General Info: Gel Coat Blisters Above the Water Line

[Dragon Lady]

Sorry I'm going a bit too deep with the science.
The fact is that water molecules are so small that it is impossible to stop some of them getting through any barrier.
Osmosis in not a problem in it's self as the water molecules can pass through or back out of the laminates with no significant reactions taking place.
The real problem is hydrolysis which is when the water molecules break down styrene molecules and bond with them which forms a larger molecule.
These larger molecules become trapped and form blisters which are incorrectly referred to as osmosis.
In fact some barrier coatings make the problem worse.
So yes it is not seen as a problem in most boats because none of us will live long enough to see it happen.

[Oliver66]

well...
osmosis troubleare long stories .
I know 2 friend in my harbour that both had their boat new:
One benet' First 29 from 85 never had any trouble with osmosis.
a second Benet' First 35S5 from 93 and this one had big osmosis trouble 3 years ago.
They use exactly same anti-fooling paint and berthing about 50m from each other, and sailing regatta together.

For my Lipari all is OK...
nearly 2500 nm and 300h on each D1-30 engine.
only 2 problems that had to be done under guaranty:
few water entering from one escape hatch in rough sea.
bathroom hatch had to be re-sealed few cause water was also entering

nothing else since may 2011.

EDIT: my English writing 's gone...lots of faults !!

[Dragon Lady]

That's good news Oliver, I think nearly all new boats have some teething problems.
When I was picking my boat up in the Caribbean some people were reporting auto pilot failures on their new boats crossing the Atlantic.
Others were telling me that the quality of the equipment on the new boats were not as good as my model.
It's interesting to hear about the Beneteaus.

[Oliver66]

To stay in FP:
here in my harbour canet:

1 Tobago: no osmosis trouble
2 Lavezzi: only for one but little
1 Orana: little
1 eleuthera doing charter ( carribean in winter/ Med in summer ) Big trouble on osmosis
2 Salina: no osmosis trouble
and my Lipari no trouble.

there is also 2 power cat higland and cumberland but I don't know for them.

[Le Doume]

Originally Posted by Oliver66

well...
osmosis troubleare long stories .
I know 2 friend in my harbour that both had their boat new:
One benet' First 29 from 85 never had any trouble with osmosis.
a second Benet' First 35S5 from 93 and this one had big osmosis trouble 3 years ago.
They use exactly same anti-fooling paint and berthing about 50m from each other, and sailing regatta together.

For my Lipari all is OK...
nearly 2500 nm and 300h on each D1-30 engine.
only 2 problems that had to be done under guaranty:
few water entering from one escape hatch in rough sea.
bathroom hatch had to be re-sealed few cause water was also entering

nothing else since may 2011.




EDIT: my English writing 's gone...lots of faults !!

Hello Oliver

Nice part of the world you live in and your english is very good. I am an " expat" originally from Antibes now living on the gold coast in Queensland Australia. I own a 2007 Lavezzi . I am planning to be in " Les Sables " in november for the start of the Vendee Globe . How was your summer this year
Happy sailing

[Lucky]

Hi all,
What suprises me is that there are claims that the FP's line of boats are made with polyester resin. The Belize 43 should according to FP documentation be made with vinylester. I do not have any blisters on my boat and know of two Mahe's here in Norway and Sweden that is doing just fine. Could be luck or climate?

When it comes to problems in rough weather I have never experienced any problems part from a small leak in the port deck hatch in the forward cabin. The seas where rough and the wind 15 to 20 m/s. I looked at it when I came to port and it looks like the gasket would need replacement, it's been there for 11 years!

The only problems I have seen and other FP owners is hairline cracking several places in the cocpit sole. This was there when I bought the boat 5 years ago and has not worsened. One of the Mahe's got a Tekdek coverd by worranty and he was happy with that. It took time though to get the agreement. In that matter I would agree that warranty and after market service from FP needs a lot more attention to be up to scratch.

Happy lead free sailin
Lucky

[Dragon Lady]

Hi Lucky,
Yes I believe you are right about the climate and also luck.
The hydrolysis reaction is supposed to be worse in higher temps, so keeping the boat in a cooler climate will help.
There does also seem to be an element of luck as some boats are fine and others of the same model and vintage are not.

[DtM]

A lot of boats in Europe (or at least France to my knowledge) come out of the water in the winter as well. That is likely to keep the hull dry.

[Oliver66]

Hi DTM,

well not here in Med cause we can navigate all year long even if in winter ( Nov to March ) it is not really fun.

all the 8 FP that are here in Canet comes out of water a couple of week during springtime only for antifouling and engine maintenance.

probably temperature of water and air is an important factor.

[AussieWayne]

Originally Posted by Lucky

Hi all,
The Belize 43 should according to FP documentation be made with vinylester.
Happy lead free sailin
Lucky

Hey Lucky do you have a link to that documentation from FP, I would like to read it?
Are all models in the FP range vinylester?
Kind regards
Wayne

[Seastream]

Both our broker and surveyor forewarned us about this when we were looking at our 2008 Mahe in Tortola in June this year. The boat had a five year warranty, else we wouldn't have bought it. We left the boat in Tortola to have the work done. FP is slow in responding and often requires repeat emails/callbacks but does eventually respond. My broker did all the legwork in that area. We'll be happy when we finally get the boat up to New England!

[Dragon Lady]

Originally Posted by Seastream

Both our broker and surveyor forewarned us about this when we were looking at our 2008 Mahe in Tortola in June this year. The boat had a five year warranty, else we wouldn't have bought it. We left the boat in Tortola to have the work done. FP is slow in responding and often requires repeat emails/callbacks but does eventually respond. My broker did all the legwork in that area. We'll be happy when we finally get the boat up to New England!

Hi Seastream,

I'm sorry to tell you but your boat will not be covered by the factory warranty as they do not cover after the first owner.
They also do not cover blistering above the water line, go figure!
I know it sucks but I have this info first hand from FP.
You are lucky to get responses from them as FP has terrible customer support from the factory.
They seem to think ignoring problems will make them go away.
Good luck with your Mahe, does it have blistering?

[Dragon Lady]

Originally Posted by AussieWayne

Hey Lucky do you have a link to that documentation from FP, I would like to read it?
Are all models in the FP range vinylester?
Kind regards
Wayne

Hi Wayne,

I don't think any FPs have vinylester resin, it would have been nice if they did because it is unlikely that this thread would exist if that was the case.

[DtM]

I often wonder why you keep this thread alive David. You have had all the answers you will get from FP. Do any of us like their responses or lack of them? No, but we get on with life. Your whinge was justified but you have had it so move on for the sake of all FP owners.

[minaret]

Originally Posted by DtM

I often wonder why you keep this thread alive David. You have had all the answers you will get from FP. Do any of us like their responses or lack of them? No, but we get on with life. Your whinge was justified but you have had it so move on for the sake of all FP owners.

How about also considering those who are shopping and looking at an FP, aren't they just as important as those who have bought one? Shouldn't they be informed about the truth, even if the dissemination of that truth hurts your bottom line?