Gunboat 66 – the ultimate fast cruiser?

[Polux]

Originally Posted by andreavanduyn

Trimarans in speed and safety beat any cat ; proven fact with NEEL 45'.

Why do you say that? Neel 45 is not even a really fast trimaran.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by tp12

With respect Mogga there's so many variations of designs in the Cat world that your comment is rendered useless apart from this one bit:

He is talking about fast cats. There are not so many variations in what regards fast cats beside side. They all are light and carry a lot of sail otherwise they would not be fast.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by cruisersfarm

....
I wanted a boat that would serve as the ultimate survival platform. IMO, this is it - and remains the ultimate survival platform without input from the crew. That's another important factor for me. Button up and go below and wait. Not a matter of steering properly, setting sails properly, being the perfect seaman. Any idiot or incapacitated person can survive because the boat survives all on its own.

There you go, ultimate survival platform by how much time with tiny half flooded hulls and a platform washed up by waves?

It is not expected, even if possible, that a cat should be capsized in almost flat conditions and most accidents will happen in stormy conditions.

We had recently direct information regarding that from a sailor from a capsized cat that stated that one day after the accident they were on the limit of their forces regarding staying on the upturned cat.

A life raft is much safer than an upturned cruising cat. Experience shows that people had only survived some days on a upturned cat (not talking about giant racing ones) and has be able to survive in a life-raft for many days.


Why it is me that always have to correct misinformation like that and not any of the knowledgeable cat owners? Believing in stuff like that is dangerous and can lead to the conclusion that a cat does not need a liferaft.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Funny enough Mogga.. when one of my boats (a mono) was pressed hard running before a Westerly into La Coruna with full jib, no main.. I was going so fast that the freeboard at the bow went from 1.5 metres down to 6inches.. could not reduce, broken furler.. or turn due to the sea's.. so just ran on before and crossed everything crossable the wind did not increase.. else she'd have pitch poled.. It didn't.. She didn't.. I did...

Maybe that would teach you to sail a lighter boat, one that instead of nose diving pass over hull speed with the nose high. But if the situation was so desperate and you were afraid of pitch pooling why did you not let the sail go and with diminished speed went forward to take it down, or at least what would rest of it?

Or that was jammed two? I guess the situation was not as desperate and you did not want to lose the sail, but you had options.

[Scout 30]

Just curious, can anyone ballpark the price of the Gunboat?

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Mogga

I have sailed most things that float and some that don't over 60 years.
Anyone that has sailed a fast cat in a breeze will be impressed.
When they reach the limit they tend to nose dive and capsize in a seaway ....

You mean like on this Dragonfly 28? Not a cat, but that is not different with a trimaran. Note the little monohull that comes not far with the bow high on the air. Off course we are talking about when a boat reach the limit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMoHhilUSoU

At the limit, even if a lot more rare and difficult (due to the bigger bouncy of the bow) that can happen also with a monohull but normally does not end in a capsize:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXM_93TIMZE

[Mogga]

Nice photo Polux cats are very stable upside down!
I have known a flare to be fired into a spinnaker, that seems to depower them without
much effort.

[Mogga]

Polux I have just seen your latest video of the mono hull putting a spinnaker up in a
wind that was obviously too stong it was only going to end in a broach.
Don't people learn in dinghies nowadays I never won a dinghy race by swimming .
If he thought he could hold that in that wind his winches were too big.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Polux

Maybe that would teach you to sail a lighter boat, one that instead of nose diving pass over hull speed with the nose high. But if the situation was so desperate and you were afraid of pitch pooling why did you not let the sail go and with diminished speed went forward to take it down, or at least what would rest of it?

Or that was jammed two? I guess the situation was not as desperate and you did not want to lose the sail, but you had options.

Maybe because my single line reefer was also my forestay.. and I would not call a Corribee 21 a heavy boat.. at least not compared to a Hurley 22..
Should add I was depowering the sail by letting her fly at appropriate moments to let the waves pass.. it worked.

[Training Wheels]

Originally Posted by Polux

Maybe that would teach you to sail a lighter boat, one that instead of nose diving pass over hull speed with the nose high. But if the situation was so desperate and you were afraid of pitch pooling why did you not let the sail go and with diminished speed went forward to take it down, or at least what would rest of it?

Or that was jammed two? I guess the situation was not as desperate and you did not want to lose the sail, but you had options.

Like this?



Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

Like this?
Attachment 121679

Yes, like on the video I posted above. Anyway those figures on monohulls don't normally end up in a capsize as they do most of the time in multihulls.

Originally Posted by Mogga

Polux I have just seen your latest video of the mono hull putting a spinnaker up in a
wind that was obviously too stong it was only going to end in a broach.
Don't people learn in dinghies nowadays I never won a dinghy race by swimming .
If he thought he could hold that in that wind his winches were too big.

Actually those guys on that boat can do that even if they are pushing the envelop. They just made the mistake of not putting all the weight aft on the boat (sails and their own weight).

Those guys are top solo race sailors (and were champions racing dingies before that) training for a transat and they had assumed that they had screwed up. The boat that is making the movie is the coach boat.

Here a guy going on that boat with 35k with a spi, well not a regular guy, also a top solo racer. Note that the balance is so delicate that when he goes forward to pick something the bow started immediately to dig in. With two is a lot easier.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_ZXmr8pmrs

[arsenelupiga]

CF CAT-MONO score for 30-3-16

1 - 0 for cats due to clear evidence presented cats are safer boats


Keep going, never give up !

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by Mogga

I have sailed most things that float and some that don't over 60 years.
Anyone that has sailed a fast cat in a breeze will be impressed.
When they reach the limit they tend to nose dive and capsize in a seaway the unstable
point appears at a lower speed. A conventional sailboat with a keel will automatically
depower by heeling and eventually knocking flat and recovering (hopefully).
Where as a Cat will either capsize or lose its rig when it is finally overloaded.
This is an over generalisation, but if you want to sail a fast cat offshore, and many have
very successfully ,but you must be diligent or lucky preferably both.
In my opinion to sail one successfully is probably beyond the average skill set
when the going gets to survival conditions.
I know what I would sooner be caught out in a conventional sailboat than a cat.

I'd rather be in a cat: Multihull Dynamics, Inc. - News Article

[44'cruisingcat]

Getting back to the topic - the ultimate fast cruiser, if not the Gunboat 66, then what?


For mine a 66 foot cat is too big for a couple. OK if it's a couple with grown up kids.


I think around a 50 foot cat would be better managed by a cruising couple.


I also think Gunboats tend to be too loaded up with "luxury" stuff, AC systems, big diesel gensets etc. They're too complicated for my taste. And too heavy, because of this. And because they're too heavy they need too big a rig and sailplan to get the performance.

[Jim Cate]

I also think Gunboats tend to be too loaded up with "luxury" stuff, AC systems, big diesel gensets etc. They're too complicated for my taste. And too heavy, because of this. And because they're too heavy they need too big a rig and sailplan to get the performance.

I think that this is a pretty perceptive post. Gunboat aimed at a rather rich clientele (who else could afford one?), and as a rule, such folk are not interested in a spartan cruising vessel. So, poor old Gunboat gets stuck between the high performance image and the realities of selling to folks who could stand the price. Fold in a less than successful relationship with a Chinese fabricator, and some highly publicized failures, and BOOM, a failed enterprise.

Too bad, because it is always interesting to be a spectator when very expensive but very innovative boats are sailing around with all the bells and whistles hanging out in the breeze.

Jim