Missing yacht near Barbados..

[boatman61]

Jim.. same with the guy who had everyone here including MarkJ in SXM looking for his boat.. full main up and flogging jib if memory serves.. and the current aint that strong.. 15 to 20 mile/24hrs.. easily overcome on the surface by steady 15 to 25kt NE'lies.

[GTom]

Originally Posted by DumnMad

This is why I like the Brits and voting Brexit. They don't accept bureaucratic exploitation as being 'reasonable.' This resistance has been going on ever since the Magna Carta.
Thankfully some of this attitude has been transferred to NZ. No licence needed to go offshore - just experience.(You can't take a yacht offshore unless someone on board has done it before.)

No worries, there quite a few EU countries where you don't need a licence to sail your own boat.

Thank you Boatman for the update on currents

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Polux

You are badly informed. The renew of the licence costs are not significant since they are valid for many years. 70 euros to be precise, if made by an agency much less (if anything?) if they are made directly at a Capitania (port authority)
Renovação de Cartas

An advanced licence, Patrão de costa, the one before the last one costs about 800 euros and it has mandatory 75 hours of formation, theory and sea practice.

I don't know what you call expensive but it seems a fair price to me due to the number of hours. Of course to take this one you have to have already the 2 previous ones that can be taken together.

Or you can do what I have done, show up at the tests and examination and pass them without ever been at a single class or without having paid nothing, just the price of the examination.

here we have a $25 USD cost for license that is permanent no need to renew ( required for all vessels with more than 10 HP engine. ) the test can even be taken online. ( its for my state and is accepted everywhere .) that I have been to )

[Jim Cate]

Thankfully some of this attitude has been transferred to NZ. No licence needed to go offshore - just experience.(You can't take a yacht offshore unless someone on board has done it before.)

Gee, Nick, if they had instituted that soon enough, then no one could have ever gone offshore! Now, there's real safety at sea!

Jim

[Mr B]

When my boat got chucked up onto the beach 6 years ago,
The volunteer rescue service people that came out to pick up me and my passenger,

They Just happened to be Ancients, Old People, Past it, Etc, Etc,

Simply Because they couldnt get young people interested to learn or to be a part of the crew on board,
The youngest Bloke on board was 64, Most were in their 70's, and the Captain was 84,

They were all very fit and very capable, Age is just a number,
unless your a Keyboard warrior sitting in front of a PC waiting to die, And critisising any one that is out there doing things your incapable of doing your self, Very Sad,

Me, Im 69, I run rings around most people 30 years younger than me,
My jack line is full length under the boom, Its short, I have a chest harness on at all times if I leave the cockpit,,
No matter what happens to me any where on my boat, Injured or dead, I cant go over the side,
I singlehand my boat, I fall over the side, Im Dead,
Even when I had a passenger on board, If I fell over the side, I was Dead, No ifs or buts about it,
She point blank refused to know any thing about operating, running, or saving the boat if I was incapacitated, or dead,
She even refused to do a watch so I could get some sleep.

So having two people on board, Is not what it seems in a lot of cases,
The second person is just that, A second person, Some one to talk to,
The captain is still singlehanding the boat at all times,

Luckily this lady could operate the Sat phone and threw her husband a lifebuoy, But more than that, Thats life unfortunately, The way it is,

I also ride a very large, very fast Motor cycle, 24/7 in all weathers, If I run off the road in the high country, There is no cell phone coverage, I am on my own totally,

Its up to me to save myself, Its the Same on my boat, I dont rely on others to save me,

If the fall from the road dont kill me, It can be hundreds of feet straight down,
I can be buried in the growth and cant be seen from the road, and very little traffic going past, So the chances of being seen is near Nil,

But it is our choice to do what we want with our lives, Irrespective of age,
Lifes a gamble, The risks can be great, depending on what you do,
Its bringing the risks down to manageable levels,
Just walking is a very dangerous past time, It has a very high injury ratio, In all age's.

There are participators in life,
And there are observers, Who usually pay to watch the participators, And mumble about how dangerous it is, that they are watching some one else do,,

My most dangerous past time is Skiing the black runs in winter, But there, I can be seen and rescued if I am badly injured,
Next year, I can ski for free as I will be over 70. One advantage of being OLD, hahahaha
Its a part of the Fees paid to cover rescues of injured skiers, So that part is not free, Its fully paid for, Rescues,
So get out there and enjoy life while you still can,

Cheers, Brian,

[hpeer]

Yeah, I definitely glad rules are more sensible in USA.

IMHO testing for knowledge generally means next to nothing. I’ve been a professional engineer and a consulting engineer. Some of the dumbassedest people I ever met were Professional Envineers. No lack of testing to make them, just no testing the actual “knowledge” or even plain common sense. I see no reason why it would be different for boating certifications.

Come to think of it I’ve known some pretty stupid doctors and lawyers as well.

[picklesandjesse]

[QUOTE=Mr B

Me, Im 69, I run rings around most people 30 years younger than me,
My jack line is full length under the boom, Its short, I have a chest harness on at all times if I leave the cockpit,,
No matter what happens to me any where on my boat, Injured or dead, I cant go over the side,
I singlehand my boat, I fall over the side, Im Dead,
Even when I had a passenger on board, If I fell over the side, I was Dead, No ifs or buts about it,
She point blank refused to know any thing about operating, running, or saving the boat if I was incapacitated, or dead,
She even refused to do a watch so I could get some sleep.

So having two people on board, Is not what it seems in a lot of cases,
The second person is just that, A second person, Some one to talk to,
The captain is still singlehanding the boat at all times,



Cheers, Brian,[/QUOTE]

Have to agree here. 4 years ago when I was 69 I bought Unicorn ( Bruce Kings boat ) and sailed her 8 weeks later back to Australia. Picked up my niece who was 48 in Hawaii and continued on. This had been her life's dream but she went down within an hour or so on the portside pilot berth and that was it !! Slept 22 hours a day. I had to keep her alive so nursed her all the way to Port Villa in Vanuatu where I dropped her off 28 days later, then singlehanded to Coffs Harbour.

Singlehanding in many ways is so much easier than having another person on board to worry about. I found it very relaxing after the previous passage.

[Navicula]

You got it Mr B

[Fence Man]

[QUOTE=hpeer;2529593]dumbassedest

I always knew it was a real word!

[Mr B]

Originally Posted by picklesandjesse

Have to agree here. 4 years ago when I was 69 I bought Unicorn ( Bruce Kings boat ) and sailed her 8 weeks later back to Australia. Picked up my niece who was 48 in Hawaii and continued on. This had been her life's dream but she went down within an hour or so on the portside pilot berth and that was it !! Slept 22 hours a day. I had to keep her alive so nursed her all the way to Port Villa in Vanuatu where I dropped her off 28 days later, then singlehanded to Coffs Harbour.

Singlehanding in many ways is so much easier than having another person on board to worry about. I found it very relaxing after the previous passage.

5 weeks in Fiji, Not a problem with her,
Fiji to Bundaberg, Single handed, I didnt have a care in the world, Loved it,
Four days moored just near Havanna on Efate, Caught the bus into Port Villa,

She rejoined me at Bundaberg, Flew up from Melbourne,
Bundaberg to Broughton Island, Seasick for 7 days straight, She didnt move from the salon couch,
I ran aground in the Maroochy river, I ordered her off my boat, Put her in a taxi with the fare to the airport,
She came back and I reluctantly took her on board again,
Looking back on it, It was all put on, the seasick bit,

I prefer to be on my own, single handing as there are no problems,
Considering another persons safety and welfare is a big drain on your health and well being,

[Polux]

Originally Posted by boatman61

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"][SIZE="3"]T...
Portuguese friends have complained to me about it costing more than 1000euro for the basic 3 mile limit tuition..
...

Here are the prices, depending on the scholl ACP is not the cheaper. The one you mention costs 675 euros
https://www.acp.pt/Servicos/Carta-de...cacoes-recreio

[Polux]

Originally Posted by StuM

Travel insurance is personal cover (health and accident). The previous discussion is about boat insurance - which is a totally different thing.

ACCIDENT insurance is what I we were talking about and rescue costs, not hull insurance.

It would make sense other way since we are talking about an ACCIDENT with a 74 years old sailor and the discussion is if a 74 to 78 old sailor is more prone (or not) to have an accident than a younger sailors being it by lack of fitness or by health problems, accident that will result on the need of a rescue.

Those insurances are normally limited to 65 years because after that the risks of ACCiDENT and the need of a RESCUE are much bigger.

And it is not only the English or American ones, the French site and forum STW that is pointed to long range cruising has an insurance for his members regarding interruption of a voyage for accident with the boat (including search costs, health problems and more.

As usual the age limit for the insurance is 65 years.
Grand Large First - Garantie interruption de voyage | STW

But on this forum it seems that all are incredible old men that can circle around 30 year old sailors with great ease.

It seems that I am the only one that feels that over 60 I have not the same fitness and physical ability I had when I was younger, not even closer even if I am not bad for my age.

Maybe that's because I had made competitive sport all my life till I lost competitiveness. I have quite a number of medals and trophies on my personal collection from sports as varied as handball, volleyball, basketball, motorcycle racing and even one from sailing even if I had done only two races.

I was a top volleyball player, an international one and raced motorcycles in international races till I had 50 years of age.

Maybe that's why I feel that now with over 60 I don't had the same physical fitness I used to have and certainly I would be ridicule trying to ring circles around younger guys, if they know what they are doing as well as me.

[BlackHeron]

Originally Posted by hpeer

Yeah, I definitely glad rules are more sensible in USA.

IMHO testing for knowledge generally means next to nothing. I’ve been a professional engineer and a consulting engineer. Some of the dumbassedest people I ever met were Professional Envineers. No lack of testing to make them, just no testing the actual “knowledge” or even plain common sense. I see no reason why it would be different for boating certifications.

Come to think of it I’ve known some pretty stupid doctors and lawyers as well.

We have a saying in the building trades: "You can tell an engineer from a mile away, but face to face you can't tell them jack spit."

[cyan]

Originally Posted by DumnMad

This is why I like the Brits and voting Brexit. They don't accept bureaucratic exploitation as being 'reasonable.' This resistance has been going on ever since the Magna Carta.
Thankfully some of this attitude has been transferred to NZ. No licence needed to go offshore - just experience.(You can't take a yacht offshore unless someone on board has done it before.)

DumnMad, there are many of us in other countries that applaud the Kiwis and their independent attitude. The money demanded by big governments for licenses to LIVE should be universally rejected. Even without the fees, the regulation imposed upon the sailor who merely wishes to sail away and see the world is absurd. What? I have to PAY to go offshore??
I suspect that many cruisers have departed shores without paying the full extortion to a strangling government. I imagine there were smirks on first watch.

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by Polux

ACCIDENT insurance is what I we were talking about and rescue costs, not hull insurance.

It would make sense other way since we are talking about an ACCIDENT with a 74 years old sailor and the discussion is if a 74 to 78 old sailor is more prone (or not) to have an accident than a younger sailors being it by lack of fitness or by health problems, accident that will result on the need of a rescue.

Those insurances are normally limited to 65 years because after that the risks of ACCiDENT and the need of a RESCUE are much bigger.

And it is not only the English or American ones, the French site and forum STW that is pointed to long range cruising has an insurance for his members regarding interruption of a voyage for accident with the boat (including search costs, health problems and more.

As usual the age limit for the insurance is 65 years.
Grand Large First - Garantie interruption de voyage | STW

But on this forum it seems that all are incredible old men that can circle around 30 year old sailors with great ease.

It seems that I am the only one that feels that over 60 I have not the same fitness and physical ability I had when I was younger, not even closer even if I am not bad for my age.

Maybe that's because I had made competitive sport all my life till I lost competitiveness. I have quite a number of medals and trophies on my personal collection from sports as varied as handball, volleyball, basketball, motorcycle racing and even one from sailing even if I had done only two races.

I was a top volleyball player, an international one and raced motorcycles in international races till I had 50 years of age.

Maybe that's why I feel that now with over 60 I don't had the same physical fitness I used to have and certainly I would be ridicule trying to ring circles around younger guys, if they know what they are doing as well as me.

Nobody is saying that all of the other older sailors on here are supermen, but you don’t need to be able win volleyball matches or motorcycle races in order to operate a sailboat safely. Of course there were things you could do when you were 30 that you can’t do now, such as leap high and spike a volleyball hard, but happily that ability is unlikely to be needed at sea. You say you are older now and like all of us, don’t have the same physical ability that you used to but if you focus on the physical skills needed to operate and sail a cruising sailboat, which ones do you think you can no longer accomplish in a safe way? Then, think of all the life lessons as well as sailing skills you’ve learned since you were 30, and factor in the labor saving devices we all now enjoy, and ask yourself whether the 30 year old version of you was really more able to cross oceans safely than the current you is?