Gender roles in sailing and cruising

[alaskaflyfish]

Originally Posted by atmartin

Get over the "soy feminizes men" nonsense. The data on that is scant at best. Somehow Asian men have managed to procreate and maintain male-dominated societies, despite thousands of years of soy consumption. Do you figure the CIA is seeding the clouds with mind-control chemicals, too?

If you're so worried about your hormone levels: stop drinking beer. Alcohol and Hops are certainly more harmful to male hormones than soy. Oh, and don't work with epoxy and other plastics. BPAs and all that.

My mom is going through a health/workout phase and admonished me for drinking soy milk because "it will give you boobs". I laughed and told her, "Ok, but so will all the beer I drink, the chemicals I inhale at work and the boat I live in (epoxy tanks)". If it ain't one thing, it's the other.

You have jumped to so many conclusions based on nothing more than irrational emotion. Take some time out and breathe. Then go back and re read your post, and try in the future to not make the same mistake. You should always listen to your mother, no excuses.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

You have jumped to so many conclusions based on nothing more than irrational emotion. Take some time out and breathe. Then go back and re read your post, and try in the future to not make the same mistake. You should always listen to your mother, no excuses.

You responded to nonsense!

[atmartin]

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

You have jumped to so many conclusions based on nothing more than irrational emotion.

Wrong. I realize you're simply trolling at this point, but I'll humor you.

There are scientific studies looking into effects of soy, hops, phytoestrogens, alcohol and BPAs. No, I didn't cite them, but that's where my information is coming from, not simply my "gut instinct".

Would you care to present the minutes from the latest meeting of the Feminist Cabal where they discuss their strategy for world dominance? Where's your evidence?

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

You should always listen to your mother, no excuses.

Wouldn't that be an example of the kind of matriarchal dominance you're trying to avoid?

The kind of rhetoric you're using is steeped in appeal to emotion and outrage, but go ahead and keep projecting.

[alaskaflyfish]

Originally Posted by atmartin

Wrong. I realize you're simply trolling at this point, but I'll humor you.

There are scientific studies looking into effects of soy, hops, phytoestrogens, alcohol and BPAs. No, I didn't cite them, but that's where my information is coming from, not simply my "gut instinct".

Would you care to present the minutes from the latest meeting of the Feminist Cabal where they discuss their strategy for world dominance? Where's your evidence?



Wouldn't that be an example of the kind of matriarchal dominance you're trying to avoid?

The kind of rhetoric you're using is steeped in appeal to emotion and outrage, but go ahead and keep projecting.

Remain calm, stay focused. This thread is about gender roles in sailing.
I remember when the tobacco industry fostered studies and scientific reports citing conclusively that tobacco did not cause lung cancer. So the point is; you will never get the truth from an industry that pays for a scientific report that uses the very same product. Fox guarding the hen house, as it were. And to your last point, mothers always want the best for their little boys and are very familiar with the cunningness of their gender. Thats why its the mother who will be the first to say to her son "stay away from that girl".

[lordgeoff]

That is a relief.
I think I can identify as an Alpa....😂

[lordgeoff]

Originally Posted by ranger42c

Lots of folks buy a boat and then get coupled up later. Or couples buy a boat and the title ends up in one name only, for various reasons. Sometimes (often?) without regard to who plays what role.

In that particular case... if the boat was just titled in his name only, I expect they were just mindful that some governments require that kind of "who's allowed to be legally in charge" documentation.

That doesn't speak to your larger question, but your admiration for that particular couple can likely remain intact.



-Chris

I thought most boats were purchased in the name of an LLC....?
For many reasons.

[alaskaflyfish]

The funny thing is (as I walk out the door to go sailing), I remind my wife that the marina fees are due today and the boat will soon need a bottom job. I was very quickly reminded that "its your boat so you pay for it, and it better not affect our vacation fund." So there you have it, when it comes time to pay and take responsibility it solely becomes MY boat. I just smile.

[atmartin]

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

Remain calm, stay focused. This thread is about gender roles in sailing.

Nice deflection. It was about gender roles and sailing. A whole new sideline of ideology and personal attack was opened up with this post:

Originally Posted by alaskaflyfish

Beta males a.k.a...Nu-male or soyboy, are males who are gender confused (since there are 30+ forms of gender identity now) and who confuse fact with emotion. Emotional awareness is the primary focus in their ideology hence their willingness to lay down and be dominated by a strong masculine female. Facts and reality are meaningless. The appearance of fairness greatly outweighs the quality of competence. Thus, a strong masculine female presence in a traditional male role is celebrated whereas a hetero-normative male in the same role is considered toxic. Male self-hate is also of tremendous importance to further their ideology. I hope that clears things up,,,cheers.

If anybody's upset, it might be you. But since I can't possibly know your intent, I've confined my responses to the content of your posts, not your emotional state.

Coincidentally, I've also got some sailing to do this afternoon, so fair winds. I'm out.

[lordgeoff]

I have read your post 3 times....
My confusion compounds on each read.
BTW there are 2 genders.....
🙄

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by lordgeoff

That is a relief.
I think I can identify as an Alpa....😂

I often identify as an alpaca. Does that help?

[belizesailor]

There are at least as many variations in couples working relationships and legal arrangments afloat as there are ashore. And a resulting multitude of combined reasons for how ownership of a boat or other asset is structured.

Reading some sort of sexist scheme into the OP's referenced book is likely much huff about nothing...probably more reflective of the OPs views of the world than anything else.

So, whats the title of the book? Someone on here likley knows them and can comment specifically.

[AKA-None]

My personal opinion is the the role of captain just needs to be clearly defined so that in a situation where something needs to be addressed right now there is no confusion. Who that person is or what gender they are makes no difference as far as I am concerned. Neither does the question of who’s boat is it.

Just figure out before you start who that person is. I also think it’s best not to swap that role so there is no thinking of who’s turn is it.

Ymmv

[Mike OReilly]

A few of you have commented about the need for a single Captain. This is due to the necessity of having a single voice when an urgent decision is to be made. I agree. In our case, this person is whom ever is on the helm. We purposely alternate between the two of us between helm and deck duties (our terms). This has worked perfectly for us so far.

But I’m curious … what are all these urgent events? I’ve not sailed or cruised as far as many here, but perhaps further than most. We’ve cruised as a couple for approaching two decades now, through some fairly interesting northern waters. I can’t currently recall more than a few urgent events which required one of these split-second “Captain’s decision.” The vast, vast majority of our decisions are made jointly.

So I’m curious … what are all these events you folks are getting into?

[GrowleyMonster]

Old fashioned male chauvinism is a valid philosophy. Radical feminism is a valid philosophy. Everything in between is valid philosophy. Do it like you feel it, as a couple or as a single, and don't bother apologizing for it. No need to beat anyone else over the head with it, just live your life and be proud and content within it, and all is right in the world. We think like we think, and we can't help the way we think. Others need to simply get over it and learn to accept the fact that we are all different.



FWIW, when me and my GF are on HER boat, I am STILL the captain, but only out of deference to her relative lack of skills, experience, and aptitude. She is learning, slowly, and I actually look forward to the day when she is able to captain her own boat with no guidance from me.


The first time we actually do an ocean passage together, she will have learned enough to be in charge of her watch. Snap decisions on her watch will of course be her perogative and responsibility, to the extent she is comfortable. I don't have a problem with letting my ego take the back seat when this is logical. Not saying that this is the way everyone should do it, only that this is the way we will do it.

[john61ct]

There are plenty of precious possessions I let **no one** risk damaging, I must at least be supervising until their skill level and care attitude are proven.

Just spending more time together, even being sex partners, or being in love, or cohabiting, none of these things change my level of trust wrt those possessions.

Now some people may **think** there is one single one-size-fits-all definition of the legal / financial institution of Marriage.

But in fact, each couple / grouping are free to define it as they please, and that's not anyone else's business, as long as there isn't deception or coercion involved.