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Old 15-06-2018, 18:08   #31
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

Interesting stuff, BB, and thanks for posting. I'm wondering how Prop Speed and its imitators works, considering your experience. We've been able to remove the few barnies that we have found on our prop by a simple gloved-hand wipe. Maybe the PS is significantly thicker than the product you were testing...

Eventually someone will get the combination right, and we will become bottom wipers instead of bottom painters!

Jim
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Old 15-06-2018, 18:47   #32
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBeakie View Post
FWIW, I'll relate our experience with a UK developed foul release product that we had high hopes for. You can see several of their Youtube promotional clips. It does not purport to prevent growth, it purports that all types of growth can be just wiped off. This claim is misleading, and here's why.

We worked with the Australian distributor in trials for over 6 months on several test plates that were hung in a variety of different waters on the east coast of Australia. Places that were notorious for growth.

Slime just wiped off, no matter how thick it became, leaving the surface as clean as new. I was getting excited.

Coral worm wiped off, leaving only a very slight change in the surface, I would rate it good as new. I was almost convinced.

It failed with barnacles !!

When barnacle larvae grow, they start forming their shell as a thin ring at the base. This ring then grows up in a cone, getting thicker and stronger, extremely quickly. As it grows bigger than about your little finger nail, say 0.5 to 1 cm, the bottom edge of the shell cuts through the (relatively soft) coating right to the hull surface substrate. Then it sticks like crazy, as well as carves out a ring of the foul release coating which falls away leaving an unprotected spot.

Lots of work was attempted to emedy this as I understand it, but to no avail.

The Australian distributor pulled the plug, much to his credit, rather than promote a product that ultimately would fail.

IF you sail only in non-barnacle waters ( is there such a place?) and/or IF you are hyper diligent to wipe the hull every single week, without fail, then this might work for you.

We wanted to cruise in the Kimberly, so looking over my shoulder for crocs while rubbing the hulls on a 50 foot cat, didn't seem like a prudent solution to us.

We think we're going CopperCoat, which only needs a burnish with a scrubber pad maybe twice a year, when in warm, clear and safe waters.

I genuinely am disappointed it didn't work out for the foul release, and hope somebody cracks it one day. But you must test in heavy barnacle growth areas, IMHO.
Thanks for your feedback. Great to have an objective appraisal on that particular brew, which I suspect was a just PDMS acrylic copolymer one I think it is.
Seems to me even with the newer FR's (Modified PDMS, PEG) that the boat has to remain in motion
with a minimum of 3knt to make it difficult for barnacle settlement in the juvenile phase.
PTFE is physically harder but heating to 400į on application, is not practical.
Perhaps the problem is better approached by manufacturing a more durable
nonpolar film and then adhering it to the hull. as in graphic film.
Could be made thicker that way; although I think the inherent "toughness"
is an issue that has yet to be resolved.
There is a Co doing it here and the guy running the travel lift at Tauranga
has had it done. Must check the result. Bearing in mind this i think is just
a PDMS film. Early days, keeping my fingers crossed.

Some light reading for you.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full...897?src=recsys
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Old 21-09-2018, 08:00   #33
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

I currently have a test panel of SeaCoat in the water in West Palm Beach Florida.

I'll let you know in a month or two.
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Old 21-09-2018, 08:16   #34
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

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Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
We are going to test a new kind of antifouling! Itís a silicone-based antifouling from Hempel. Itís not SilicOne but a two component new kind. Itís especially designed to be suitable for cruising/anchoring in warm sea water and a lot of prolonged anchoring and sailing at relatively low speeds (so perfect for a sailboat).

I just ordered SilicOne yesterday to use on our aluminum boat. Maybe I'll have to contact Hempel directly and see if they'll let me do a test too. I don't want to spend the time applying the SilicOne and have a better product available shortly after.

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Old 19-10-2018, 11:38   #35
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

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Lots of folks explaining why this wont work... hey, guys, this is a TEST, one to help see IF it will work in a yottie environment. I for one am quite interested in the outcome, and applaud both Hemple and the OP for getting on with it. One hopes for an unbiased review, and that the experiment is monitored well for interim reports.

Keep on truckin' Ilona!

Jim
For me Silicone didn't work. After 5 months in the water silione comes loose from the hull as you can see in the picture. And the autorelease didn't work unless I went into the water to remove the growth. Until today i didn't got an explanation from HEMPEL
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Old 19-10-2018, 11:54   #36
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

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For me Silicone didn't work. After 5 months in the water silione comes loose from the hull as you can see in the picture. And the autorelease didn't work unless I went into the water to remove the growth. Until today i didn't got an explanation from HEMPEL
Was this Silic One? If so, did you use their tie coat and primer? How far did it flake off (just the Silic one or did the tie coat flake off too)?

Thanks for posting,

Matt
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Old 19-10-2018, 12:28   #37
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

Willroy-
"Until today i didn't got an explanation from HEMPEL"
Does that mean you didn't get a response until just now, today? And that you're not sharing that response with us?

Or do you mean that *as*of*today* you still haven't gotten a response?
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Old 20-10-2018, 00:28   #38
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Willroy-
"Until today i didn't got an explanation from HEMPEL"
Does that mean you didn't get a response until just now, today? And that you're not sharing that response with us?

Or do you mean that *as*of*today* you still haven't gotten a response?
Yes "as of today" is what i mean. As soon as i have an explanation i will share it of course
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Old 12-02-2019, 15:53   #39
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

Hi Ilona, do you have any feed back, I am busting to hear good news but also bad news if that's what it is.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
We are going to test a new kind of antifouling! Itís a silicone-based antifouling from Hempel. Itís not SilicOne but a two component new kind. Itís especially designed to be suitable for cruising/anchoring in warm sea water and a lot of prolonged anchoring and sailing at relatively low speeds (so perfect for a sailboat). Itís supposed to keep the boat clean up to 4 months of at anchor in these warm waters (in cool waters probably much longer)! And itís supposed to last at least 5-7 years before you have to reapply a new layer! Does this sound fantastic or too good to be true?

Weíre very exited to find out whether or not this will work like they say it does. Itís being used on professional big vessels but not really yet on yachts. The manufacturer wants to expand to yachts as well and weíre going to test it and report our findings.

Iím very happy that this is something (relatively) environmentally friendly. If it lasts 5-7 years, this saves quite a volume of regular antifouling. + they claim it stays on the boat, doesnít erode during sailing/cleaning like regular antifoulings do. So no harmful particles in the ocean. Only when you would remove it (by hot pressure wash), the product comes off but if itís true that you donít loose anything during sailing/cleaning, this would mean it will be much healthier for our oceans and coral reefs.

Itís quite a big deal to apply because all the current antifouling needs to be removed up to the gel coat. At the moment weíre working on this. On our GRP sailing vessel itís relatively easy because there was no thick layer (it all eroded into the ocean :-( ) and sanding works pretty well. Still, itís not a fun job and itís hot and dusty (even though we use a big vacuum cleaner on the rotor sanding tool). At the time of writing, the job is almost finished (yeeeeeah).

Some time ago Iíve posted a thread about silicone based antifouling because I was very curious to find out how people like it, what their experiences are. It seemed there is a lot of interest from others but there was not much information to find from people using it in the field. Since itís such a big thing to apply it, itís expensive, labour intensive and quite a big deal to have silicone on your boat, we were actually not keen on just trying it out ourselves. But when I emailed Hempel, and told them what we were going to do (long time cruising in tropical waters with long periods of time at anchor), they came up with this product which in fact seems to be much more promising than SilicOne. They were interested for us to test it so they have a sailing vessel in the most difficult circumstances to see how their product works in this situation and if weíre happy, they have free publicity in return.

So, there we go. I have nothing to report yet, since weíre still sanding but this is almost done and then weíre going to apply it. Let me know whether you guys are interested in the process and our findings.

Back to sanding and wishing weíd have a smaller boat ;-),
Ilona
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Old 12-02-2019, 16:16   #40
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Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

The dictate that the hull had to be taken down to the gelcoat is concerning. I for one would not want to remove the eight coats of barrier coat that is protecting my hull.

Also, if this is anything like PropSpeed then it is relatively fragile and not at all resistant to any real abrasion. If you anchor in conditions where wind is against current your rode would likely chew up the coating pretty good.

If the material cost can be extrapolated from PropSpeed material cost then itís going to be very high.
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Old 12-02-2019, 18:25   #41
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

I think you replace it with 3 base coats.

It would depend on the performance of the product. Quite happy to work hard today if it saves me 3 or 4 times the work in years to come.

I'm a bit worried usually in cases like this no news = bad news but we will find out hopefully.
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Old 13-02-2019, 11:48   #42
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

Ilona,

It's been about 8 months since you posted re your trial of a new Hempel silicone based product.

How is it going?

Does it prevent attachment of barnacles?

Very keen to hear your assesment.


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Old 14-02-2019, 12:06   #43
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Re: Test new kind of antifouling, silicone based

Don't know whether this has been discussed.
By definition these non-polar products have a serious downfall.
How do you overcoat when the object is a completely non polar
chemistry finished product.

That where a removeable premanufactured film concept has advantages.
The current one the barnacle rim cuts through the film if left to mature and is not slippery enough yet.
You need a heat gun to remove film.
Early days hopefully.
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