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Old 09-10-2014, 18:01   #91
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

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Originally Posted by jtsailjt View Post
I responded that since she was apparently the family expert on tipping that she could have responsibility for it and leave precisely whatever tip she felt was appropriate but she apparently didn't think that sounded like a very good arrangement because she just glared at me and didn't make any move to dig into her purse when the bill arrived....
Thats the sort of thing that irritates me too... Being forced to pay a gratuity. Im my 'ol egalitarian country if anyone tells me we must do something thats when we get are backs up and use short words - like sex and travel.

But weirdest is the way you guys treat it as some sort of national pride to be forced to tip.

So many threads on CF about tipping and as soon as someone fromEurope, or anywhere outside USA chimes in they get jumped upon by Tippers saying we are slagging your country. Where the hell does that come from?
when something is really fantastic, I mean really above expectations I enjoy showing my appreciation with a nice comment, a nice referal and a nice tip. But if I was being forced to tip anyway how can I show that appreciation? By tipping more? How much more? Not 20% because thats not enough. 30% could just be a generous person. So, what? 50% more? 200% of the bill? Just give the miserable down trodden employee $1,000???? $10,000?

Tipping US style also runs into the general generous nature of Americans... Yep, they are more generous in general than others. If someone goes out to dinner with me they expect to pay the bill where I expect to share the bill. Why the hell should they pay for my lobster? So most times the tables bill is paid by one person. I guess in the euphoria of being the host things happen....?

Finally, and again this isnt a criticism of people from the USA but an observation of that culture: bar and restaurant staff that rely on tips are a different type of people than in other countries. OK so that sounds like a biggie, so go back and read the line again They are different!!! Many people in the USA treat a bar job as a vocation; a job for life etc. and theres many intelligent people working restaurants and bars into their 40s 50s and 60s. But in many other cultures bar and wait staff are for young people paying their way through University or as a second job, or aspirational job.
For gods sake its a menial task! People with the brains to do better should be forced by lack of wages to do better! If you don't like earning $5 per hour get the hell off your bum and go educate yourself into a job.

I should now write a paragraph doing all the exclusions from my argument so you can't plead mea dickhead because I have forgotten disabled left hand shoe sellers.... YES there are full career wait staff, maitre des etc, management etc people learning so they can buy a business, people whose real enjoyment of life is at a different expectation, etc etc etc.

The USA is too far down the road of tipping for there to be a fundamental change. Americans will always give more than the posted price and I will always ask for a discount.

Just realise the world is different from your niche.

BTW, if I negotiate a discount from the bill do I have to pay the % tip on the menu price or the discounted price?

Bugger it, I will just eat on the boat!
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Old 09-10-2014, 18:09   #92
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

Employees at my marina are government employees. Tipping them never crosses my mind.
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Old 09-10-2014, 18:18   #93
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

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I generally tell them that I have it as I've had far too many "helpful" people start yanking on a line as soon as it's passed to them and it messes up an otherwise uneventful landing.

Now if conditions are crazy and I ask for help, that would be a different matter.
We find most cruisers helpful. When arriving or departing we prefer to handle our own lines. We only need a mid ship aft spring in most conditions.

I have been practicing my lasso skills so I can dock singlehanded without getting off the boat.

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Old 10-10-2014, 06:48   #94
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
..........................

But weirdest is the way you guys treat it as some sort of national pride to be forced to tip.

.......................................
MarkJ, 'enjoyed your post,- 'enjoy your humor, but I'm without understanding how anyone is "forced" to tip.

Maybe encouraged, goaded, expected, urged, badgered, prompted....., but never forced unless the gratuity is posted within the price and then it is simply the "posted price".

My advice, if you don't want to tip, then don't tip. What the worst outcome? ... someone might think you're from Australia? No problem!
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Old 10-10-2014, 07:13   #95
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

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I've never been to a marina or restaurant in the US where prices were not clear and posted on a price list or menu. .
Really, how many restaurants have you gone to where the tip is included in the menu price? Except for a note about large groups, I've never seen it.

You can use the weak excuse that a tip isn't mandatory but everyone knows that's a lie.
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Old 10-10-2014, 07:16   #96
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

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MarkJ, 'enjoyed your post,- 'enjoy your humor, but I'm without understanding how anyone is "forced" to tip.

Maybe encouraged, goaded, expected, urged, badgered, prompted....., but never forced unless the gratuity is posted within the price and then it is simply the "posted price".

My advice, if you don't want to tip, then don't tip. What the worst outcome? ... someone might think you're from Australia? No problem!
Define "force"

If you get mugged. You are free to try and wressel the gun away from him but you aren't forced to hand over your wallet. Likewise you aren't "forced" to tip but you will be riddiculed, call cheap, get poor service, etc...

The worst outcome is a lot worse than thinking your austrailian.
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Old 10-10-2014, 07:57   #97
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

Had lunch at a local Daytona buffet yesterday where you pay the fixed price at the desk on arrival, greeted yesterday by a new sign on the pay desk in large red letters saying 'Drinks are NOT included' and 'gratuities are not included' Now here all the waitress does is pour some water or coffee and clear away dirty plates after each visit to the buffet, the customers do the work by serving themselves, no orders are taken nor brought to the table. We usually leave a $3or$4 tip on the table for a meal costing $17 ( senior special) for the two of us. Yesterday we overheard our waitress grumbling loudly to customers on another table that the people on the adjacent table to them had only left her $1. This isn't a place where orders are taken, and meals served. in my mind not the same effort required as in a normal eatery so surely not justifying much more than a token thank you, but apparently a $1 thank you from one table was definitely not considered enough and she made sure others were warned in advance.

It is an ingrained culture here in the USA. One time years ago on business in New York with my wife with me, I had terrible service in the hotel restaurant, had to continually ask for fresh coffee that eventually arrived in a cracked cup with lipstick marks on it our breakfast order took ages to arrive and was incomplete, missing the toast and juice oredered with it . Accordingly I left no gratuity when I paid and left to go visit my business customers, leaving my wife to finish her coffee still at the table. She (American) left a tip despite my wish not to and it was the subject of considerable discussion when I discovered that she had felt obliged to over rule me. NOW m business customers placed big orders with my company but did not give me a tip for being the intermediary!! Shame on them, but then my company prices of course included full service by me and 24/7/365 too I might add.

Weird old world this tipping business isn't it?
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Old 23-11-2014, 17:05   #98
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

In Hawaii recently and took a boat/snorkel trip.
Paid with a credit card before the trip and was
told that the receipt would be available to sign
on the boat. Near the end of the trip, my receipt
was presented to me on a clipboard. Like a
restaurant receipt it had a place for tip then total.
It was a tour for $150 and I gotta tip 'em?

Next, at the airport, dragging our bags from the
car rental return, some guy jumps out from behind a sign
that says "United..." something or other and grabs
our bags. He puts them on a cart and takes them,
with us in tow to the agricultural inspection, then
takes them back to where the sign is and we pay
for 2 checked bags, with a credit card and get a
receipt, whereupon the guy puts our bags on a cart
and says, "We're independent and make our money
on tips." Wha?? He, in effect, interfered with our
progress to the United counter and now says he
wants to get a tip.

It's these types of games that are played all over
the country that makes it so frustrating. Just say
"no" to tipping.
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Old 23-11-2014, 18:29   #99
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

I tip because of the society I live in, but...

If you have a job where you need tips to get by, that should be a big hint that you need to get a better job. Waiters and dock hands should be kids (relative term) on the way to a real job, and there is no reason I should concern myself with how they raise their family; if you don't have a solid income you DON'T HAVE KIDS.

Yes, I had low end jobs. An I NEVER felt I was entitled to a tip. I accepted my wages, and then I did what was needed to move up.

So I'm OK with small tips. Very small.
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Old 23-11-2014, 19:50   #100
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

+1!


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Old 23-11-2014, 21:02   #101
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

Between 1980 and 1990, I never once gave a tip. I did it to stop the system of tips.

Didn't work. People still took jobs for tips, and the system of tips is still as strong as it ever was.

So now I tip big to make up for being an idiot.
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Old 23-11-2014, 23:27   #102
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

Quote:
So now I tip big to make up for being an idiot.
There, fixed that typo for you.

(Couldn't resist... sorry)

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Old 23-11-2014, 23:42   #103
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

I know it is a bit off-topic, but today I bought something at walgreens,
and the damm credit card machine put advertising on it, and I had to say no I didn't want to schedule a flu shot, and then it asked me if I wanted to donate to something and add $1-$5 to my total. What a load of crap, can't just buy something without the machines asking for tips.
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Old 24-11-2014, 14:03   #104
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

So did this thread change anyone's mind about tipping? Did anyone decide to stop tipping because of what they read on this thread? Did anyone decide to start tipping?

Or did people just huff and puff and piss each other off?

My guess is, it was a worthless thread.
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Old 24-11-2014, 14:53   #105
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Re: Tipping Line Handlers

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So did this thread change anyone's mind about tipping? Did anyone decide to stop tipping because of what they read on this thread? Did anyone decide to start tipping?

Or did people just huff and puff and piss each other off?

My guess is, it was a worthless thread.
If it was like about 95% of Internet forum threads, everybody said what they thought, some were entertained, some were exposed to perspectives they hadn't been aware of and maybe learned a little from that, some might have become PO'd that others didn't share their view (but they're probably PO'd a lot anyway), some blew off steam, some enjoyed huffing and puffing, some probably realized they were better/worse tippers than they realized, it's all good!
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