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Old 27-11-2010, 11:42   #61
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I'd like to bring back to focus a consolidated list, since I am the only one so far to make such a "positive" and tidy contribution

The Saltymonkey bendie boat potential list:

Oceanis 331 - 2001 - contributed by boatman*
Oceanis 321 - 87 - contributed by boatman*
Beneteau 35 - <=1986
Beneteau 38 - <=1988
Beneteau 40.5 - ???

Please feel free to add or delete as you see fit

* whom i admirably respect as a sailor and someone who has survived an underwater submarine attack on a catalac.
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Old 27-11-2010, 22:33   #62
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Opinions are just that..
right or wrong.
Be nice and keep it on topic,
or this thread is gone.
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Old 28-11-2010, 09:01   #63
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James,
Good information is coming out buried in the noise! One thing I’m starting to realize is Beneteau intermittently used the Oceanis label on their family/cruising boats. Folks that have these boats love them; those that don’t either like or don’t like the production boat status, European interiors, mast furlers, tankage, …. I appreciate this dialog and even the digressions!
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Old 28-11-2010, 09:17   #64
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We have a Beneteau 47.7. It is an exceptional value. The only thing about it that would concern me about going offshore is the unprotected rudder.
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Old 28-11-2010, 09:58   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jzk View Post
...The only thing about it that would concern me about going offshore is the unprotected rudder.
Is your offshore belief based on the model issue or spade in general? Because, according to many, the spade rudders on some of these models are built exceptionally well and rugged. The argument also notes that should pressure mount on a rudder - a skeg boat would be worse since it could break off leaving a gaping hole in your boat. A spade less so.

The larger issue of a spade is I think shallow water where a boat cannot stand on its own, or might hit reef.
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Old 28-11-2010, 10:03   #66
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Quote:
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We have a Beneteau 47.7. It is an exceptional value. The only thing about it that would concern me about going offshore is the unprotected rudder.
I share your concern. First thing I did with my boat, which has a similar spade rudder, is to install an emergency rudder system. I have a Scanmar SOS rudder that I hope never to use, but which gives me confidence should I ever lose the primary rudder mid passage.
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Old 28-11-2010, 10:19   #67
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Quote:
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someone who has survived an underwater submarine attack on a catalac.
HEHEHEHEHEHAHAHAHAHEHEHEHE... ahhhh jeeezzzz
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Old 28-11-2010, 10:39   #68
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The scanmar SOS or, what may be a consideration is a stand alone wind-vane, such as a Hydrovane or Autohelm
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Old 28-11-2010, 10:58   #69
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Is your offshore belief based on the model issue or spade in general? Because, according to many, the spade rudders on some of these models are built exceptionally well and rugged. The argument also notes that should pressure mount on a rudder - a skeg boat would be worse since it could break off leaving a gaping hole in your boat. A spade less so.

The larger issue of a spade is I think shallow water where a boat cannot stand on its own, or might hit reef.
I would rather have a skeg for offshore. Are there examples of skegs that have broken off? There are plenty of spade rudders that have broken or bent causing a big problem.

Now, i am not suggesting that Bene should have put a skeg on the 47.7. There are plenty of advantages to the spade in terms of sailing and maneuverability. For its intended use, the 47.7 is a fantasatic boat.
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Old 28-11-2010, 11:17   #70
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The 47.7 is " intended" to be a fine offshore boat. At sea you want a spade rudder rock hopping you want a skeg.

Dave
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Old 28-11-2010, 11:41   #71
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The 47.7 is " intended" to be a fine offshore boat. At sea you want a spade rudder rock hopping you want a skeg.

Dave
What?

Don't get me wrong, the 47.7 is an awesome, tough boat. I would just prefer a skeg if going seriously off shore. I think I also heard Jimmy Cornwall make the same comment as to what separates an offshore boat from something less.
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Old 28-11-2010, 11:42   #72
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Quote:
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The 47.7 is " intended" to be a fine offshore boat. At sea you want a spade rudder rock hopping you want a skeg.

Dave
Dont quite understand this, as first off, my keel is down 8.6 and my rudder is only 5 feet....... to hit something with my rudder first, I'd have to be sailing around backwards..
And second is, whats this "Rock Hopping" If you have a reputation of hitting rocks, I think you should give up watersports........
I've been sailing fixed keel, spade rudder boats for a fair number of years, have run aground more times than I can count, and have never caught my rudder on anything..
Skeg rudders, contrary to popular belief were not designed as a ramming bar for the rudder or the protect it.. they were built to support the rudder. many skeg rudders that I've seen of 40 foot boats is about 1.5 inches in diameter.
The rudder post on our 42 measures just over 4 inches across and is stainless...
The reason for skeg is for added support, something a spade dosent seem to need.
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Old 28-11-2010, 11:43   #73
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There are examples of skegs breaking off. I would have to look up the examples as they are buried in materials here on storm management. There are also manufacturer descriptions on spade strengths which are impressive. - including high ocean certifications. goboatingnow statement is good one.

Skeg, partial skeg, used to concern me as well. Less so now. The gains seem to me worth it. I should say I have had traditional rudder/keel configuration in the past. So, outside of class racing boats, this is new for me too.
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Old 28-11-2010, 11:45   #74
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I think its not just rock hopping, or bouncing on a reef, but also if you want to dry your boat to clean the bottom in some high tide regions
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Old 28-11-2010, 12:20   #75
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I think its not just rock hopping, or bouncing on a reef, but also if you want to dry your boat to clean the bottom in some high tide regions
Got a DVD right her showing Andy and Liza Copeland's Beneteau FIRST 38, tied to a wall and setting on its keel, rudder is 2 feet off the ground..
Hi and dry, while doing the bottom..
I myself have tied our to a set of piers when the tide when out to touch up the bottom paint around the waterline.. The bottom of our boat where the keel is attached is over 200 mm thick... thats just over 8 inches at the joint...
when we haul her out, you stand he on her keel and put the stands under to keep from falling over...
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