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**skipmac** · 16-12-2017, 11:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

I'm sure the guys who own 9 foot drafts will defend their boats even if they have roller skates bolted on the bottom of their keels. Deep keels are for blue water crossings and inexperienced naval architects... but they are great to have out at sea in a blow... or doing a TransAtlantic crossing... Gunk-holing in the Bahamas? not so much...

I'm sure the guys who own 4 1/2 drafts will defend their boats just as much.

I have cruised the Bahamas for years in boats with drafts under 4' and over 6'. Never had a problem with any of them. Sure under 4' draft I could sneak into holes where few could enter. I could take shortcuts others could not. But with over 6' there were very few places that I had to avoid altogether.

Sometimes I did have to anchor a little farther out but never got t-boned and usually managed to find a spot that was just as calm as the rest of the boats in the harbor and got to the dock just as dry as the next guy, just a minute or so longer dinghy ride. As a secondary benefit, anchoring a little farther out I often had fewer noseeums and mosquitoes come to visit than the guys close in.

The big difference, the deeper draft boats sailed a LOT better and good sailing is not just for ocean crossing. And for inexperienced naval architects???? I'm not really sure what you even mean by that but I think there are a few very experienced naval architects that might take issue with that claim.

sailingfarmer · 16-12-2017, 13:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by skipmac

I'm sure the guys who own 4 1/2 drafts will defend their boats just as much.

I have cruised the Bahamas for years in boats with drafts under 4' and over 6'. Never had a problem with any of them. Sure under 4' draft I could sneak into holes where few could enter. I could take shortcuts others could not. But with over 6' there were very few places that I had to avoid altogether.

Sometimes I did have to anchor a little farther out but never got t-boned and usually managed to find a spot that was just as calm as the rest of the boats in the harbor and got to the dock just as dry as the next guy, just a minute or so longer dinghy ride. As a secondary benefit, anchoring a little farther out I often had fewer noseeums and mosquitoes come to visit than the guys close in.

The big difference, the deeper draft boats sailed a LOT better and good sailing is not just for ocean crossing. And for inexperienced naval architects???? I'm not really sure what you even mean by that but I think there are a few very experienced naval architects that might take issue with that claim.

OK.... you must have a deep keel... Here's the reason I vote for shallow draft boats in the Bahamas (Florida Keys too) 1. Check the resale market. They are more in demand (Hard to sell a 6 foot draft in south Florida). 2. If you look at the top new production 40 plus foot cruising boats now like Caliber, Little Harbor, etc. ALL ARE SHALLOW DRAFT @ 5 ft. They are NOT designed like the old J Boats like you may be used to.... 3. Try to sail in the Abacos with a 6 foot keel at low tide. Try to sail in the Exumas, one of the best cruising grounds in the world. Most cruisers will be pitying you but they will respect you for your tenacity. 4. Boat yards may charge you more for extended stanchions when hauling out. 5. Lots of docks in the Bahamas may not be able to handle you except at the T or outer slips. 6. There are passes to the ocean you may have to wait until high tide and you must stay in the middle of the channel or else.

That's just off the top of my head... but yes the longer keels tend to point better... BUT how many cruisers tack into the wind these days for extended lengths of time? Also a short keel boat wil run downwind faster and do a better broad reach. You may be able to steal one on the market since nobody wants one unless they live up north.

billknny · 16-12-2017, 13:44

I think what you will find is a lot of people like me with a 6'7" draft who had a grand time in the Bahamas, and lot of other people with drafts on the shallow side of 5 feet who will tell you that a deep draft is impossible in the Bahamas.

Can you go everywhere? Of course not. But there are more places you CAN go than you will have time to visit.

Of course if you were buying a boat to sail ONLY in the Bahamas, then a shallow draft boat only makes sense, but if you have world traveling dreams, a 6 foot draft will be fine.

sailingfarmer · 16-12-2017, 13:54

Deep draft sailboats in the Bahamas are popular only with people who own them... they don't know what they are missing. Better have a good dry dinghy with a 15hp motor... I have sailed with 6 foot drafts and would do it again if I was sailing in the Leeward or Windward Islands or in the Med. Bahamas, Florida? No.

With a 6-6.7 draft you will miss some of the best places in the Bahamas... the dinghy will be your mode of transport not the boat which can be dangerous.

Vasco · 16-12-2017, 14:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

.. If you are not relaxing... but worried about being anchored out too far for protection and hoping your anchor holds and getting soaking wet getting ashore in your dinghy and hopefully not getting t-boned by a drunken fisherman at night... you may start dreaming about a 5 foot draft...

First to the OP. Buy the boat you like the best and don't let another 6 inches of draft deter you. One buddy of mine that sailed the Bahamas for 16 consecutive seasons had a draft of 7' 6". As for the above statement re being out too far for protection, this is ridiculous. And how far out you anchor has little to do with your anchor holding. If it blows it blows, a hundred yards further out will not change sea condition drastically. In most places where you anchor in the Bahamas there will be very little difference between finding a spot for a 5 foot draft and one for a 6'6" draft. Now 3 or 4 foot draft (cat country)will take you where many monos don't go.

**skipmac** · 16-12-2017, 14:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

OK.... you must have a deep keel....

Current boat factory spec for draft is 5'2" although loaded for cruising I figure at least 2" more then add another 2" for luck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

1. Check the resale market. They are more in demand (Hard to sell a 6 foot draft in south Florida).

Used to be a yacht broker in Ft Lauderdale and had no problem selling 6' draft boats. Once it got to 7' it was a problem, at least in the size boats I dealt with, usually 35-45'

2. If you look at the top new production 40 plus foot cruising boats now like Caliber, Little Harbor, etc. ALL ARE SHALLOW DRAFT @ 5 ft. They are NOT designed like the old J Boats like you may be used to....

Certainly some brands may focus on shallower draft but to make a blanket claim that ALL new boats are shallow draft is 100% incorrect.
By the way, never sailed a J-Boat.

3. Try to sail in the Abacos with a 6 foot keel at low tide. Try to sail in the Exumas, one of the best cruising grounds in the world. Most cruisers will be pitying you but they will respect you for your tenacity.

Cruised both with 6' draft and lived to tell about it.
Didn't attract nor feel the need for any pity. I quite a great time.

4. Boat yards may charge you more for extended stanchions when hauling out.

Never happened to me in 40 years. I had one boat with a 9' draft and paid the same per ft as any other boat in the yard. Yard I'm in now has no surcharge for deep draft. I bought some jackstands the difference in price between tall and short ones is minimal, like $20-$40 or so.

5. Lots of docks in the Bahamas may not be able to handle you except at the T or outer slips.

I would say some of the docks in the Bahamas.

6. There are passes to the ocean you may have to wait until high tide and you must stay in the middle of the channel or else.

All depends on the boat and the channel. I've waited out the tide in a boat with 3'6" draft but I was going for a very shallow channel.

That's just off the top of my head... but yes the longer keels tend to point better...I think you mean deeper keels? BUT how many cruisers tack into the wind these days for extended lengths of time? Also a short keel boat wil run downwind faster and do a better broad reach. You may be able to steal one on the market since nobody wants one unless they live up north.

Not a single post I have seen on this thread has denied that shallow draft does offer some advantages and opens up more gunkholing, closer anchoring, shortcuts across the banks and other places, hidden harbors and more. However the bottom line, a deep draft does not kill cruising in the Bahamas. Doesn't make it impossible, fearful, dangerous, unpleasant or pitiable. No matter what boat and what draft you have you plan your trip around your limits and it is absolutely easy to plan around a 6' or more draft and see 99% of the Bahamas. Been there, done that.

sailingfarmer · 16-12-2017, 14:27

OK... some people have never spent a night on the hook outside of Hopetown when a Northern Front is blowing while if they had a foot or so less draft could be snug in the harbor of Hopetown...same with Marsh Harbour... don't even try it in the Exumas

sailingfarmer · 16-12-2017, 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by skipmac

Current boat factory spec for draft is 5'2" although loaded for cruising I figure at least 2" more then add another 2" for luck.

Not a single post I have seen on this thread has denied that shallow draft does offer some advantages and opens up more gunkholing, closer anchoring, shortcuts across the banks and other places, hidden harbors and more. However the bottom line, a deep draft does not kill cruising in the Bahamas. Doesn't make it impossible, fearful, dangerous, unpleasant or pitiable. No matter what boat and what draft you have you plan your trip around your limits and it is absolutely easy to plan around a 6' or more draft and see 99% of the Bahamas. Been there, done that.

The original post was from a guy looking to buy a boat for sailing in the Bahamas.... in a room of 100 seasoned cruisers... let's face it ... the preponderance of opinions would say shallow draft if you can buy a good one with all things being equal.

**skipmac** · 16-12-2017, 15:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

The original post was from a guy looking to buy a boat for sailing in the Bahamas.... in a room of 100 seasoned cruisers... let's face it ... the preponderance of opinions would say shallow draft if you can buy a good one with all things being equal.

Did a quick scan of this thread and found nine different posters that said deep draft was just fine or at least doable. Three posters that said shallow draft only and two that were ambiguous.

Doesn't sound like a preponderance to me at least on this thread of seasoned cruisers.

**skipmac** · 16-12-2017, 15:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

OK... some people have never spent a night on the hook outside of Hopetown when a Northern Front is blowing while if they had a foot or so less draft could be snug in the harbor of Hopetown...same with Marsh Harbour... don't even try it in the Exumas

Spending the night on the hook outside Hopetown sounds like a problem of poor planning instead of draft.

And I cruised the Exumas and Abacos and Turks and Caicos with 6' draft. 6' was not a problem. Very few places I couldn't go and didn't even worry about the tides.

Vasco · 16-12-2017, 16:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfarmer

OK... some people have never spent a night on the hook outside of Hopetown when a Northern Front is blowing while if they had a foot or so less draft could be snug in the harbor of Hopetown...same with Marsh Harbour... don't even try it in the Exumas

Lots of places to shelter in a front in that area. As for Hopetown when was the last time you anchored there? There's no room for anchoring, all mooring balls. Holding in Marsh Harbour is not the best and much too crowded. As for the Exumas, lots more water there than Abaco.

As for fronts you can ride them out in many anchorages where the fetch from the west is not that great, you can hide in holes, or you can change anchorages as the wind clocks.

Navicula · 16-12-2017, 16:38

traveled to the jumentos with a another boat with a 6.6 draft ...they had no issues and had a great time.....met dutch crew in a the exumas with a 7 foot draft dufore enjoying themselfs ,,,,,,both crews never complained about there draft,,,,,,good people buying what they want and going where they want

Boatguy30 · 16-12-2017, 16:47

What the hell does a farmer know about the Bahamas anyway?

**Jim Cate** · 16-12-2017, 16:55

The resale issue may be real even if the actual cruising may not be impeded. Can't speak for Florida markets, but when we were trying to sell our previous boat with her 2.2 m (7'2") draft in teh Moreton Bay area in Queensland, lots of prospective buyers told us that they were unwilling to consider a boat of that depth "because you just can't sail it in Moreton Bay". We kept pointing out that we had been successfully doing so for a decade but it didn't seem to penetrate... maybe they were farmers too!

But she eventually sold, and is still plying those waters. And when in the area, we do too, in our newer boat, also with 2.2 m draft. It feels so good to do the impossible!

Jim