If shes not comfortable healing how will.she feel rolling about at anchor as monos do?
Im with Cotemar, get a CAT!!
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Old 25-12-2013, 08:40   #24
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Caution on the "experienced skipper/captain" -- after we had been out for a year we were in miami and i was working on the boat and a female friend of ours invited the admiral and another woman out for a sail in brisk winds -- the capt then proceeded to put the rail in the water and scared the other person to death and the admiral was really upset and the capt just laughing - when she got back the admiral told me what happened and said the other woman swore she would never get on a sailboat again and the admiral said she would never sail with her again

so just understand some people have different prespectives
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Old 25-12-2013, 08:57   #25
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pirate Re: Smallest angle of heel

Many good points above and I think the biggest deal would be for the wife to learn to sail (and not taught by you.) Once one begins to understand the forces involved, and ways to cope with them, the fear goes away, replaced by experience and confidence.

I am always amazed that so many people can spend so much money without a real clue. And this may go a long way toward explaining why so many boats rarely leave their slips. And it ain't just the gals who get skeert.

Here's a cheap fix: the Optimist pram
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Old 25-12-2013, 09:06   #26
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Boy, you get a problem! Did you know the reason why seaman don´t like women on board? Women bring they´re desire to convert everything into a living room, into a show room and they have no sense for small room and outdoor stress. So you learn. Leave here at home or, in the best case, change to one that has already a sailboat, because she already likes it.

Be smarter than smart...
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Old 25-12-2013, 19:31   #27
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

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Originally Posted by tg32879 View Post
Boy, you get a problem! Did you know the reason why seaman don´t like women on board? Women bring they´re desire to convert everything into a living room, into a show room and they have no sense for small room and outdoor stress. So you learn. Leave here at home or, in the best case, change to one that has already a sailboat, because she already likes it.

Be smarter than smart...
Well, Mr. alpha numeric, I hope you meant to help the OP by your suggestion that he change wives. But I think he must like her, 'cause he asked for help with the problem, which I thought post #15 addressed in a pretty practical way.

When you make generalizations like "Women this... or that..", I hope you realize that it is somewhat inaccurate. Not all women behave as you describe. There are some d*****d fine women out here living aboard and/or cruising, who are not behaving as you suggest. Some are participants on CF, and maybe the OP wants his wife to join them.
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Old 25-12-2013, 20:30   #28
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Sailboats heel. But if they heel too much, sometimes it's because the crew has limited experience or controls for sailing the boat more flat and efficiently. Old, blown-out sails, lack of a traveler or other sail trimming controls, inability to predict and react quickly to puffs, or inability to easily and quickly reef sails could cause a boat to heel too much and waste effort sailing sidewise instead of forward. Some boats are easily held in a steady groove and others require more work to drive. And, there are some boats that seem "happy" with more or less heel than others. Other boats just have more comfortable motions than their counterparts. And some boats might benefit from some weight re-distribution down below.
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Old 26-12-2013, 07:29   #29
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Question:
- Is she afraid of the boat going over when heeling?
- Or is it just a pain in the rear to live and do things while heeling?

If it's fear, spending time ona boat getting used to it is really your only solution. All mono's heel. Even catamarans heel (to a greatly reduced degree).

While we have no fear a mono, after an hour or two, it's just annoying to have to cling to the boat heeled over at 20-30 degrees. That's OK for an afternoon sail but once you get a passage longer than a few hours, no thanks.

We chose a catamaran.
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Old 26-12-2013, 07:48   #30
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Re: Smallest angle of heel

Of the boats listed, look at the ones with the least amount of freeboard, widest aft section and deepest keel. Probably Beneteau on your list. Our friend's 2001 Beneteau 461 had a nice feel of minimal heel when I went sailing with them. On the same day, our Hunter 450 with high freeboard, shoal draft keel would have been on it's side. But the huge interior space offered by our Hunter was much larger than the Beneteau. Trade-offs.

I'm also going to add, that my wife never got used to the exagerated heel of the Hunter, and was always uncomfortable sailing on it. When we had other guests onboard, her level of anxiety rubbed off on them as well. While I was having a blast sailing on some beautful days in 15 knots of wind, Southern California, sunny skies.... she was a nervous wreck the entire time.

Our present boat has very low freeboard and a deep heavy keel, she's been completely at ease even out in 40 knot winds. Much less heel, and no feeling that the boat will tip over.
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