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Old 04-05-2010, 12:05   #16
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Old 04-05-2010, 12:35   #17
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Welcome to our nightmare. 'Polluting for pleasure' or powerboating as its sometimes called doesn't attract introspection. Stinkpotters are about being seen and heard. Their conspicuous consumption will only end when gas prices go up.
OK, cut that c.. Power boaters are no better / worse than sailors. As far as polluting goes, sailors (meaning - sailing boaters) match power boaters. Noise issues? OK, but only as long as we are sailing. Then we come into anchorages everybody launches their inflatable with a noisy 2hp outboard and off they go to the bar - pedal to the metal ;-(

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Old 04-05-2010, 12:43   #18
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Sailors and Power boater have one thing in common that neither wants to admit. Humanity. There are all kinds on both sides, but it would certainly seem that sailing is more open to the romance of the water. Sailors by nature and art, go with the flow. Power Boaters on the other hand, make their own wave. Quite literally,
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Old 04-05-2010, 12:44   #19
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OK, cut that c.. Power boaters are no better / worse than sailors. As far as polluting goes, sailors (meaning - sailing boaters) match power boaters. Noise issues? OK, but only as long as we are sailing. Then we come into anchorages everybody launches their inflatable with a noisy 2hp outboard and off they go to the bar - pedal to the metal ;-(

b.
Agreed and snooty sail boaters attitudes can sometimes be way worse! just rare.
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Old 04-05-2010, 12:55   #20
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Truth is many sailboats are actually inefficient powerboats with inconvenient vertical draft.

It is much like driving around in a convertable with the top up and the air conditioner on... so often while cruising boats would be motoring when the wind was in their favor... I recall short tacking up a bend in the ICW (had sailed all day, and only had to make a mile or so to sail the rest of the day easily). A guy in a big cat would not come out of the center of the channel to allow me to get past without falling off into a jibe... he was running downwind, with roller furling with both diesels blowing black smoke....

This was not the exception, but the norm.

What is up with that?
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Old 04-05-2010, 12:59   #21
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As far as polluting goes, sailors (meaning - sailing boaters) match power boaters.
I'm not sure I'd agree. I see far more sailboats with solar panels and/or wind generators than powerboats. Even when I'm powering at cruising speed, which on my boat is eight knots, I'll only be burning .7 GPH. And when I'm sailing, I'm in zero emissions mode.

When I'm plugged into shore power, the only thing running on 110 volts is usually the water heater. The batteries are still being charged by the solar panels.

When I'm on the hook during the summer months I never need to run the engine to charge the batteries. In the winter I will sometimes run the diesel furnace for heat, but even then the wind generator keeps the batteries topped off.

While I certainly don't represent the typical sailboat, a high percentage of cruising sailboats will either match me or exceed me in terms of energy efficiency.
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Old 04-05-2010, 13:28   #22
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The idea of spending so much money on a vessel that can't cross an ocean is beyond me (re: half million dollar motor yachts).

I've got a couple of friends who have power boats, but for those part they're attrocious mariners. I went out with some guys fishing one time on a little sport fisher maybe 30' long, off the coast maybe ~50 miles looking for tuna. They were drunk, had a crappy little plastic "chart", had no clue about channel 16, no safety brief, etc.

The standard operating procedure on most power boats would be considered horrid on any sailing vessel. Apologies if it comes across snooty, but there you go.

There are some guys who are excellent seamen who just so happen to be on a power boat because of age or some other preference that keeps them from bounding around on deck.

My friend who sells boats said there are marked differences in the buyer of a sailing vessel versus a power vessel. A would-be sailor brings a measuring tape, some tools, a flashlight, and notebook and pen. He said guys buying new power boats look at the pillows and lights, and will buy one if he says he'll knock 10% off the price.

Obviously we're taking generalizaitons here. There are moron sailors and extremely competent power boat skippers and crew.
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Old 04-05-2010, 13:42   #23
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I don't understand the thread title, probably just me. Cheap! Hell spend $1700 last month on BS stuff.

I can not recall EVER seeing a powerboat with a solar panel or wind generator.

Hate to type-cast, but near as I call tell powerboaters LOVE sailors! How else would they have the right boats out on the water for them to power up enough to JUST be able to cross in front of after closing on them for 1/2-mile of so.
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Old 04-05-2010, 13:58   #24
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So then are non-sailing cruisers/liveaboards not to be found here? Are they generally unwelcome at anchorages?
Honestly, I would prefer a sailboat, mostly for the "green" factor. But J would prefer a slow, as-fuel-efficient-as-possible trawler (his recent designs that he's playing with are based off a Spray, just without a mast), for safety reasons. He grew up sailing, and wants me to be a better sailor for the skills, but doesn't want to have people on deck in bad conditions.
Since he is likely to win this one, are we going to find ourselves ostracized from everyone else in the anchorage? I promise we won't run the generator all night, or even have AC, jetski, washer/dryer, etc. on board, and we certainly won't be going anywhere much above 6 or 7 knots! Basically, I think what we're looking at is sailboat ... but with a "haircut".
Does that leave us the odd-man-out anywhere we go?
Mariness, you need to put your foot down on this one. How anyone can justify buying or building a cruising boat that is propelled solely by petroleum in this day and age is unfathomable to me.
Why in God's name would J want a sailboat that doesn't sail? It's the worst of both worlds.

I do rigging in St. Pete if you need someone to talk some sense to him. I'll give it my best shot.
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Old 04-05-2010, 14:05   #25
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My friend who sells boats said there are marked differences in the buyer of a sailing vessel versus a power vessel. A would-be sailor brings a measuring tape, some tools, a flashlight, and notebook and pen. He said guys buying new power boats look at the pillows and lights, and will buy one if he says he'll knock 10% off the price.
Well that settles it then! Whatever you put us in, I guess we count as sailors - we both have that stuff with us all the time anyway - you never know what you'll need, or when!
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Old 04-05-2010, 14:20   #26
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So then are non-sailing cruisers/liveaboards not to be found here? Are they generally unwelcome at anchorages?
Honestly, I would prefer a sailboat, mostly for the "green" factor. But J would prefer a slow, as-fuel-efficient-as-possible trawler (his recent designs that he's playing with are based off a Spray, just without a mast), for safety reasons. He grew up sailing, and wants me to be a better sailor for the skills, but doesn't want to have people on deck in bad conditions.
Since he is likely to win this one, are we going to find ourselves ostracized from everyone else in the anchorage? I promise we won't run the generator all night, or even have AC, jetski, washer/dryer, etc. on board, and we certainly won't be going anywhere much above 6 or 7 knots! Basically, I think what we're looking at is sailboat ... but with a "haircut".
Does that leave us the odd-man-out anywhere we go?
I think the only thing unwelcome at anchorages is disturbances. Whether a sailboat or a powerboat, if they have a gas generator screaming all night long they will be unwelcome. But those people just lack common courtesy. If you're going to be inside in the A/C all night, why do you have to come to a quiet/peaceful anchorage in the first place?

One place a motor trawler is much more welcome than a sailboat is at a marina! It's because the motor trawler will inevitably drop $1000 or more for fuel at each stop whereas the sailboat will probably spend less than $100, if any.

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Old 04-05-2010, 14:24   #27
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So then are non-sailing cruisers/liveaboards not to be found here? Are they generally unwelcome at anchorages?
Honestly, I would prefer a sailboat, mostly for the "green" factor. But J would prefer a slow, as-fuel-efficient-as-possible trawler (his recent designs that he's playing with are based off a Spray, just without a mast), for safety reasons. He grew up sailing, and wants me to be a better sailor for the skills, but doesn't want to have people on deck in bad conditions.
Since he is likely to win this one, are we going to find ourselves ostracized from everyone else in the anchorage? I promise we won't run the generator all night, or even have AC, jetski, washer/dryer, etc. on board, and we certainly won't be going anywhere much above 6 or 7 knots! Basically, I think what we're looking at is sailboat ... but with a "haircut".
Does that leave us the odd-man-out anywhere we go?
Pfft. Go get a trawler man, or a Sea Ray if that is your style. Any boat is better than no boat. When we get to an anchorage, we have no problem speaking with anyone. I must confess that I have a hard time communicating in the same language as your typical Scarab owner - but hey! They buy their gas, not me. As long as they run their boat in a professional manner, I couldn't care less.

That being said, a good friend of mine took me for a ride on his Scarab. RRMMM!!! I don't know how fast we were going, but I couldn;t hear him talking to me or the radio blaring beside me. RRMMMM! We made our way back. He looked at me and my wife and asked if we had fun. I told him I needed to take him sailing. SO it was a beautiful night (night sail), stars out, rail just out of the water, glistening through the waves, Marley on the radio. You couldn't ask for a better sail. And so I asked him if he had his wife had a good time. They were nodding off to sleep.

Different strokes I guess. Neither ever invited the other back out. Hehe! True story.

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Old 04-05-2010, 14:24   #28
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One place a motor trawler is much more welcome than a sailboat is at a marina! It's because the motor trawler will inevitably drop $1000 or more for fuel at each stop whereas the sailboat will probably spend less than $100, if any.

-Dave

What he said.
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Old 04-05-2010, 14:26   #29
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What he said.
Hey Knot! How are you!???

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Old 04-05-2010, 14:30   #30
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the sailboat will probably spend less than $100, if any.
I haven't ever purchased fuel at a marina. Mostly because it's usually 10 cents per gallon more than getting it at the corner mom and pop. I'm up to 4 jerry cans on my bike. Good exercise.
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