Do American Liveaboards Have To Be State Residents?

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by ebaugh

.....................Have any liveaboards in Florida not in a marina obtained a new or renewal DL? What did it take?

I've lived aboard in florida since 1972 and not used a marina address since 1981. The IRS, Clay Co. Voter's Registrar, Post Office, Driver's License Bureau, Coast Guard Vessel Documentation, Social Security Adm. and US Passport Service all recognize my St. Brendans Isle address. If I ever need to re-establish one of these the documentation of the other seven suffice.

[Madwand]

Originally Posted by Hudson Force

I've lived aboard in florida since 1972 and not used a marina address since 1981. The IRS, Clay Co. Voter's Registrar, Post Office, Driver's License Bureau, Coast Guard Vessel Documentation, Social Security Adm. and US Passport Service all recognize my St. Brendans Isle address. If I ever need to re-establish one of these the documentation of the other seven suffice.

Several people in this thread say your "address" is no longer accepted by Florida. And that was 5 years ago... Do you know different?

[sailorboy1]

When I registered my boat in Florida last year (in the Green Cove Springs office) I used my mother-in-law's address in Orange Park FL. I had NOTHING saying I lived there and the DMV didn't care.

In the end they can't make you get a land house for an address.

[jibstay]

Originally Posted by Madwand

Several people in this thread say your "address" is no longer accepted by Florida. And that was 5 years ago... Do you know different?

I don't understand what "accepted by Florida" means.

We changed our address to SBI 2 years ago and have not had any issues.

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by John A

As with everything else in life, it depends.

If you drop your residency in the T&C do you then become a toursit, unable to either work or own property in the T&C?

I don't know of any state that would issue you a drivers license without a valid address in that state. Upon returning from cruising I found that to prove residency in the state of Washington I had to produce two months worth of two different utility bills to prove that I lived in that state.

Dealing with banks, credit card companies, insurance companies, and verious levels of Government that you are a citizen of, is easier with a US mailing address.

You should be aware that Federal and State tax offices trade data with each other. And with the increased cooperation between foreign countries and the Dept. of Homeland Security nothing is secret anymore.

I had a mailing address in States and officialy was on a vacation.

You have to do this -but the millions of illegals in your 'sanctuary state of Washington do not.

[hellosailor]

Unlike some other states, the state of Florida allows each and every state, county, etc, agency to set their own definitions of "residence". So the Florida DMV will not accept a residency of "Under the Julia Tuttle Causeway" while in fact the federal courts have confirmed that voter registration CAN and MUST in fact accept that as a residency address if someone (the homeless) lives there.

So what "Florida accepts" is, on the state level, whatever a particular agency has decided to use for their own purposes. And it doesn't bind on any other agency or entity in Florida.

FWIW.

In other places, there are different laws. In South Dakota, you can in fact stay at a campground for one night, file an affidavit stating your intent to return eventually and forever, and then become a fully legal SD "resident" for the rest of your life, while roaming all over the planet and never going back there for decades on end. They do that to help out their residents who have decided to live on the road, or the seas. And they've done it on the state level, so it binds on their DMV and all other agencies.

[CarlF]

All US citizens are also citizens of a state -- the country is a republic of states. It's in the Constitution (could be a territory like Guam too). Your state is based on where you are "domiciled". This is also your "legal address" which isn't the same as a mailing address. You can have as many mailing addresses as you want anywhere you want. When you move, you apply to your new state for domicile and are released by your old state. You never get an official "release" from your old state but this is what's happening.

Where this is particularly important is if your old state has a state income tax. Until released, you are required to keep filing a state tax return and may owe taxes no matter where you live - including overseas. Having a mailing address in Florida doesn't exempt you from paying state taxes in New York unless you also become a Florida citizen. And when NY catches up with you, the penalties will have accumulated to an impressive sum.

One solution, as suggested, is to change your domicile to a state like South Dakota which doesn't require you to live there and has no income tax. Another advantage is that you will be able to file an absentee ballot in South Dakota which due to the electoral college "counts" more than a ballot in a populous state like California

[hellosailor]

"All US citizens are also citizens of a state -- the country is a republic of states."
Not quite!
There are 50 states in the Federal Republic of the Untied States of America.
And, one special district (Washington, DC) plus eleven "insular possessions" including Guam and Puerto Rico.
Sometimes residing in one of those other 12 areas (or on foreign soil, aka tribal reservations) also means you have no CongressCritter to vote for, no federal representation, or no "not a state" income taxes as well.
It isn't just the "states" the can get peculiar. Right now, in theory, 97% of Puerto Ricans just voted in favor of applying for statehood. Except, that's 97% of the 20% of eligible voters who actually voted in the vote on this last round, so maybe 15% of Puerto Ricans actually asked for statehood now. (They've voted against it in the past.) Considering the massive debt and bankruptcy issues there, Congress is unlikely to welcome that.
PR has only a non-voting CongressCritter, even though PR's can vote in the US presidential elections. It gets odd out there.

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by Madwand

Several people in this thread say your "address" is no longer accepted by Florida. And that was 5 years ago... Do you know different?

I did renew my Florida drivers license five years ago using my only address (St. Brebdan's). I'm due to renew again in 2020, but I don't expect problem. 'we'll see.

[Madwand]

Ok, please update.

[hellosailor]

It might have been five years ago, that Florida changed their licenses. They had at least three license types: Snowbird license (good only in FL state, issued to snowbirds who kept their primary license elsewhere), plain state DL, and RealID conformant state license. The first two were dropped and all the requirements for ID were raised to meet the RealID (DHS) requirements, resulting in huge crowds and nooze stories because folks weren't reading the new requirements and were being sent home. A lot of unhappy campers.
But like most states, FL has their current requirements on line.

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by Madwand

Ok, please update.

Florida's online driver's license site for "proof of residence" requires the submission of any two proofs from a list of twenty. Some that can be easily provided by a liveaboard boater are:

-Florida voter registration card
-Florida vehicle registration or title
-Florida boat registration or title if living aboard
-medical or health card with address listed
-current auto insurance policy or bill
-W2 or 1099 tax form
-Mail from financial institutions
-Mail from federal, state, county or city government agencies

I have all eight of these with my St. Brendan's address and I only need to present two.

Sure, it's easier to establish residency in Florida if you are an actual Florida resident, but items on this list above can be established without a fixed shore home.

[hellosailor]

Apparently Florida learned from their last (2010) fiasco, their list on the go-get-etc. web site actually is a very comprehensive list of things you must, or can, submit, and it includes things like a sexual offender registration card, or the boat registration, which most states never mention. Oddly enough they still want a Social Security card, and those used to have a very prominent line printed in them that said NOT TO BE USED FOR IDENTIFICATION PURPOSES. These days sometimes the SSA folks actually just give you a page from a plain laser printer when they're out of real cards. Very secure way to "proving" a SS number.(sigh)

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

..................................
.......................... Oddly enough they still want a Social Security card, and those used to have a very prominent line printed in them that said NOT TO BE USED FOR IDENTIFICATION PURPOSES. .................

When reading the requirements for receipt of a driver's licence from the State of Florida you will see that they do not actually require the presentation of a Social Security Card. What they ask for is the proof of a Social Security number. They list that this can be with the use of the Social Security Card OR a W2 tax form, a 1099 tax form or a pay check.

All this is easy to find and easy to understand if you actually read all the information.

[denverd0n]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

PR has only a non-voting CongressCritter, even though PR's can vote in the US presidential elections. It gets odd out there.

Oh, it gets even weirder than that. The Congressional representative from Puerto Rico actually does get to cast a ballot. And that ballot gets counted. But if that ballot would alter the results then that ballot is annulled. So the net result is that the ballot doesn't count, even though it does get counted.

Could that be any stupider, or more confusing?

(Note, this is how it was explained to me by a friend, who worked as an intern for the congressional representative from Puerto Rico, back in the 1970s. Things may have changed since then.)